Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Antique clock - who pays for it?

28 replies

WyclefJohn · 04/04/2018 10:38

We recently bought an antique clock from an antiques specialist - the clock does not work (it stops after about an hour of running). We took it back to the dealer, who confirmed it doesn't work, and will send it to a specialist. They have asked if we are happy to pay the costs for this.

However, when we bought the clock, we thought we were paying for a working clock in good condition. There was no indication there was a problem, and we paid a good price (not 10 quid at a car boot sale).

What's the fair way to cover the costs - 50/50? 100% the dealer? 100% us?

OP posts:
SneakyGremlins · 04/04/2018 10:42

The dealer, surely? Hmm

SootyandMathew · 04/04/2018 10:42

Unless it was sold as seen I would assume them. Was there any indication it wasn't working?

Original poster
WyclefJohn · 04/04/2018 10:45

Absolutely no indication at all - it was sold, at least, orally, as in good working condition.

OP posts:
UpstartCrow · 04/04/2018 10:47

Ask for a refund.

Trinity66 · 04/04/2018 10:48

hhhmmm I would assume antiques would be sold as is and that you'd have to ask if it works rather than be told that it doesn't? That would have just been my assumption btw, I don't know for sure!

abigailsnan · 04/04/2018 10:51

Repairs to clocks tend to be rather expensive I would ask for a refund and buy elsewhere if I where you.

Trinity66 · 04/04/2018 10:55

Absolutely no indication at all - it was sold, at least, orally, as in good working condition

oh sorry missed this post, if the dealer told you it worked but it doesn't work then It should be him paying or refunding you I think

Original poster
WyclefJohn · 04/04/2018 11:02

The point about it working is that there is a grey area of assumption. We didn't explicitly ask whether it worked, he didn't say it didn't. But we definitely had conversations around the line of how it is in good condition - he confirmed it was in good condition. It's clear from communication after they didn't know it didn't work. But given it was a specialist shop, and the price we paid, we assumed it would be work.

OP posts:
Trinity66 · 04/04/2018 11:04

Probably best off to ask for your money back then if it's a case of miscommunication? You should be entitled to that but maybe not the repairs

Original poster
WyclefJohn · 04/04/2018 11:15

I'm not sure if it is miscommunication though.

OP posts:
RaptorInaPorkPieHat · 04/04/2018 11:21

Good condition surely implies that it works doesn't it?

Depending on how much you love it/paid for it and how easy it would be to find a similar clock, I'd be wanting a refund.

alittlequinnie · 04/04/2018 12:07

We got an antique clock about 15 years ago.

Lovely thing, black slate - working - cost about £175.

Worked for about 2/3 years then it stopped. We had to get it serviced - £150.

Worked for another 2/3 years then it stopped. We had to get it serviced - £150.

Worked for another 2/3 years then it stopped. We had to get it serviced - £150.

You get the picture - every time we say it will be the last time but we are "in deep" now - next time it goes I think it will just be an ornament - I keep trying to get my husband to put an electric clock inside it but we will lose the beautiful chimes...

...maybe I will start a 50p jar each week to cover the cost - probably the most valuable thing in the whole house now :(

GhoulWithADragonTattoo · 04/04/2018 12:36

Good condition implies working. I’d ask for a refund unless you adore it and dealer is willing to get it repaired. What is repairs are not successful?

Tainbri · 04/04/2018 13:22

How long after you bought it did you contact the dealer? i would imagine it may make a difference?

Original poster
WyclefJohn · 04/04/2018 14:28

So the dealer was contacted within three days. We tried it a few times over the weekend.

OP posts:
Moonflower12 · 04/04/2018 17:59

I think with 'antiques' it is creveat emptor- buyer beware.
Not fair but the dealer might try to pull this to get you to pay!

Jamiefraserskilt · 04/04/2018 18:06

Take a good close look at the sale of goods act.
Is it of merchantable quality?I
Does it serve the purpose?

Under the act, you can refuse to pay and request a refund or repair.
Go and swat up. Then you can quote from the act.

DairyisClosed · 04/04/2018 18:11

Tell them that the clock working was a condition of your contract and that you now wish to rescind. Alternatively you can argue that they misrepresented the clock being in good condition and thus you wish to rescind. Alternatively, if you aim they did know realise it didn't work, you could argue that there was a mistake as the the quality of the goods and that the clock you bought is materially different from what you thought you were buying hence the contact is void ab initio. Alternatively, in most contracts of sale, the consumer has the statutory right to return the item within 14 days for any reason.

Tainbri · 04/04/2018 19:03

If they have sold the clock to younin "good condition" which you assume to be good working order them legally it's down to them. Even the second hand goods act covers misrepresentation! They should ensure (at their cost) that you have received the item described

TeacupDrama · 04/04/2018 20:06

14 days return for any reason only applies online; as you have had no opportunity to inspect the goods; they bought from a shop so that is completely wrong

in antiques good condition probably means no woodworm no cracks in marble/ slate, only minor inconsequential missing parts ie tiny bit of beading small brass scroll, the handles may not match exactly good condition is about 3rd in rank after excellent and very good

testing a clock means starting it checking pendulum does it strike the hour etc a dealer would not be expected to make sure it ran for days and days if it started and went for a few hours that would count as working second hand goods and antiques can be tricky but sale of goods act does apply

most auctions houses only sell clocks, lighting etc as works of art ie no guarantee of working that is industry standard as they do not test electric etc so no watch bought at auction could be returned on basis that it did not work

a lot of antique china is sold as display only as if tableware has been displayed for years and not washed if you wash it , it may break with the water most antiques are sold as decorative only

how liable they are depends on the conversation re the clock working long term if all they said was we tried to wind it up and it started they would be clear if they said this has been working in the shop for the past 3 weeks then maybe not; old clocks are very susceptible to being over wound hopefully you can come to some mutually satisfactory arrangement

Chrys2017 · 04/04/2018 20:17

I had a similar problem with an old metronome I bought that was advertised as "in working order", but it did not keep time! Seller responded to my complaint with "I wound it up and it ticked" (yes, but the ticking was sporadic!). We ended up agreeing on a refund of 1/2 the money I paid (only because my friend wanted to have a go at fixing it as a project). How much would you pay for a broken clock?

Tainbri · 04/04/2018 20:19

Well, it's up to you, but if this dealer needs to trade on a reputable name, he needs to negotiate some good will imo!

MrsOprah · 04/04/2018 20:30

Did you buyon credit card - protected purchase?

GhoulWithADragonTattoo · 04/04/2018 20:39

For an antique clock in described as bing in good condition actually working is essential. The basic purpose of a clock is to tell the time. I think OP can say this is not fit for purpose and get a refund or repair as seller’s cost as she wishes.

Avasarala · 04/04/2018 20:40

Please ignore previous posters saying you don't have the same rights as buying new.

Since 2015, if you buy from a second-hand retailer (so this includes antiques) And the item is not fit for purpose, you have the same statutory rights as you would have if it were brand new.

You bought a clock describes as working in good condition. So, to be fit for purpose it should function as a clock. It does not.

If they had told you it doesn't work but is decorative, then you'd have no refund right.

The item isn't fit for purpose and isn't as described. Even if it's a grey area to you as to whether they meant it looks good rather than actually works, your statutory rights are on your side.

You need to give them one opportunity to repair the item, and if they can't then you are entitled to a refund.

Even if it's an antique, if you buy from retail shop then it needs to be fit for purpose. They can sell broken stuff as long as they tell you it is broken. They didn't.