Funding for trans people

[Lifeaback]

First of all I want to start by saying I don't condone much of the transphobia that seems to exist on mn. I consider myself to be a very accepting and empathetic person, and have respect and admiration for the trans community.

Ive just finished watching a short BBC 3 documentary called 'becoming a trans man: Leo'. This followed a 16 year old mtf trans man on his journey to medically transition, which involved questions about his future ability to have biological children. He made the decision to have his eggs frozen for the future, and this was funded by the NHS. In the future he hopes to have both top and bottom surgery, which he will also be applying for funding through the NHS.

I completely understand the nature of gender dysphoria and how important all of these medical procedures are for both leo and all other trans people. However, it's really made me question some things regarding the NHS and their budget allocation for treatments. When I was 21, I was diagnosed with Leukemia. Before starting chemotherapy, one of my main worries was how it would affect my future fertility as I had no children and knew that I wanted them in the future. After much research, the general consensus was that nhs funding to freeze my eggs was not going to be very likely. Fortunately, I was able to (with some help from my family and friends) fund to have this done privately. But this isn't an option for many people, and so many young cancer sufferers do not have that choice. After beating cancer, rebuilding your life again is a huge struggle and brings many mental health challenges with it. I can't even imagine how much more I would have struggled if I also had to deal with knowing I would never be able to have biological children, it would have I'm sure been an additional cause of suffering for me.

I remember reading a thread on MN a whilst back about a women who had a breast deformity, known as tuberous/tubular breasts (google for examples of how this looks). It severely affected her mental health, and she became suicidal. She applied for NHS funding to correct this deformity, but was rejected and was unable to fund it privately.

My question I guess is why are so many women being let down/refused the help that would benefit them, when the trans community seem to be granted a huge amount of the NHS' finance. Obviously I am well aware that the NHS is at breaking point and has very limited funds, but surely there should be a blanket ban for all women on things like egg freezing and breast surgery rather than how it is currently?

I have done limited research into statistics of how much funding is allocated, so please do correct me if I'm wrong. I just wanted to hear some other viewpoints on this issue really after watching the film and thought MN might be a good place to ask. Thanks if you've managed to read this far!

@jeloz this argument re laser hair removal/vaniqua comes up quite frequently, usually as you say re pcos. Our local prescribing rules from the ccg don't allow prescription of them for anyone. Regardless of feelz or chromasomes

@picklemepopcorn

To me, trans people already have a viable, sustainable body they live in.

For a genuine trans person what is the better option? Ongoing support from mental health services or transition? Both have cost implications for the NHS.

I disagree with giving children hormones/puberty blockers, people buying hormones online and the complaint that the current system pathologises transgenderism. I don't think that recognising that these are major and permanent changes to be making to your body and that they should be done under medical supervision with fully informed consent is transphobic or pathologising anything. It's about safety, being aware of the risks and being as sure as possible that it's the right decision for you and it should involve counselling, because again, major life changing decisions here. But none of this is free.

It's not huge amounts of NHS money because of how small the population of transmen is.

The solution isn't to throw trans people under the bus and say they should be denied fertility options, it's to properly fund the NHS so that egg freezing is available to leukaemia patients as well.

The NHS would rather be seen to do the right thing by a small minority rather than looking after the basic health needs of the majority. This is largely because they don’t want this group making a fuss or making accusations transphobia or discrimination. Meanwhile the rest of us have to put up and shut up about being denied the most basic treatments.

Olivers, was that your child? How awful.

The treatment my friend has was curative rather than life extending. She’s still in treatment but we are hopeful.

It’s insane things like that aren’t being funded. And MH services are just useless and so underfunded while so much money is being spent on this one issue.

except we can't possibly fund everything, so no.
I don't see why we should be funding any fertility assistance for someone who could have children perfectly well, but choose to change their bodies so that they can't. And what for anyway? We freeze the eggs of women so they can get pregnant later. Is this person going to do that?

I do wonder if a lot of the NHS funding is a postcode lottery, as I think where you live can very much affect what you're entitled to. I also know a young woman who had tubular breasts, and she was able to obtain an augmentation on the NHS at no expense to herself. However she had a very rare type of childhood cancer years prior, and some specialists suggested her treatment might have been a factor in how she developed as her breast tissue was badly damaged.
Admittedly I don't know much about the NHS funding structure, but I do think the level of care available (for trans people or not) varies across the country.

It was dp. He has stage 4 bowel cancer . it had spread to his spleen and stomach. So he underwent a 12 hour operation which involved 3 teams of surgeons, (one to cut out the cancer, one to reverse his stoma and one for the heated chemo treatment)

We think it has bought him 2 more years.

You have quite the chip on your shoulder, don't you?

Possibly Makeup to be honest with you, yes. Over the next 2 years I am trying to raise 50k for surgery for a medical condition which the NHS won't cover. It's for a condition which only affects women; it leaves people more and more disabled as they age, and brings with it some nasty complications. I've had 20 years of being treated pretty shoddily by the NHS and it does wear you down, feeling the medical professiin doesn't care.

Actually thinking about this issue overnight I don't think I properly expressed how sad I feel for Leo. It's obvious his gender dysphoria causes a lot of distress.

I think you have to look at it from the NHS's point of view. Doctors are supposed to do no harm but effectiveluly here they are consenting to mutilate people. Breast removal and a hysterectomy on a physically healthy girl must be difficult to carry out. It leaves doctors open to all sorts further down the line (as would performing liposuction on an anorexic or removing the limb of a trans-disabled individual) and I think it would reassure the doctor carrying out the procedure to know they were giving their patient options. It's quite a bold move to do gender reassignment on someone. I can't think why the NHS does it at all given how reluctant they are to sterilise women who are done having children. Yes trans people can be very unhappy without surgery but so can anorexics who are forced to eat.

Olivers, that will be so important especially for your children. Here’s hoping it’s as long as possible.

Oh @Oliversmumsarmy - I'm so sorry. Also hoping for a good outcome.

I find removing healthy organs absolutely repugnant and cannot see how it's compatible with the NHS's aims

This is precisely why a proper review of the NHS is so badly needed. Because it's grown organically it's a huge mass of inconsistency and absurdity, particularly since the last restructure which made it a total postcode lottery. We really do have screwed priorities when we deny cancer patients drugs and fund procedures the NHS was never meant to cover. Please don't ask me what I think those are because I'd offend an awful lot of people.

And vaniqa face cream (that slows the hair growing back) I have pcos and awful facial hair (and general body hair) its like trying to get blood out of a stone trying to get nhs help about excess hair as an actual woman, I have to pay for laser and vaniqa. Yet they acknowledge women shouldn’t have hair and how depressing it is (otherwise why fund it for trans)

Oh dont get me started. My GP won't prescribe vaniqa saying it won't work. I don't believe it and that he just won't prescribe it on costs grounds.

I have excess facial hair because of a hormonal problem too.

I have to shave, pluck, because I cant afford laser.

I am a woman, I am not supposed to have facial hair.

A man is supposed to have facial hair and is an indication of a normal man's functioning body.

They will fund hair removal for normal men wanting to pretend to women but won't fund it for women who grow excess hair because of actual medical conditions.

Drives me mad.

Gender dysphoria causes a lot of distress but so do lots of other conditions and they are potentially life threatening. Gender reassignment surgery on physically healthy individuals should not be prioritised over people who are genuinely ill and in need of treatment on the NHS.