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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Gower school discussion 2

46 replies

squeezylemons · 05/03/2018 18:06

Continuation of www.mumsnet.com/Talk/education/1835481-Gower-school-islington?pg=20&order=

OP posts:
Facetothesun · 17/03/2018 10:01

I’m concerned because my child is at the school. I don’t need to know who anyone is I want to know I can trust the posts. My child is at the school!!! I want to know what I can trust. And honestly regarding shows blurring into one... nope you’d remember this.

Facetothesun · 17/03/2018 11:39

Children being called morons are current comments. My child is my upmost concern. Anyone can say anything here so I’ve provided a very safe way to prove I can trust you. Considering my experience is not this. It’s awfully confusing and upsetting. So here I am offering that safe opportunity. We aren’t talking about the Beaty of a rose here we are talking about children being called morons at a school my child goes to. Excuse me for wanting proof.

Facetothesun · 17/03/2018 14:43

Finally I was sat right at the back and couldn’t miss the unique quality of this first performance. If you were there trust me there’s no question you would know. Again my child, my deep concern needs to understand this. Because my experience isn’t meeting with what I read.

Facetothesun · 17/03/2018 16:08

At the back up stairs... No one missed this. It was wonderful to see. And a very special moment for the child involved. I’m sure it was utterly magical for their confidence.

123yellowblue · 17/03/2018 16:25

@facetothesun
Steel drums? Sorry I do not mean to be cynical about memory of concerts blurring, I love them, but have really seen a lot (and recitals and music festivals and summer concerts... :)

Facetothesun · 17/03/2018 16:26

Ok, you really weren’t there... thank you for confirming.

Facetothesun · 17/03/2018 16:58

There was something utterly outstanding and beautiful about this very first performance and it warmed my heart to see EG had put this centre stage. Of course it may now be possible to guess what I’m referring to.

At this point I’m stepping away. I believe there has been many mistakes made that have upset people. I don’t believe it’s all lies but the nuances of people’s motives aren’t accessible within the confines of a Mumnet conversation. I will chose to trust my day to day experience of the school. Which is really the best place to make discussions from. Because yes it’s great that Mumsnet is a place of safety in sharing experiences but equally what comes with that is no real way to to know what’s true or current, that’s the pay off of such a site.

As a mother I love my child more than I could love anything. I read very recent comments about children being called morons. As I have said many times this doesn’t match my experience, my child’s or the parents I know. I have sought many ways to bridge this gap between what is written here and what I see. I’ve been met with very little understanding, or depth or reaching out for why I might want proof that you’re commenting is likely to be genuine. Considering the awful nature of what is meant to be going on surely that would be understandable. What I’ve received is more subtle hostility from some posters. Throwing it back at me, why would anyone do that? I’ll go all out for truth when it may effect my child.

Everyone has a different personality type and as I have a child at the school child, this mismatch has concerned me and I’m the type to want to make sense of that. So I’ve gotten involved, knee deep. In the very same way many people have with negative experiences. But because my experience is positive I can’t keep coming back to understand this? I’m somehow different? My speed of posting, my experiences all questioned underminded or bullied.

I’m a mum who wants answers. But thanks to no one answering my question I feel confident in what I know. I thank you all for that. All the best! I’m out of here.

This thread is something I no longer need to return to. I have my answers at least to the current complaints.

123yellowblue · 17/03/2018 18:07

@facetothesun
I'm actually a bit upset now that you do not believe me. I have already "outed" myself as a parent @squeezylemons reminded me that I do not even need to do this. As I said, I have been following this post (or rather the previous long one) since it started and have never commented on it. But it was your posts, trying to positively reach out, that made me finally put myself out there. I was exactly where you are now, maybe even more so. I am a parent, have been for very many years, has always supported the school and even defended it. However, I became quite quickly aware of the undercurrent of bad management and possible bullying but did not believe it enough or did not want to believe it. I believed in the goodness of the core of it. But, what people are saying on here, about the language being used, is not made up. I believe the children. I have no motive to exaggerate or make this up. And I'm more than happy to out myself further and answer any questions you may have (just not on here). And I honestly do not know what you are referring to in the concert - and please I have seen so many of these and may just have a very different frame of reference. (You do not mean the steel drums then?)

squeezylemons · 17/03/2018 18:27

@facetothesun you must realise why so many think defensive posters are EG. Why is it so relevant who people are? This post has been active for years, with hundreds of posts. Do you honestly think a troll would be so invested in this thread?
It really doesn’t matter who is who, what really matters are the issues within the school. Issues which some may not be aware of. You have completely contradicted yourself within your last post. You have made the decision that 400+ posts from various posters must not be real, purely because people are unwilling to out themselves.
@123 be careful not to out yourself too much. If EG, who im sure follows this post carefully, finds out who you are then I’m quite confident that things will become difficult for you.

OP posts:
Facetothesun · 17/03/2018 18:39

I’m happy to meet for coffee, or you can message me privately absolutely, thank you. Honestly I find it a bit odd you have no idea what I’m talking about... you could have been to 100 concerts and I’m sure you’d absolutely be in a position to answer this question if you were there.

But I don’t want to make this about you. I can’t see your username in any recent posts... There are people making some very strong claims. Let them respond to the very obvious answer. Although I’m signing out of further responding.

Overall you’ve been pretty pleasant, it’s nice to get a sense of someone, rather than just a reactivity. You do seem pretty rounded and not spiteful.

But the truth is my and so many others aren’t having this awful experience. In the end I don’t know if these recent posts are true, but as with anything in life one has to make a call. If my child or any of the children I know make these claims to me or to another parent I know it’s a promise I’ll come back and shout it from the roof tops. But our experience is wonderful and on balance I trust my experience over the claims made by people who can’t provide proof of such claims by answering a super easy question that would have zero effect on anyone discovering who they were. Which they would know if they knew the answer.

Really calling a child a moron is a form of child abuse so I’m within my rights to push a little deeper on this matter considering my child is at the school. I will also ask within the people I know at the school.

It’s really been chalk and cheese so far regarding our experience at this thread. Maybe that’s a good thing because maybe something is working. We surely all want that too. But no I don’t believe the recent posts.

Also I absolutely apologise if I’ve offended you. Something that was never offered to me.

Message me privately if you want to take me up on that offer. Continuing here is not good for a persons soul.

squeezylemons · 17/03/2018 19:16

@facetothesun I’m not sure if that was for me or 123. I’ve been involved in this thread for some time but have NC.
I totally understand your concerns but you need to understand that people are very weary about outing themselves due to the repercussions it may cause. Something I am definitely not willing to do.
TGS on the surface seems like a wonderful learning environment. The issues lie much deeper. Some parents are aware, others oblivious. My issue is that you seem to think that this thread is a pile of lies as your experience has been so different. If you like the school that is 100% your choice but it is unfair to try and discredit what others have said. Some evidence is plain to see, one being no PTA. This in itself should ring alarm bells. Whether or not someone was at the concert or not should not make a difference to this thread.
The only other option is that this thread has been terribly trolled. If that is the case why has someone gone through such lengths to discredit EG or TGS, over such a long period of time. Either way I don’t think that says much about the head.

OP posts:
Facetothesun · 17/03/2018 20:04

@squeezylemons, I get people are wary of positive experiences, but once it became clear I was genuine and felt bullied nobody said anything. That’s not justifiable though that’s all I’ve received is justification. There’s never justification for bullying..

Again answering that question could not out you. Impossible I’ve chosen something that would insure this. Also I don’t need to know who anyone is, that’s one request I put forward to understand if these (recent) comments have any legs. But I respect people’s need for privacy so I came up with a super obvious easy to answer question that could cause zero harm to the person answering. Why did I do this because the claims are strong and horrible and this would help me see if these claims are true. It makes a huge difference if you can answer my question, at least to me with a child to think of. I can know for sure you are current and with recent claims worth taking on board. And it’s such an easy question to answer with no possible way of exposing identities. I cannot help but become a little sceptical when no one can answer. Pick a new user name and leave a one word answer. It’s so simple. As easy as me saying if the child was male or female (not the answer) but it would have that much effect on outing anyone. If you are a parent who has heard such awful stuff, answer for me, as a concerned parent.

I’ve also been very clear I’m talking about recent threads. Yet you keep saying I think everyone is lieing. I’ve not said that. I have no idea what’s gone on in the past.

I’d like a PTA but it’s not having an awful impact for us and everyone I know and there are so many wonderful things that one makes a judgment.

Read my posts again, I’m happy to know who anyone is I’m happy not to know. My focus is finding ways to truth. Like I said this really isn’t good for a persons soul.

I wish you all well, and although it’s been pretty horrible at times I’ve learned a lot. All I needed really.

squeezylemons · 18/03/2018 07:10

I genuinely find your questioning suspicious. I’ve already explained that answering your question would allow someone to know whether it was a parent/ex parent/staff/ex staff.
What also concerns me about your post is that you are solely focusing on ‘moron’ as it is ‘current’. You are willing to ignore 5 years of consistent and continuous posting as it isn’t ‘current’ enough. Everything on this post is very relevant. Considering concerns are quite similar throughout the years, and no improvements have been made. Why does moron concern you but all other posts don’t? Do you believe all the other concerns have been dealt with?
Why should someone being at the concert mean they 100% know a child was called a moron? It doesn’t.
No PTA? Seriously? Actually it does have a huge impact. You are being refused a voice. Why does that not concern you?
I think bullying is a strong word. I hope we are adults and not children.
If you are a parent with genuine concerns then you are asking the wrong questions!

OP posts:
Dontcallmemummy8 · 19/03/2018 18:31

I am a long term lurker and first time poster. I don't propose to prove my independence and just wanted to give my opinion as another TGS parent.

I wholeheartedly agree with @facetothesun. Before choosing the school (which we took very seriously as financially it is a bit of a stretch for us and we wanted to make the "right" choice).

This thread terrified me when I read it but tried to approach the open morning with an open mind. We were absolutely blown away by how happy, confident, curious and kind the children and the teachers were.

Our experience to date has been truly wonderful, committed and supportive staff and a very happy DC. I would urge anyone considering TGS to visit yourself and to make your own mind up. Our experience of TGS is an overwhelmingly positive one.

123yellowblue · 19/03/2018 22:45

@donotcallmemummy8 I am happy for the people who still have such a wonderful experience at the school. In no way do I wish to discredit your experience.

Likewise I do not wish to discredit any of the negative experiences. And for the “happy” parents out there, I would like you to please consider the possibility that the “unhappy” people have had some really terrible experiences that make them react here in this space in a certain way.

I have, as I said before, been following this thread for a long time and thus and through other channels known about the problems at the school. @squeezylemons To my mind the recent ‘moron” incident is quite different (possibly a new low?) as it is the first time, at least to my knowledge, that this particular staff member has not just used language with the children that is not ideal, potentially affecting their confidence, but actually called a child names. It is different, as firstly no school should tolerate this (and I hope no other “outstanding" school does) and secondly as it was witnessed by others (not just a report by a single individual or family) and reported by the children to their parents.

squeezylemons · 20/03/2018 07:33

@123 I have tried not to comment on the ‘moron’ situation as it is not something I am aware of. But if I’m being honest, when I read it, I was not surprised at all, I didn’t bat an eyelid. Which in itself quite worrying.

OP posts:
TrickyD · 20/03/2018 08:27

I had never heard of this school before coming across this thread and its predecessor.

But, what happened at the concert? I need to know. (PMs welcome)

Thelema · 23/03/2018 20:25

When a teacher leaves the school do they just disappear and parents are informed after the fact in the weekly newsletter? That's the impression I have gotten. Please correct that if that's wrong.

In my experience, schools acknowledge the good work of the departing teacher. The kids write cards, there's a parting gift and at the final assembly the Head wishes the teacher, good luck. Does that happen at this school?

squeezylemons · 24/03/2018 06:42

This only happens if the person leaving is one of EG favourites. Most get nothing, just a quick exit.

OP posts:
mrstyles · 14/07/2020 20:30

I'm a parent whose child joined The Gower School at reception stage. This is my honest personal opinion based on my direct experience only.

For the record, all those posters who say something along the lines of 'it's an amazing school and we have nothing but praise' - none of the dozen or so parents in our year group who I was close to would agree. Yes, TGS has many positive aspects but ultimately there are some very deep structural and cultural problems at the school that unfortunately start with the headmistress and trickle down throughout the organisation.

I am deeply sceptical of anyone who says they have had a 100% positive experience at TGS.

Here is my honest balanced appraisal:

Positives: The best thing about the school is the community - parents and children are mostly extremely nice.

Lots of very good and caring teachers. Support staff are generally also very good.

Generally a good After School Club provision.

A small school which, in reception particularly, gives a gentle and free flowing introduction to Primary education.

Negatives: The fundamental structure of the school is problematic. The Headmistress/owner wields way too much power and is over officious. She deals with routine constructive feedback poorly at times and is also capable of disproportionate rudeness.

The fact that constructive feedback is at times mishandled and dismissed is particularly galling as TGS is ridiculously time demanding of parents. With both parents working this grates very quickly and after a while begins to feel borderline neurotic. Expect your child to constantly be set time demanding projects that they are not old enough to complete independently and which therefore become the parents' homework! Expect to receive endless long and repetitive messages daily over several channels. Expect to prepare and deliver snacks to feed your child's class and bring flowers to the classroom every term (stealth tax!).

The school oversteps what should be a clear boundary between education and parenting. The school is exceptionally prescriptive with mandatory parenting workshops about what you should and shouldn't be doing as a parent. This often feels overbearing and patronising.

Expect fees to rise significantly year on year, while the educational provision and facilities do not improve (in fact in my experience they got worse year on year).

As has been pointed out over the years in this thread, there is still a very high turnover of staff at the school. Anyone who has read through this thread will have an understanding why that is. Unfortunately, a very small minority of staff are poor. This lead us to experience several instances of substandard and wholly inadequate pastoral care at the school. When you do experience safeguarding issues, I found there not to be a culture of taking on board constructive criticism and the school being willing to learn from (sometimes completely unacceptable) mistakes.

I often felt that the focus on the basics of Maths and English were overlooked with far too much time spent on dress up days, engagement in pr awards for the school, endless charity events, rehearsals for assemblies, performances and plays. These things are all great but should be secondary to basic education! In reception it's not such an issue but by Year 2, I had to pick up the slack by tutoring my child, which shouldn't really be the case when you're paying for the privilege of private education!

The final nail in the coffin for us were several safeguarding issues in quick succession, which were so worrying that our very real academic concerns were secondary.

If the school (as it claims) had a culture of working with parents to really resolve issues and learn from mistakes perhaps we could have given them the benefit of the doubt and continued for another year.

However, the Headmistresses' behaviour meant we lost faith in her and therefore the school as a whole, as she has built a controlling culture around her that disempowers her employees.

If I had my time over again, I would categorically choose another school.

BadSkiingMum · 24/09/2022 17:24

I honestly don’t understand why TGS parents don’t set up a PTA by themselves? You are legally entitled to associate and do not need the school’s approval to do so. You could even form a registered charity?

If you organise, it may be more powerful than you anticipate.

I have done this myself by the way, so don’t write without experience. Management caved and embraced it after about a day, though I suspect this might be a tougher nut to crack.

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