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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think child sex abuse victims shouldn’t be called prostitutes

131 replies

Notevilstepmother · 19/02/2018 12:46

Following on from the Haiti Oxfam debacle. The BBC has reported that the use of child prostitutes cannot be ruled out.

I think it’s important to distinguish between consent for money (still dubious and creepy in such a situation with vulnerable women) and children being unable to consent. Children are not prostitutes they are child sex abuse victims and should be respected and reported as such.

I’ve complained to the BBC, feel free to do the same.

OP posts:
MonkeysMummy17 · 19/02/2018 18:27

That's awful, thanks for sharing, have put in a complaint

alpineibex · 19/02/2018 18:30

Child Sexual Exploitation carries up to age 18, so even though legally a 16/17 year old can sleep with whomever they like, if it's exploitative or in exchange for things etc then it's still classed as CSE despite victim being over the age of consent.

UpABitLate · 19/02/2018 18:31

How about de-invisibilising the agent on this.

Men paid to sexually abuse underage children.

Underage may be redundant but you get my drift.

FWIW I believe it is illegal to work as a prostitute under the age of 18 in the UK, and therefore presumably to buy it. So the "age of consent in the UK" arguments are not really valid.

Also, prostition is illegal in Haiti.

alpineibex · 19/02/2018 18:32

Not whomever they like, obvs within restrictions like those who are in authority over them.

UpABitLate · 19/02/2018 18:33

xposts with alpine Smile

Prostituted children is fine for me, but again, where is the agent? Work needs to be done to focus on the perpetrators not the vctims, and this sort of reporting that talks of "child prostitutes" but fails to focus on the men paying for them is lacking. Lots of times the criminals are sort of obscured from this.

alpineibex · 19/02/2018 18:34

Yes, it is. I thought it was legal for me to be a prostitute when I was 17, but when I told my support worker about what was going on, they told me it was abuse and moved me out of the area Blush

efeslight · 19/02/2018 18:35

I also am angry about the use of this phrase-underage prostitutes are children who are being raped and trapped somehow in this hellish situation. They are not prostitutes, who I think are adult. As pp have said, it reminds me of how children in Rotherham were referred to. I heard a piece on Radio 4, where a father of one of these girls was told by the police...well, theres nothing we can do as your daughter has chosen to be an underage prostitute. As if it were a decision she had made.

Pengggwn · 19/02/2018 18:35

UpABitLate

I think the agent is very clear: someone pimped these children and someone paid to abuse them.

UpABitLate · 19/02/2018 18:37

I'm sorry to hear about your teenage experinces, I know that children in care and so forth are at high risk of being preyed on.

Same as people in areas where there has recently been some kind of catastrophe.

I have seen people arguing that what these men did (if it were adults) was fine, what's the problem. The problem is the power dynamic, and that men going to help in disasters are in a position of power, and wealth, and in my opinion there should be a hard rule saying no sexual interaction whatsoever with the locals.

If they want to have sex then they can kind a willing colleague or go without.

Lizzie48 · 19/02/2018 18:38

Agreed, @noeffingidea I think the film 'Pretty Woman' did a lot of damage there. I think it created the myth of the 'happy hooker', which is no doubt true of some high class escorts, but definitely not true of most sex workers, and never of children who are caught up in the sex industry, who I think never receive any money themselves.

'Prostituted child' is a pretty accurate description, and removes any suggestion of the so called 'happy hooker' from the equation.

lightoflaluna · 19/02/2018 18:40

When i first heard this story, i don't believe it was mentioned that children were involved, and the idea of vulnerable adult women being exploited was sickening enough.

The mind boggles as to how someone who supposedly dedicates his life to helping people could do these things

UpABitLate · 19/02/2018 18:41

The agent is not very clear:

The agent is not mentioned.

Centring the criminals in these types of headlines is of vital importance.

It happens all the time with sex crimes and DV as well. It's not good enough.

I see from earlier on you have a view that language doesn't really matter so, whatever. I think it does and so do lots of others.

It certainly had an impact on the girls who were being abused in various northern cities a few years back. In that, they were seen as child prostitutes, and therefore there was no reason to help them. They had agency, they knew what they were doing, and they were profiting from it. So irrespective of what you think, those actual words that you so approve of resulted in actual girls being actually raped for longer than they would have been if it had been correctly identiifed as child sexual exploitation.

seafoodeatit · 19/02/2018 18:43

YANBU, it implies a degree of control and choice whilst also ignoring that it's a form of abuse and paedophilia, using child prostitutes sounds nicer then paedophiles raping trafficked children though.

Pengggwn · 19/02/2018 18:44

UpABitLate

My view isn't that language doesn't matter. There are important distinctions and there are semantic distinctions.

But that is by the by. In this case, 'prostituted' implies the agent is not the child, it is those who were complicit in prostituting the child.

And with regards to your last point, it wasn't the language that caused those girls to be raped for longer. It was the disgusting attitudes of those who believed their sexual activity and payment for that could ever have been consensual. They would have believed that whatever people called it, because they are misogynistic pricks.

WildWindsBlowing · 19/02/2018 18:45

I agree they are abused children, but when listening to the news, the words "child prostitute" would not make anyone think the child was a consenting sex worker (though no one is truly a consenting sex worker even as an adult imo). Rather they would think of an abused, enslaved child - owned by a pimp or brothel - and that the child is sold for sex. While the epithet "sexually abused child" could be taken to mean exactly that, but not a child owned and sold for sex.

So the public might listening to the news might want to know which it was, even though anyone paying for sex with a child [having sex with a child prostitute] is of course a sexual abuser, and surely no one listening to the news would think otherwise. "Paying" would never condone the act.

Mumsnut · 19/02/2018 18:46

'Children sold and bought for sex. By men'

WildWindsBlowing · 19/02/2018 18:48

'Child prostitute', or a defenceless, abused, child left with no alternative.

Graphista · 19/02/2018 18:50

"Prostituted children" is slightly better but I still prefer "abused children" "exploited children"

Upabit late I agree it removes the focus from the perpetrators too.

Perhaps news on this story should be worded something like :

"The alleged sexual predators involved in the oxfam/Haiti scandal are being investigated/charged following new evidence that..."

westridingpauperlunaticasylum · 19/02/2018 18:50

Penggwyn - if we remove any word from the discussion that is formed around 'prostitute' we can use the correct terminology, abused, exploited, controlled, assaulted, raped. As a PP has explained better than me, people sub consciously blur the lines. Prostituted as a word is not helpful. It does not fully explain the horrific behaviours of procurers, rapists and abusers. It's better than 'child prostitute' but not by much tbh

Pengggwn · 19/02/2018 18:53

westridingpauperlunaticasylum

I'm not sure the people who blur the lines are doing it subconsciously. I think anyone who is predisposed to believe that a child can consent to sex in any circumstance, whether for money or not, will always think like that.

'Prostituted', to me, fully conveys the horrific behaviour.

UpABitLate · 19/02/2018 18:54

Interesting

It isn't the term "prostituted children" that you approved of earlier, it was at the start of the thread when the phrase "child prostitutes" was under discussion.

The phrase "prostituted children" wasn't mentioned until very recently.

You are being extremely inconcsistent. Or do you see language as so unimportant that "child prostitute" and "prostituted child" are interchangable for you?

UpABitLate · 19/02/2018 18:55

So you've totally changed your mind about the phrase "child prostitute" then, have you?

Pengggwn · 19/02/2018 18:59

UpABitLate

No. It doesn't bother me. I think the distinction is largely semantic. However, as that phrase bothers people, I thought about one that was similarly informative but didn't present the same issues, for the benefit of those who are upset about 'child prostitute' and those (me included) who want language to be as informative as possible.

OrphanWeek · 19/02/2018 19:00

I think the word 'prostituted' is very important in this context. Sexually exploited children' is a huge umbrella term of which 'prostituted' is a type. It is important that we or the general public understand the specifics of this.

OutyMcOutface · 19/02/2018 19:01

I'm surprised that anyone would tbf.