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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To want the Gideons to get the #### out of my child's school

477 replies

PatriarchyPersonified · 15/02/2018 13:50

As I have made clear on threads on here in the past, I am an atheist (I'm actually a strong anti-theist) and I believe in the secularisation of society. (i.e religion can be there for people who want it but it should be irrelevant to anybodies day to day life unless they want to make it relevant.)

I believe that children should be taught about religions in school, as part of a comprehensive RE syllabus, and particularly about Christianity, as I believe from a cultural and historical perspective, it is impossible to fully understand the history and culture of the UK without reference to the bible. I would feel the same way about the Qu'ran if I lived in an Arab country btw.

What I am not happy about is that my oldest DC (12) has just had the bloody Gideon Society hosting an assembly in their school and dishing out Bibles! School is not the place for this. There is a reason why religious groups always target schools and prisons, its where the easy targets are.

OP posts:
Vitalogy · 15/02/2018 15:07

The sooner we raise our countries consciousness
more tolerant and enlightened we will all start to become. You sound quite spiritual there Julie

TabbyMack · 15/02/2018 15:07

Given the Gideon's generally present children with the new testament there won't be any kf that

No. They'll just learn that lovely, kind Jesus (when he's in his other role as his own father) wants them to burn in hell for eternity for having the almighty cheek to be born a human being & forgetting to say sorry for things they have't done.

Awww...such a wholesome Christian message.

Original poster
PatriarchyPersonified · 15/02/2018 15:08

TheQuestingVole

There is quite a bit of other stuff in there that you haven't mentioned though isn't there?

I wonder why?

OP posts:
pingupanini · 15/02/2018 15:08

@Julie8008 Grin but don't scientologists have to pay to learn about Scientology themselves? Whereas the Gideons want to give it away free...

Could you imagine the headteacher calling up Scientology HQ to ask for an assembly? The price would be astronomical I imagine

TabbyMack · 15/02/2018 15:08

QuestingVole No, it isn't. Try actually reading it.

SheilaTurnip · 15/02/2018 15:10

I agree, OP.

Age 14 and very confused, bullied etc I followed the JW's out of my house for a chat and as someone secretive I could have fallen for it.

That said, following parents down the same path, is that not the same thing?

WooWooSister · 15/02/2018 15:11

Didn't this debate get done the other day?
YY and the week before and the week before that . . .it's as regular as the child and parent parking spaces.
If you object then object to the school but since you already know their response it's maybe time to make a decision on whether to let your DC attend assemblies from external guests or not. Otherwise, you're imposing your view on the other parents and DCs.
I'm not sure the Gideons are strictly 'proselytizing' since I don't know anyone they have converted at a school assembly and likewise, I don't know anyone who considers their assemblies to be positive promotion of religion. So, on both fronts - conversion and promotion - they fall short. The only point I remember from my Gideon assembly was that they put bibles in hotel rooms.

VanGoghsLeftEar · 15/02/2018 15:13

We are atheists and dc goes to a community primary. If our daughter was given a Bible at school, we'd laugh! Why would we want one of those? To keep a door open?

We don't bang on about religion but treat religious stories as just that, stories. Dc is well into fantasy right now, so it's all basically the same thing anyway. Fantastical exciting stories.

If dc wanted to follow a religion it's ok. We'll just keep reminding her of women's rights, LGBTQ rights, minority rights, and how religion destroys all of them. Smile Slavery, rape, theft...etc. is all allowed in certain circumstances in the Bible and Quran. Trying to square all that with modern sensibilities will be a stretch.

listsandbudgets · 15/02/2018 15:13

valantinesfart I certainly did not lose my shit when DD was given a qu'ran. About half the children in her class are Muslim - is there any particular reason why I should mind her being exposed to their beliefs?7

Anyway there were people with loud speakers giving out free copies of the Qu'ran in English on Saturday, and hari krishna people giving out their little books and a load of Jehovah's witnesses round the corner with piles of their leaflets..and Scientologists trying to persuade us to take stress tests!! Thankfully we live in a country where religious tolerance is part of normal everyday life.. and my view is that tolerance should be part of a child's education and if that means exposing them to different viewpoints then so be it. As long as schools are used to educate and not recruit then I'm happy enough.

noeffingidea · 15/02/2018 15:15

I agree, OP. RE should only be taught in lessons, in the context of other subjects - history, sociology, art, literature, etc.
Schools are not the place for evangelising. Children can find out about religion for themselves if they want to, all the information is already out there.

Dodie66 · 15/02/2018 15:17

Do they have other religions dong assembly too? If so what’s the problem

listsandbudgets · 15/02/2018 15:18

pingupanini oddly enough, the Scientologists UK head quarters are about 15 minutes walk from where I'm currently sitting. They constantly put up notices inviting people to free events - they'd probaby jump if they got a chance at a local school

tomhazard · 15/02/2018 15:18

I agree op. My parents were fierce atheists and pulled me out of the Gideon assembly in my non-religious school. I would be annoyed if this happened in my DC school.

Valentinesfart · 15/02/2018 15:19

Bible is chockfull of revolutionary ideology about how God will lift up the poor and hungry and humble the rich and powerful. Fucking outrageous.

Yes, the bible is big on letting the poor think God will help them out at the end. Makes them feel better about all the money that the rich and powerful and godly have I suppose.

Kittypillar · 15/02/2018 15:23

Absolutely agree with you on this OP - religion should be taught like any other subject within school.

Valentinesfart · 15/02/2018 15:23

valantinesfart I certainly did not lose my shit when DD was given a qu'ran. About half the children in her class are Muslim - is there any particular reason why I should mind her being exposed to their beliefs?Anyway there were people with loud speakers giving out free copies of the Qu'ran in English on Saturday, and hari krishna people giving out their little books and a load of Jehovah's witnesses round the corner with piles of their leaflets..and Scientologists trying to persuade us to take stress tests!! Thankfully we live in a country where religious tolerance is part of normal everyday life.. and my view is that tolerance should be part of a child's education and if that means exposing them to different viewpoints then so be it. As long as schools are used to educate and not recruit then I'm happy enough.

I'm sure it's never occured to you that there might be a problem with islamphobia in the country. Let me direct you to any thread on MN about halal meat or Islam because I am sure you aren't being disingenuous, you've just never noticed. Hmm

Anyway, while it's great to be tolerant, we don't tend to teach the children any other made up nonsense is true do we? No, so I am happy for every child to get their indoctrination at home, but it is not tolerant or respectful to teach my children a load of made up shit.

pingupanini · 15/02/2018 15:24

@listsandbudgets oh wow really? I'm tempted to go to one now out of curiosity though I slightly fear it would be a sales pitch rather than a free event

I don't have any money right now. If saving the world depends on me giving them money I would feel pretty shit being unable to helpSad

I'm now also tempted to pretend I am a school teacher and phone to find out if they do assemblies. I have too much housework to get on with fortunately though Grin

Valentinesfart · 15/02/2018 15:28

they won't want you if you haven't got any money.

Seriously I'd dereg my children if they ever let Scientology into the school. When I get angry about Chrisitan indoctrination I remember that it's not actually doing a great job of keeping followers. Scientology grabs people and doesn't let go.

JoeyMaynardssolidlump · 15/02/2018 15:36

What about those of us who have no choice over a religious school?

Both our first and middle school choices were C/E now that’s just wrong in my book.

listsandbudgets · 15/02/2018 15:38

Valentines - I have to say that although I'm aware there is Islamophobia, I live in such a diverse area it does not really impact us - Muslims are just part of our local community. They are my children's friends, my neighbours, the staff and owners of local shops,. The nearest mosque usually pop a leaflet through the door to invite us to a meal at Eid and you can go or not and they never ask us to wear headscarves either though I tend to as a sign of respect.

CraftyGin · 15/02/2018 15:39

So much hatred on this thread. #sad. #jesuswept.

Eolian · 15/02/2018 15:43

So much hatred on this thread. #sad. #jesuswept.

I don't hate religious people. I feel a bit sorry for them. Presumably, CraftyGin, you wouldn't be very happy if people from a religion you deeply disagreed with came and distributed their literature to your young and impressionable children? Why do you find it so #sad Hmm that other people object to this?

listsandbudgets · 15/02/2018 15:45

Pingup if you phone let me know... I'd love to hear a recording of the call! I have to be honest and say that given their reputation as a cult they are an organisation I'd prefer not to be involved with schools... as I said above as long as people invivted in are being used to educate and not recruit, I'm happy... not certain that the scientologists wouldn't use it as an opportunity to recruit.

They do quite a bit of community work in our area - there are a few alleyways that would be still fly tipping dumps where it not for the good works of our local scientologists Grin

BertrandRussell · 15/02/2018 15:45

No hatred. Don’t be silly.

Queenofthedrivensnow · 15/02/2018 15:45

My very alternative hippy school allowed the Gideons in now and then. It wasn't my choice but largely it's fine. It's one assembly