Understanding 'Fat logic'

[Bluetree]

To help me understand fat logic-y 'lifestyle changes' like Slimming World?

Aspartame full muller light yogurt is 'free'. Yet, a natural full fat yogurt is synned.

An avacado is highly synned yet you can have two of their Hifi bars as an extra which have a high % of fat in!

Mashing a banana doesn't go without it's syns either!

Advised against proper exercise as 'muscle weighs more than fat' - Ha.

I followed for a while and did lose weight. I'm not saying it doesn't work. Just that a lot of it is fat logic-y rubbish!

(I'm not talking about the ones who 'eat clean' while doing it and don't touch a muller light or hifi bar)

In which case nothing weighs more than anything. The concept of weight is entirely meaningless

Well when people talk about losing weight, they actually mean losing mass. Quickest way to lose weight, assuming it doesn't take long to get there, would be to go somewhere with lower gravity, like the moon. Weight on the moon is a fraction of what it is on earth.

Quickest way to lose weight, assuming it doesn't take long to get there, would be to go somewhere with lower gravity, like the moon.

And that would probably cost less than 30 years of yo-yo dieting at various slimming clubs...

That's the problem though isn't it? SW should be running a programme teaching good health and sustainable lifestyle changes to its members. Not luring them into a cycle of yoyo dieting.

Why? They aren't the NHS. They aren't government funded. They aren't responsible for my health - I am.

Slimming world are a business who offer a service to help people who choose to use them lose weight. That is all they promise. Weight loss. Not to save the world from diet related ill health or to share the secret of eternal life

What would be good would be if SW and WW stopped weighing their members during weekly meetings and measured their body fat instead, but that would probably take too long. Because what people are really trying to do is lose excess body fat.

Weight is only an indicator of a person's body fat, obviously muscle mass and hydration levels also vary, which partly explains why people can have followed the diet and not lost weight, because other aspects of their body composition has changed too.

Madamminacious

www.slimmingworld.co.uk/recipes/diet-cola-chicken.aspx

www.slimmingworld.co.uk/landing/free.aspx- advising to drink between 6-8 glasses of fluid, including sugar-free drinks

images.slimmingworld.com/features/pyramid-sweets/SWPublic/sweets.pdf

This is just from a quick google search.

exercise alone won't make you thin.
It will if you exercise enough to create a calorie deficit for long enough to lose any excess fat.

I've tried SW and found it's just too many carbs. If I eat as much pasta as I like, I will be the size of a house.
And I'm fairly confident they pick numbers at random when awarding food syns.

Also my slimming world leader was awful. Just like the one off little Britain.

Why? They aren't the NHS. They aren't government funded. They aren't responsible for my health - I am

That is rubbish. The government pays for people to attend SW through the NHS so they are 100% responsible for making it about good long-term health rather than short-term weight loss. They benefit from public money.

I’ve tried SW and WW over the years. Lost weight on both ( more on WW) but as soon as I stopped put back on more. I’m now going to the gym and lifting weights lots together with Hiit swimming and cycling - thrown scales away feeling slimmer, fitter and more energised than for maybe the last ten years

SW baffled me. I did lose weight on it but I felt totally unhealthy and logically I knew the swaps I was making weren't great.

I was also advised against exercise. I always look my best when I'm training regularly but my consultant banged on about how it doesn't do anything at all for weight loss, it can make you hungrier and it's not necessary for the plan.

Oh and the meetings are worse than little Britain

PoorYorrick the experience I described is 100% true. It might be different elsewhere, but this was my local club and I attended one session and then never went back. I am sure there are very good leaders, but where is the scrutiny to ensure that there aren't rubbish one like the one I went to? Also, I am sure that even the good leaders are under some pressure to sell the awful and unhealthy WW and SW food.

I did sw for years, until discovering high fat/ low carb. I found that sw’s mentality is that we cannot possibly be satisfied and therefore will never succeed at a diet unless we are absolutely stuffed to the gills, plates piled high (even if that’s with veg), and never go hungry (they use this in their sales patter)- therefore they appeal to those people particularly who have ‘failed’ at low calorie diets before, or who believe they will fail again. The only way to achieve any weight loss with these huge portions is to cut out fat, which is their particular Strategy. There’s a lot more low fat/low cal products out there than there are high fat/low cal (so HFLC dieters have to reduce portions to reduce calories). I think they exploit people’s fear of ‘failure’ to a degree.

I will say though, it works for some people in the groups and changes lives for them. But I prefer to look at the consultants- mine had been a consultant for 10 years, ran loads of groups, was area manager- but still never quite got to target. That told me everything I needed to know and I left the group.

Well Susan I'm pretty sure the NHS didn't decide to send people to slimming world on the basis of a sales pitch. I'm guessing they do so because have looked at the plan and have established that it's a safe and healthy weight to lose weight...

And they still aren't government funded. The NHS pay for their services along with a large number of other customers.

Some of the stuff on SW is a big pile of shite but the basic premise is good - fill up on vegetables and fruit, have some carbs and lean meat, a small amount of healthy fats, and measured amounts of junk. I agree re Muller lights and avocados, I still eat avocados and don’t syn them and can’t stand muller lights. They don’t discourage exercise IME. Some people like me have severely disordered eating despite knowing all the theory and what we should do and if following SW helps them out where’s the harm?

Sorry Susan, I wasn't suggesting you were lying. I'm absolutely sure that was your experience. I'm just surprised because mine has been so different.

Agreed they have an incentive to push the products. Mine always had quite the soft sell on them though. They were mentioned but I never felt pushed.

I've tried SW and found it's just too many carbs. If I eat as much pasta as I like, I will be the size of a house.

But you are lying here then as SW doesn't tell you that you have to eat carbs?

To the people that say 'I put the weight back on when I stopped doing it' ... like DUH! Thats the point isnt it? Its a lifestyle change, not a quick fix diet programme that says go back to eating crap and you'll keep the weight off

these threads always go the same way. People bashing the muiller lights blah blah blah. Everyone obsessing about the mug shots and pasta. No-one focuses on the lean meats, vegetables, fish, fruit etc etc.

It doesn't work for you that's fine, why not just let the people that it works for get on with it?

You can't compare weight by weighing two things to get the same weight, and then comparing it.

A pound of sand does weigh as much as a pound of feathers.

That doesnt' mean someone can accurately say "Sand is no heavier than feathers." Everyone knows sand is heavier (by volume!).

A cup of sand will be heavier than a cup of feathers.

When people say muscle is heavier than fat, they also mean by volume. A cup of muscle would weigh more than a cup of fat. That's how you can go down dress sizes whilst going up on the scale.

Oh and the person saying about commission on hi-fi bars, the consultants make 10p on each box they sell so for every complete carton sold they make £1.50. Somehow I don't think they are living it up on the commission.

What I don't like about SW amd WW is that they will accept anyone who wants to lose weight, irrespective of whether they need to, as long as their target weight is not below the minimum healthy weight for their height. So someone 5ft 1 who weighs 7.5 st and wants to get down to 7st would be accepted. I think that's unethical and encourages dissatisfaction with perfectly healthy bodies.

I mean, it's a bit like saying champagne costs no more than bottled water, because £20 of champagne and £20 of water both cost the same.

Not a useful comparison that way.

Water doesn't work anyway, I feel thirsty when I stop drinking it.

The people here who have been to it more than once demonstrate that it doesn't work for them.

If that is really what they say then it is a crime against science.