I’m sure you’ll say I am... but I’m watching the Rose McGowan documentary...

[MaryPoppinsPenguins]

I understand and completely feel for her that she went through (two or more?) sexual assaults.

But I’m watching her documentary, and she talks a lot about ‘this one is awful because they didn’t speak out’ etc...

But she didn’t. (As so many didn’t.) and she took a settlement. It’s a bit hypocritical to call people out when you yourself didn’t speak out also?

Watching everyone wear black at the golden globes and wear roses at the Grammys is amazing... but surely everyone attacked after your settlement would be on your mind? Why attack everyone else?

Maybe I don’t get it, but I’m happy to corrected. Its frustrating to watch because she’s so gorgeous and brilliant in scream and planet terror... why take the silence pay?!

I agree with that, she is trying to own sexual violence and be the arbiter of the response to sexual assaults. I have to say I think she’s enjoying her new found role, and the critical adoration she receives is unhealthy.

By accepting a settlement she turned a blind eye

By accepting a settlement she followed the advice of her lawyers. According to others in similar situations, their lawyers were very bullish on the point that a settlement was the closest they would get to any kind of justice.
She doesn't have to behave a certain way to deserve respect or/and compassion.
Uma Thurman's interview also seems to concur with Rose's stance on the CAA. Plus Ronan Farrow's expose on HW's methods (including employing former Mossad agents and using the media/social media to discredit his accusers) proves exactly how much he worked to smear, discredit and blackball women.
Am I the only one that's tired of people who would rather target women's responses than shine a light on the male perpetrators?

I think you misunderstand, I agree we should be shining a light on the male perpetrators... but her behaviour is detracting from that at this point.

but her behaviour is detracting from that at this point.

So once again it's the woman's fault if society cannot see past a traumatised woman doing the best she can in the circumstances she is in.

"She's not behaving like a perfect victim, so let's concentrate on her instead of on the vile men who assaulted and raped."

No. Acknowledge that she is in a very bad place right now and acknowledge that it is the RAPISTS who put her in that very bad place.

Instead of detracting from the issue, she is showing a chilling example of what can happen to your psyche if you are systemically abused, assaulted and raped.

Watching everyone wear black at the golden globes and wear roses at the Grammys is amazing... Is it though? What good does it actually do? Has it lead to anything solid happening to prevent/deal with it?
Was it just a way of saying "we stand by you, but this is all you are worth"

but her behaviour is detracting from that at this point. How should she be behaving, op?

#istandwithrose

She has a huge platform at the moment to make a change, do you honestly believe she’s not just hurting her cause at the moment? Because it’s very easy to # this and # that... but be honest, she’s making this a bit of a joke at this point. Just read the comments on any article. People aren’t going to look back and think ‘wow, she really changed a whole messed up industry’ they’re going to think ‘Rose McGowan, attention seeker, hot mess’ (taken from aforementioned comments)

Women have always been accusing of “hurting the cause” by being too angry but the quickness with which people jump to accuse women of this shows that they have little interest in the cause itself.

Even when you have a “perfect victim”, as in the case of Larry Nassar’s 9-13 year olds, there are still accusations of attention seeking and gold digging.

Stop paying attention to the reaction, and look instead at what they are reacting against.

I think there is some peculiarity in American law with settlements, in that, if you refuse a settlement and then costs go higher, or something, you end up with costs awarded against you. I can't remember. Will a legal person please confirm that?

Basically, there is a legal pressure to accept a settlement. It's not as simple as taking money to shut up.

she’s making this a bit of a joke at this point. Nice.

So you are demanding of her exactly what Andi Dier is demanding, that unless she can advocate in the way YOU want her to, she should shut up?

And you ask why it takes so long for victims to come forward? They can't just be seen as a victim, or a survivor they have to take on the whole establishment for everyone.

You know what...who else is standing up and using the "platform"

Women wearing black?
Women wearing roses?

Get real!! And who the hell she WANTS to change a whole fucking industry, or even should??

But she didn’t. (As so many didn’t.) and she took a settlement. It’s a bit hypocritical to call people out when you yourself didn’t speak out also?

^I agree

Rose is now 44. She settled in 1997, when she was 22/23.

I am sure we have all made choices 20 odd years ago that weren't the best choices, and at a young age too.

The settlement is a red herring here. People need to stop beating her with it.

The people who jump to criticise her are the people who were looking for an excuse to file the entire movement under 'attention seeking mess' and go back to their lives. It's a way to avoid examining their own behaviour, their own culpability whether they're a parent teaching their children strict gender roles that enforce skewed relationship ideals or a man leering over his work colleague or a woman feeling smug that she only wears modest clothes and doesn't go to hotel room meetings.
The people who matter will see clearly what is playing out here.
The people who need victim-hood to be sanitised and perfect, will always find a way that women are lacking. That's their failing, not Rose's.
If Rose isn't speaking to or for you, then you're not her audience. She doesn't need to invest more energy changing her messaging trying to bring you on board.

If you think the comments under articles are a good way of telling if someone is right or not, I suggest you don't understand structural oppression. Refugees, gay people women, black people... the comments are always the same. At least half nasty, abusive bigots spouting hate. As people have pointed out; comments under Larry Nasser articles. Also Brock Turner. Also Ched Evans, who HIMSELF said be neither sought nor obtained consent.

If you saw someone hit by a car, would you wonder why they weren't calling 999 or why the people who witnessed them weren't? If the only hope they had to have any justice was a settlement, would you blame them for taking it? Would you call them out for speaking out about drunk driving in the future? Of course not. It's only women who survive rape who are expected to be perfect.

It’s not about being right. It’s about the overwhelming opinion of her behaviour when she could have used this platform to make a difference.

Fraying speaks sense.
OP, how would you like your celebrity victims to behave? What is the code of conduct for victims? Why do you think you are moved to start a thread about how someone vulnerable who has suffered terribly should behave differently to what you expect?
She is not perfect. She has strong opinions and she voices them. She is human, and she is the victim here. Many, may victims of sexual abuse didn't react in the way society expects them to. They may have kept on working with their abuser(s), even socialised with them, they may have dealt with the situation in a way that would seem odd to outsiders.

Some of those victims may be reading this right now, and it would confirm their fear that yes, there is a wrong way to be a victim, and yes, they will be judged.
Shame on you.

She is making a difference.
It may not be how you would have acted. It may not be how HW would have liked her to act (quiet, acquiesing, ashamed). She is using her platform for her and that's still a radical step for a woman even in 2018.

Trauma is uncomfortable and it doesn't present in an easy way
Exactly. And thinking the opposite is very dangerous, for example, the girls who were targeted by gangs in Rochdale were held to not be acting as it was thought a victim should behave, hence giving a perfect excuse to people who should have known better to blame and ignore rather than aim the blame where it should be aimed.

#IstandwithRose

The overwhelming opinion of idiots is idiocy. Unsurprisingly.

It could be coming from a good place. She's angry that women knowingly put themselves in danger. Kind of how we'd scream at the kids when they run out in the road. She knows, after all, how it feels to suffer at the hands of those men. Ultimately she doesn't want it to happen to others, now.

Surely there’s a huge difference between a victim of assault who doesn’t report the crime at the time and the people who know someone is an abuser and yet choose to remain silent?

Have a word with yourself OP!

No one gets to decide how victims of rape should and shouldn’t behave. Victims of sexual assault or abuse owe the public nothing - and I can’t even being to understand how you can think that they do. Rose is perfectly entitled to deal with being raped in the way she sees fit, she owes you NOTHING, she isn’t a figurehead for rape victims, she is a rape victim.

You are setting yourself up nicely to get in the victim blaming mindset.

Ok so she settled 20 years ago.
Just for a moment think about society 20 years ago.
20 years ago rape victims who were brave enough to go to court were also put on the stand to have their lives ripped apart. This was also the time that people really believed the victim deserved it based on their clothing or lifestyles.
Rape convictions have always been dire hence a lot of people don’t bother reporting.

Mix into this he was big in Hollywood and Hollywood isn’t that big. She was a young female and if she had spoke out no one would have believed her. Think about it. People would have said she was bitter because she didn’t get the role she auditioned for. Look at now and the people who are standing by him.

Under the advice of someone she would have gone for a settlement. Why? To feel validated probably. You don’t get a big pay out for nothing. She could have used the cash for therapy to overcome the trauma, this was possibly also presented to her.

Now fast forward 20 years later and his victims are slowly starting to speak out. And yes there will be more who still aren’t brave enough. She has to live with the knowledge of this payout that she wasn’t brave enough to speak out.
I think what you are witnessing is the immense guilt she must be feeling. The same guilt victims have.

And she was amazing at the B&N thing for which she is getting lots of abuse on Twitter.

Yes what’s really important when you’ve been raped is how you act before, during and after. Otherwise how can you expect anyone to understand you or be on your side? Ffs.

And who reads the comments anymore on articles never mind quote them? It’s where all the lowlifes congregate to share their casual racism and misogyny.

It’s about the overwhelming opinion of her behaviour when she could have used this platform to make a difference.

But why should she? Why can't she just heal in her own way? Perhaps when this has all blown over, she might...

Many many others were abused by him, why can't they use their "platform" to make a difference? Why only Rose? Or is it because she is making too much much noise for your liking?

Juts like her abuser, and the whole of the establishment, you are seeking to control her.