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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think that 'first world problem' is a pretty shit thing to say?

89 replies

Mallorie · 29/01/2018 07:49

For so many reasons...

  • do you really think people in 'third world countries' are so busy being poor that they don't care about what their hair looks like in the rain, or what kind of drink to serve when their friends come over, or which school to send their kids to, or what car to buy? This shouldn't be news to anyone, but people in Brazil and Nigeria and bloody Finland (yes, Finland is considered a third world country in the original definition, check out the wikipedia age) care about their hair and schools and cars and it just sounds classist/racist/ignorant to use a tired joke over and over that doesn't recognise this.
  • are you blind to the massive levels of inequality and poverty in your own 'first world' country?
  • the original divisions of the 'worlds' are based on this: 1st: UK/US and their important allies. 2nd: China/(then) USSR and their allies 3rd: Everyone else, which conveniently were mainly British and European colonies at some point. So, for us here in the UK to express our superiority to these countries every time we complain about non-life threatening problems just seems nasty.
OP posts:
ConfusedWife1234 · 29/01/2018 11:36

I always thought first world countries are rich capitalist countries, second world countries are socialist/communist and third world countries are poor capitalist countries. Is this not the case?

wakemeupbefore · 29/01/2018 11:47

This thread clearly illustrates that general knowledge of general public needs to be upped, in general Hmm
UK is not amongst the 15 richest countries in the world yet all the navel gazing that goes on in elated circles of Boris, Jacob and the like would make one believe it is the centre of the universe.
How about the kind posters, who vehemantly decree that the phrase in question in no way offends those who, by exclusion, are implied to be not as important as ones uttering said phrase (...and breathe...) tried asking some bona fide second/third/etc world citizens what they think and whether they feel belitteled by it?

Eltonjohnssyrup · 29/01/2018 12:12

Um, okay. I went to boarding school with a lot of African girls who are upper middle class. Yes, I think they think about those problems. BUT this sort of thing has come up before on MN and I've discussed it with them and they are amazed how out of touch some people are about what life is like for more ordinary in the 3rd world in Africa. I'll give you some examples of them relating to your post:

- do you really think people in 'third world countries' are so busy being poor that they don't care about what their hair looks like in the rain

They're often more worried if it will rain at all. 65% of sub Saharan Africans are subsistence farmers and many more depend on agriculture. So when it rains, most subsaharan Africans are busy running around collecting water and checking their irrigation systems. Not worrying about how their hair looks.

or what kind of drink to serve when their friends come over

1 in 9 people in the world don't have access to a safe or clean water supply. Getting water is often an arduous and lengthy process and quite often the water you do get can make you very sick or kill you. This is a particular problem in subsaharan Africa again, there you are more likely to be worrying about anybody in your family having anything to drink rather than if red or white or fizz is more appropriate.

which school to send their kids to

In subsaharan Africa only 22% of primary aged children are not in school. Only 63% of adults are literate.

The primary worry would be being able to access education for your children. Not which school they should go to. In rural areas there is usually no choice at all and children travel long distances on foot to be educated.

or what car to buy?

In most subsaharan African countries car ownership is very low, as little as 2 per 1,000 people in Somalia and Togo and 3 in Bangladesh.

I find it quite strange people don't seem to realise that western lifestyles aren't everywhere and that they really are for a privileged few in poorer countries.

Chanelprincess · 29/01/2018 12:17

*Crumbs In reality none of life’s challenges in the U.K. compare to those of the villages we’ve passed through today...

Erm, I think they do actually. How are you measuring this? Someone with severe PTSD that goes unrecognised in our system who freezes to death homeless on our streets after a lifetime of abuse?*

I agree with Crumbs...as someone who has lived in developing countries, the poverty we experience in the UK - while completely unacceptable - is not comparable with what I've seen and never ever will be.

Eltonjohnssyrup · 29/01/2018 12:25

I'm not that surprised about Ireland being on the original list. DH grew up there in the 70s and they were essentially subsistence farmers for a while. They weren't connected to the electricity grid or water mains. They had a generator and a pump from a spring. Still no gas mains.

MissMoneyPlant · 29/01/2018 12:58

Chanel as someone who has lived in developing countries, the poverty we experience in the UK - while completely unacceptable - is not comparable with what I've seen and never ever will be.

So you're only including financial poverty as suffering then?

SchrodingersFrilledLizard · 29/01/2018 13:00

YABU.

Chanelprincess · 29/01/2018 13:29

MissMoneyPlant absolutely not - where did you read this in my post?

I refer also to stigma associated with lack of education, for example towards psychiatric disorders and hereditary diseases such as Down's syndrome; lack of access to medicines e.g. no chemotherapy or dialysis in a country where the population is predisposed to developing T2DM, use poor quality generics (I'm talking about drugs produced in India with very poor efficacy and not the generics used in our NHS); hardship associated with accessing education...I worked with one family who moved to a different island and lived together in a makeshift tent near the beach during term time so that their children could go to school.

ConfusedWife1234 · 29/01/2018 13:40

Princess So if a person or their loved one lost both legs/have cancer/suffered a brain injury they should just be happy to life in a cancer that has a health system and should up because in GB there Isa Halethorpe system and suffering a minor traumatic brain injury would be worse in India than it was in GB or did I get you wrong?

Chanelprincess · 29/01/2018 13:43

Isa Halethorpe system???

ConfusedWife1234 · 29/01/2018 13:45

There is a health system. Sorry my autocorrect sometimes switches to other languages. Annoying.

araiwa · 29/01/2018 13:50

So if a person or their loved one lost both legs/have cancer/suffered a brain injury they should just be happy to life in a cancer that has a health system and should up because in GB there Isa Halethorpe system and suffering a minor traumatic brain injury would be worse in India than it was in GB or did I get you wrong?

Individually, I understand most of these words. Collectively, i have no idea

MrsPreston11 · 29/01/2018 13:51

You're over thinking it.

I say it for things like when my electric blanket is making me too hot in bed etc.

it's just a way of saying "what a stupid thing to moan about, I know I'm bloody lucky"

Chanelprincess · 29/01/2018 13:55

In terms of health outcomes for the conditions you mention, the UK would undoubtedly be associated with better outcomes and less morbidity and mortality. I'm reluctant to use the term suffering but if you consider that flying to a different country at your own expense and then paying for treatment and accommodation whilst you receive that treatment would be the only option for cancer then yes, the suffering of a person in the UK would be less both physically and emotionally (the financial aspect can be removed from the argument because in the UK treatment is provided on the NHS). For the other conditions, in the country to which I am referring, it would rely on a specialist giving up their time to visit the country for free to provide care for these patients - thankfully many of them do this, but as you can imagine, the waiting list is long and their visits are infrequent. While I don't think it's wrong to complain, I think it's important to keep some perspective.

araiwa · 29/01/2018 13:57

Third world nations were those not allied with either the american or russian sides during the cold war.

Nothing to do with economy

ConfusedWife1234 · 29/01/2018 13:59

Araiwa I am sorry, my autocorrect messed it up. I wanted to ask what princess was expecting.

Yes, people are better of in a first world country than in a third world country. A person, who both legs, has cancer or suffered a minor traumatic brain injury will be better if in GB than in Ghana (unless he belongs to the local upper class there). However I still think it would be a bit unfair to tell people that should be happy they only suffered a brain injury and did not suffer a brain injury AND life in Ghana.
At least as long as the speaker did not suffer a brain injury himself/herself and has no idea what it is like.

There are many problems apart from poverty. That is what I wanted to say. Sorry, English is not really my native language.

ConfusedWife1234 · 29/01/2018 14:02

Oh, I see what you mean princess but on the other hand I would rather be poor than have cancer. IF I had to choose one of both.
Thankfully I am not poor and have no cancer and can count myself lucky.

araiwa · 29/01/2018 14:07

If you are poor, living in a poor country you would probably not even know you had cancer. You would be ill, not know why and just hope you get better, stay at home, hope your family could take care of you, then die without knowing why

ConfusedWife1234 · 29/01/2018 14:09

I get that, but my question was if people who have cancer and live in a rich country should just shut up and count themselves lucky they do not live in Ghana and if it was okay to tell them they have first world problems... cause I think that would not be right.

LambMadras · 29/01/2018 14:10

Crickey. Get a hobby and stop looking for things to be offended by.

The world is going mad.

ConfusedWife1234 · 29/01/2018 14:12

Talking to me? Yep, I think it would be offensive to think that only poor people can have problems. I might have gotten wrong what she said. That is why I was asking.
I was born in a much poorer country than GB by the way (it is not poor anymore).

araiwa · 29/01/2018 14:12

Having cancer is not a "first world problem" ffs

ConfusedWife1234 · 29/01/2018 14:15

Actually princess started discussing how cancer was worse in a third world country. That is why I asked. It sounded as if cancer was only bad under third world conditions.

LambMadras · 29/01/2018 14:16

Confusedwife I was talking to the OP

Eltonjohnssyrup · 29/01/2018 14:31

Third world nations were those not allied with either the american or russian sides during the cold war.

I didn't know that, it's very interesting. But it does now mean developing counties in Asia, Africa and S America. I checked the dictionary definition and it is a correct usage.