AIBU to think this godforsaken country is a shambles?

[Toysintheattic29]

THIS IS WHAT’S ON MY MIND: this country is in shambles. I’ve never seen so many homeless people on the streets; social care services unable to cope with overflowing caseloads; our precious NHS struggling to care for anyone at all (forget it if you have non life-threatening surgical needs or are elderly); train fares continually getting jacked up; rising costs; roads cracking up; broadband speeds laughably slow and the biggest con of all, BREXIT. Even in the austerity of the 1950s things were not as grim as they are now - at least we had a reliable health service and publicly owned transport systems and many members of the public didn’t have to rely on food banks.

Sparkly "They have responsibilities to employees, knowing if they make the wrong business decision or investment they are putting incomes and families at risk and they have to live with that. "

do you think people like Philip Green care about that?

The problem is that when people suggest it could need reform etc it is assumed we are heading down the US route.

The problem is one side is taking us down the US route.

They have responsibilities to employees, knowing if they make the wrong business decision or investment they are putting incomes and families at risk and they have to live with that.

And those financiers darnedsure weren't thinking about it when they were stamping AAA on junk loans.

The problem is one side is taking us down the US route.

No there isn't make, the book does not count it's a meme at this point.

You are the perfect example of people using it as a political football and just suggest that the solution is to keep throwing money at it, and then conveniently ignore PFI deals as being blue labour or some other shite.

makeourfuture "And those financiers darnedsure weren't thinking about it when they were stamping AAA on junk loans"

exactly. And all the businesses, mergers, takeovers, restructuring, redundancy - these people do not give a shit about the livelihoods of their staff.

also, when you look at these rich people "threatening" to leave, where will they go and will they still run their businesses anyway? And the jobs they are providing are being replaced by tech.

a pp said - sarcastically I think - it's a wonder people are still having children and I said yes, it is a wonder! And I really do wonder, especially people who have larger families, don't come from the kind of wealth that gets them Toby Young jobs and think there will be jobs for their children.

I call it corporate cannon fodder - there might be something, but it won't be much, the employment rights will be removed, the expectations will be higher and higher and there will be a good number of people replaced by tech.

IMO the NHS needs to stop being used as a political football,

I have said this for years. Doubt it will happen though.

Even Drs on this morning were saying it.

A non party political talk anywhere the NHS is going.

I have very good and terrible treatment under all governments. No party has a monopoly on this despite what some spout.

And all the businesses, mergers, takeovers, restructuring, redundancy - these people do not give a shit about the livelihoods of their staff.

This is quite a weird point to make considering you talk about automation, if every merger/takeover, restructuring etc where only made on decisions of the livelihoods of their staff we would not be talking on a free forum using computers/phones and still eating seasonal veg that can be grown in the UK and harvested by hand.

A dump and run poster.

I was born in World War 2 OP - spent my childhood and most of my teen years in the 1950s. How old were you in the 1950s?

I’ve lived in Australia for years now and the healthcare service is 100 times better- and it’s totally free if you need it to be, do your research properly!

Many oncology specialists I work with consider Australia to be on a par with some developing countries in terms of access to some cancer drugs, particularly targeted therapies. DH's uncle is currently receiving treatment for prostate cancer and his management plan is far behind what is currently being offered in the UK for a patient with similar staging, prognosis etc

You know, I often say “ah this Country, it’s not great anymore”

But look into what residents of other countries are treated like,

We plan to move to the states for example, this is a long way off yet,

The way people are treated isn’t far from barbaric, if you don’t have the money, you often don’t get the treatment, here if you stumble on hard times you can get housing benefit- there is an approximate waiting list of 3 years for an American citizen to be able to get help with their rent.....3 years!

Honestly, knowing how it is for other people in other countries, I’m not sure that Britain’s so bad.

People who say the rich spend their money on shops and so on ........
Where do you think their wealth comes from in the first place. Basically it's wages we've never had.

Snowdrop - I know a lot of high earning actuaries and lawyers who will up sticks to the caymans for a start. Medics and IT specialists won't struggle to relocate.

Cote Ever been ill in the USA?

Many oncology specialists I work with consider Australia to be on a par with some developing countries in terms of access to some cancer drugs, particularly targeted therapies. DH's uncle is currently receiving treatment for prostate cancer and his management plan is far behind what is currently being offered in the UK for a patient with similar staging, prognosis etc

Is that what that is about?

Makes sense. An Aussie friend of mine was trying to get private treatment for her dad here or the USA. I didn't understand why as prostate cancer has an established treatment protocol.

Now I get it.

Where do you think their wealth comes from in the first place. Basically it's wages we've never had.

Only if you see things as simplistic binary terms it is.

Capital flight is a real thing, you only have to look at France most recently under Hollande

I remember a time when child benefit used to be deducted from the amount of income support you got.

So children or not your benefits always added up to the amount of income support as you couldn't get one on top of the other.

Now it is on top of and tax credits and passport benefits.

Clothing is cheaper, there were no £4 asda school skirts when I was little.

Ever been ill in the USA?

Yes, broken leg. Cost $300 which wasn’t too bad. I was seen instantly and the care was excellent.

$300 for a broken leg is pretty good. We paid $120 to have a doctor look in ds1's ear and diagnose an ear infection.

Actually that's a lie. He looked in both ears.

"Cote Ever been ill in the USA?"

A relative I was traveling with was. His quick treatment with multiple high-tech scans within a few hours, consultation with two specialists, as well as hospital stay in private room was covered by travel insurance.

It was a great experience overall. No waiting around for ages. No being fobbed off by a GP. No substandard equipment and care because there isn't enough funding to drag the system to the 21st Century.

If all you know is the NHS, you have no idea how healthcare can be. Hell, even France is absolute light-years ahead of the UK in healthcare.

Americans only get better or the same level of healthcare if their insurance can cover it

Can you imagine in this country having one conversation about how someone’s accident is probably life changing and the next conversation a few minutes later you are having is about what the insurance will cover or about remortgaging you home to cover the costs of necessary care that is the reality is the states

Things are not great in the UK at the moment I think the West to some degree has peaked and in many western countries progression in the share of wealth is slowing down and the gap between those that have a lot and those that have a little is growing. The US, France, Italy and Spain is suffering with people living below the poverty line

I remember the late 70’s and early 80’s well things are better now also the 90’s homelessness was a much bigger problem certainly in London but we are going (along with other countries) backwards

YABU - there are many things that could be improved in the U.K. - there are problems with NHS and infrastructure and welfare provided for those are poor/disabled. (I have commented about my worries on other threads.) However I count my blessings I don't live in many other countries.

Godforsaken and shambles -
The CIA estimates for 2016 Infant mortality (number of children under 1 that die per 1000 born)
UK at 4.4 can definitely improve, Japan 2 but in Afghanistan 112

The United Nations states that in North America and Europe 3.2% of primary school age children are out of school. In sub Saharan Africa that rises to 20.6

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_infant_mortality_rate

uis.unesco.org/sites/default/files/documents/reducing-global-poverty-through-universal-primary-secondary-education.pdf

My DH is on some international forums discussion the rare disease and treatment he has had. He often comments on how many people from many different countries (including the USA) are asking how they can fund their treatments, or worrying that their insurance has run out, so further treatment (cancer) will not be forthcoming. I am eternally grateful we don't have to worry about cost as well as everything else.

Fuzzy

I’m the same as your husband with a rare disease. I also talk to people across the world about it and where as I don’t have to think about cost they have the added stresses of trying to persuade their insurance companies.

I’d rather have my treatment decided by a doctor and not an insurance assessor.

Other countries having it worse doesn't mean we have to put up with anything as long as it's better than that here. People being left to starve in other places doesn't mean it's ok for disabled people to be pushed into poverty here, the elderly to have their care packages cut or families having to go to foodbanks.

Can't we aim a bit higher than just not being as bad as some other places and we should shut up and be grateful?

And Britain really isn't that Great. We have an inflated sense of our importance, forgetting that our ability to punch above our weight globally was built on the backs of a lot of poor people, both here and abroad.