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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Taxi driver brief argument

98 replies

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 18:39

I may get slated a bit because this involves taxis and car-seats but here it goes anyway.

Me and extended family were going to a restaurant. We booked the taxi and as it's a quiet road and would only be in the car about 5 mins, I made the call that it would be OK for my 1 year old to sit on my lap. We did have a car-seat but as we were taking the buggy already we just thought it was too much faff (hence why I'll probably get slated).

However, when the taxi driver arrived he flat-out refused to let DD in the car without a seat. Now, if this has been his company's private policy and he had explained that to me, I wouldn't have minded. That's fair enough. What annoyed me was his refusal to believe that it was even legal for me to do this. Even when I told him I'd done it before, he was brushing me off with 'oh no that can't have happened before, no'. His whole attitude towards me seemed to imply he thought I was lying about it being legal. It was just so dismissive and he seemed to be trying to hide a laugh at the same time.
DP went to get the car seat obviously, while I tried to show the taxi driver the government legislation on my phone... I know, high-horse, I should of let it go, but I just wanted to understand whether he truly believed it was illegal or whether it was just his taxis policy, but all I got was that air of 'silly woman, you must have misunderstood'.

In the end, we still got where we wanted to go with the car-seat, but AIBU about his attitude towards me ?

OP posts:

Original poster

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 19:53

I guess it was more the way he spoke to me rather than his refusal iyswim. Thanks for the replies

OP posts:

MarthaArthur · 03/12/2017 19:58

Tbf op its not on if you already cleared this with the company and they sent someone who was uncomfortable and refused it thats bad on the company part they should have explained it to the driver before he showed up

Ermm · 03/12/2017 19:59

Its quite plausible that he felt it was easier to just say its illegal rather than I won't do that because your baby might fly through the windscreen and die and the whole can of worms that saying that sort of thing could potential open.

My view is that you've been quite unreasonable and very annoying for him TBH.

But I get that's going anywhere with a baby is fraught and stressful and easy enough to go a bit fruitcakey.

Original poster

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 20:00

It wasn't the faff of putting it in the car @Milford, it was going to the restaurant and the park afterwards with the pushchair and the seat. But as I've said, I can accept I was BU to not use a seat, but he made me feel a bit delusional with the way he was. It sort of seemed like rather than using his own discretion - perfectly valid - he simply didn't even know it was legal?

OP posts:

IncyWincyGrownUp · 03/12/2017 20:02

I thought the no car seat rule only applied for short unexpected journeys? Your journey wasn’t unexpected, you were just being lazy.

Original poster

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 20:03

@Erm

It wasn't easier though, because that's false information and surely anyone who knew that would explain the taxi driver was wrong. Its surely easier to give correct info out to passengers which is that he is allowed to make that choice. Had he made his statement from a point of 'its legal only at the drivers discretion' then that's perfectly valid.

I'm probably pretty petty but things like that really get under my skin. Sorry

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Original poster

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 20:09

I just feel

"Sorry, I can refuse to take children without car-seat as it's at the driver's discretion"
Is far less likely to cause confrontation than "No it's illegal" (false) and then denying that I could ever have done that before in a taxi.

Perhaps he thought it would be easier but I really think he just didn't know. I don't get why he'd lie.

Its very rare that I'm in a car at all. Mostly buses and trains etc.

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OhBeggerItsMorning · 03/12/2017 20:09

As Eggys link shows, it's legal to take a child in the rear of a taxi with no car seat.
www.gov.uk/seat-belts-law says "You're also only allowed 1 person in each seat fitted with a seat belt." Therefore it is not legal to have them on your knee, even with the seat belt around both of you. If there is someone sitting on your knee and the taxi stops suddenly/has a crash etc. the person on your knee may end up squashed between you and the seat in front, or slide out at speed, I know I wouldn't want their injuries or death on my conscience.
Maybe the taxi driver was mixed up about laws regarding child seats and sitting on knees. Maybe the company's policy is to use a car seat, if so they should provide one, or let you know when ordering the taxi so you can be prepared yourself.
The taxi driver WBU trying to argue a law incorrectly.
YWBU trying to have a child on your knee.

Ermm · 03/12/2017 20:11

Well it wasn't easier because your reaction was over the top. A lot of people would have been quite embarrassed I imagine to insist that their child be taken in transport that the driver has refused on the grounds of safety.

There are so many things in the world to be pedantic and petty about. I think this is not the best use of pedantic resources.

Is it possibly that really this is because you feel bad that you did want your baby transported not in a car seat and really wanted to make the point that is not illegal (i.e. so not irresponsible parenting).

For what its worth - legal or not legal - I think its really irresponsible. One of those things where of course very very unlikely to go wrong but if it does go wrong catastrophic and a risk so very easily averted.

Original poster

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 20:12

@OhBegger

Well there you go, I didn't even know that! I guess we were both U. Very confused though as all taxis I have ever got without a seat have allowed me to have DD on my lap and not said anything about her sitting on her own.

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Ermm · 03/12/2017 20:15

Are you know annoyed about all the other taxi drivers not correctly implementing the law? Will you pick them up on this if they do let your DD sit on her own?

Original poster

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 20:15

Erm

I wasnt actually asking him to take my DD at this point. I had already said OK and DP had gone to collect a car seat that MIL keeps. I had already accepted to using the car seat, I was pissed off with the fact that he was refusing from an incorrect position, in that it is completely illegal to have them in a car without a seat at all. The seat was already on its way while we were having the convo.

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WineIsTheAnswer · 03/12/2017 20:16

Taxi driver probably gets a lot of grief from his customers and has a standard "nope can't do that, it's illegal" line and doesn't need to go further than that usually. He was probably surprised anyone would put what it says on the internet above the safety of their DC and those in the taxi with them.

For a 5 minute trip taxi drivers round here would have driven off without you, not worth the hassle of having someone sticking a phone under your nose while another messes about finding and removing a car seat to stick into the taxi.

Legally right doesn't mean you can force him to take you with the bare minimum level of safety. He has the right to refuse you and drive off, your lucky he stayed and put up with the inconvience and listening to you on your high-horse.

Original poster

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 20:18

I will ask them if they are aware, yes. I don't think it's good that all these taxi drivers are allowing people to travel improperly if it's illegal. The ones that have allowed me should have been aware that she couldn't sit on my knee. I think it all needed to be a bit more well known what exactly the laws are.

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justforthisnow · 03/12/2017 20:19

It's so fn annoying when people try to make sure your child lives past the age of 5 isn't it OP?
Like wtf does it have to do with them?
For future reference, belt your infant in with the seatbelt. Don't bother with a seat or a booster.If there is a collision, the belt will act as a garrot and the child in that seat will die within seconds as they will be garroted or decapitated more than likely.

Ermm · 03/12/2017 20:22

Are you now giving yourself a good telling off for also not correctly knowing the laws of taxi car travel as they apply to your own parenting legal duties?

ie - its not only his responsibility but also your own legal duty.

So - as much as he should have known so should you have known.

Original poster

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 20:24

I just don't get why they can't say that they are allowed to do it by discretion instead of lying. It seems so simple. Plus he insinuated I was making stuff up which I do think was a bit U of him. So I guess I conclude that I was BU to not use a seat and to pick at him for wrong information, but I feel it's U for any taxi driver to be giving the wrong info in the first place.

There's not much awareness.

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Ermm · 03/12/2017 20:28

I think its unreasonable for a parent to not know what the laws are regarding child car restraint.

I think it is VERY unreasonable for a parent to not ensure their child is properly restrained in a car journey.

To me this also seems so simple.

So I'd be targeting ignorant parents such as yourself for improved information awareness on child car restraint rather then making taxi drivers responsible for trying to stop irritating parents such as yourself from putting their child at risk.

I'm not sure why taxi drivers should be responsible for explaining to parents why they can't risk their children.

The person who comes out of this story looking badly is much more you than the poor taxi driver.

hereitis · 03/12/2017 20:28

He cared more about your dc than you did, is that what annoyed you?

Original poster

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 20:29

Me included :) I didn't see anything about travelling on a knee on the gov website which is where I got the info, and naturally assumed a taxi driver would know and would correct me if I were sitting her incorrectly. So I'm also BU for not doing deeper research.

Thank you

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cloudchasing · 03/12/2017 20:33

Did you call the office and ask for an explanation? I'm sure the op would have explained it to you, had you asked.

I'm a taxi operator and my dp is a taxi driver. All of us where I work are willing to help and explain stuff, but people get irrationally angry dealing with taxi companies and ops for some reason.

I might start a thread one day about our lives in the business. People maybe would see things from another perspective.

lalalalyra · 03/12/2017 20:36

Therefore it is not legal to have them on your knee, even with the seat belt around both of you.

Also no taxi driver should ever, ever allow this. In the event of heavy braking or a crash the seatbelt will restrain the child, but the adult will crush into the back of them. A whole adult weight pushing the child into the belts - never going to end well.

Glitterbabe69 · 03/12/2017 20:43

It's only legal in a taxi that has a pertition i.e. a black hackney type taxi, if it's a proper car then you should legally be using a car seat.

shakeyourcaboose · 03/12/2017 20:49

Well done that man! This post has made me incredulous that it's actually bloody legal to transport a child this way.

Original poster

Seaglassmarie · 03/12/2017 20:50

I thought that not all car seats fit in all cars? Do all taxi cars fit all types of car seats?

I don't know how I'm gonna travel on the train with a pushchair, a suitcase, and a car seat if I need to get a taxi later in the journey. With difficult I suppose !

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