...to not have to tell him what to do?

[AutumnLego]

My DH and I have been together 10yrs and have 3 DSs.
He is very helpful around the house when I ask, but doesn’t often use his initiative to do housework by himself. In the past he’s told me ‘Men just don’t think about these things.’ And ‘I need to tell him what to do’ when I ask him why he doesn’t see things that need doing. We’re at the point now where I write a list of housework at the weekend and he will help with some of it, although I do have to ask repeatedly sometimes.

I’m a SAHM so I do expect to do more around the house than him, but carrying the mental load of it all is getting me down.

He does nothing towards organising the kids for school, buying things we need etc.

This morning he got up at 5.30am with our youngest. In that time, all he did was make breakfast for our boys, make himself a cup of tea and me a coffee. He spent the rest of the time on his phone, until at 6.55am he quickly got dressed for work and left at 7am. He did nothing else. He left the milk and cereal on the side and didn’t put them away. Meanwhile, I’m trying to put away dry washing, make lunchboxes, and generally chivvy along my kids into getting themselves sorted for school etc. Normal morning chaos.

Am I unreasonable for expecting him to help a bit, without being asked? I’m always asking him to get off his phone. I feel his priorities are wrong. Some of these things are petty, and I’ve spent ten years letting them go, but it’s the constant ness of it which has stressed me out this morning.

On another note, he doesn’t shower unless I ask him to. If I didn’t ask, he would prob shower once a week. This is starting to disgust me. I don’t know how to approach it. Surely he would be embarrassed enough by being asked to go and wash?

Would welcome opinions.

What were you doing whilst he was up at 5.30am?

We take it in turns to get up with our toddler. I was in bed until 6am when the alarm went off. Then I got up and started sorting things out.

Is your toddler in nursery? Do you have a break during the day?

The showering issue (while separate) is repulsive and I'm surprised you could have enough sex with such a man to yield 3 children.

Washing often enough is definitely something he should take responsibility for himself.
Tell him it is starting to disgust you that you have to tell him to do it, as if he was one of your children.
He could schedule certain days to shower, every week.

God it sounds like you've got 4 kids.

I wonder if he realises just how unattractive that is

Does he manage to do things at work without being asked?

carrying the mental load of it all is getting me down.

Have you told him this?

Love it. That whole list of things that get you down and the one comment you get is and what the fuck were you doing at 5.30?!

I feel your pain OP. My DH often asks can I do anything? It’s not that he doesn’t help out or pull his weight. It’s that he has to be guided to it and told what to do. Then complains when I make decisions and plans without consulting him, claiming I never let him be the boss. I don’t know that there’s a solution. I’ve got to the stage where I just accept that he’s not going to show initiative about the house and I ask him to do the things that need done. At least the shit gets done, and I’m not the one doing it all.

The showering thing isn’t great though. Has he always been a non showerer or is it a new thing? If it’s new it could point to issues within himself that you might need to address??

I would imagine that your life would be made easier by making lunches in the evening.

I have no other comment until we know more about what your day looks like when your older children are at school.

So he got up an hour earlier than needed, at 5.30am and made you a cup of coffee while you were still in bed, and sorted breakfast out for the kids before he went to work at 7am?

From what you've said about that morning routine he's done his fair share before going to work.

He's got a full day ahead of him working, and you have the school run and then a day at home.. With or without your toddler (it's not clear whether your toddler is at nursery during the day)

The showering thing is a seperate issue and would definitely make me go off my DH if he showered once a week! Yuk!

I'm not sure what to say really OP. Im a SAHM too and do everything in the mornings. 4 DC - eldest is now 14, but it's always been this way. I get up 6am on average. DH comes down at 7. I make him breakfast as I do for the DC - porridge, eggs, etc. He has no idea about the details of the morning rush.

I don't think he has ever got uniforms or bags sorted, made breakfast for DC in a weekday - or even got up first to wake them up.

However, I have a cleaner for 5 hours on a Tue and 5 hours on a Fri. The weekends are not taken up with housework and I'm only really tidying up in the week. I take his shirts out for steam pressing every week and only do my stuff and the DC if absolutely necessary. I probably cook 3 nights a week and we might eat out one night or do takeaway on a Fri as DC often have friends over or I'm out and about collecting them from somewhere. So even though DH never really cooks, I don't feel swamped by it. Weekends we tend to eat out too in the main, unless we have friends over.

Are your DC at home all day?

What else should he do in the half an hour before you get up? It's not a dig at you but I'm not sure what you want him to do. My OH gets up at 5.45, does nothing other than get himself ready for work - leaving me to tidy up after him- then leaves at 7. I work too and do everything that needs doing

You should read some of the recent threads about 'Wifework' and the way that women are expected to carry the 'mental load'. This seems to be a common thing- men are willing to 'help' with the household and children etc but the overall responsibility and mental load of managing this (ie telling them what to do) is expected to be done by women.

The 'men don't think about it the same' idea is bull shit. Presumably at work he and his male colleagues can get on with their jobs without a woman spelling out what to do every minute?

YANBU. It's bad enough when they don't see what cleaning needs to be done done but so much worse when they add to the mess by leaving things like cereal boxes lying around-what kind of adult thinks that's an ok thing to do?

I don't think you can draw parallels between home and work. You're conflating 2 completely different things.

Leaving aside the showering (which is grim), does he care about the mess? I suspect not. I know several men who live on their own either always have, or post divorce. And whilst they're not living in squalor, they don't really care if cereal is on the side, or the sink full of washing up, shelves not dusted or crumbs on the floor. I genuinely believe many men don't notice, or don't care.

I can see this with my bf, who is lovely but doesn't care about dusting, vacuuming etc, he lives alone and prob does this once every 4-6 weeks. I do mine weekly. If we lived together, i would have to remind him if I wanted it done to my preferred frequency.

It's not ideal. However what's worse Imo is someone like my Ex who expects a spotless home but never lifts a finger. Not being bothered about or noticing mess is different.

I don't think you can draw parallels between home and work. You're conflating 2 completely different things

Not at all. If he did his work in such a slap dash half arsed fashion and played on his phone when he was at work, he'd get his arse handed to him. At home he doesn't so he doesn't care.

It's bad enough when they don't see what cleaning needs to be done done but so much worse when they add to the mess by leaving things like cereal boxes lying around-what kind of adult thinks that's an ok thing to do?
But don't assume that everyone feels that the house should be clean and that cereal boxes should be put away. I feel that way, but that doesn't mean that I could impose the same on someone who lived with me (which may explain why I live alone!). One person's mess is another's perfectly acceptable & lived-in.

Not at all. If he did his work in such a slap dash half arsed fashion and played on his phone when he was at work, he'd get his arse handed to him. At home he doesn't so he doesn't care.

Well, that's a bit silly. Surely on balance, people are far less scrupulous about phone avoidance when they're at home vs at work, regardless of gender?

The wifework references are a red herring here because presumably the OP has agreed to be a SAHM with her husband, meaning she's the primary caregiver and housekeeper. Until we know more about what's going on, there's no conclusions to be drawn. Apart from the fact that he needs to take the lead on his own showering

At work the parameters of your role are defined by your employer.

At home you set your own standards. If ypu need to analogise it to the workplace then if anything t's more like being self employed where you determine how you want to work, what needs doing and when.

The wifework references are a red herring here because presumably the OP has agreed to be a SAHM with her husband

Yeah, she agreed to be a SAHM not his mother and manager and skivvy

The showering thing is disgusting, and YANBU about the mental load thing - it's exhausting, and your DH absolutely should be taking the initiative more often.

However, if I were in your position as a SAHM, I would make the lunchboxes the day before and clear up from breakfast post-school run. In which case the early morning division of labour would be about right - you get them dressed, he makes their breakfast (and your coffee).

Thank you for all your replies, very useful to get some perspective.

My older two are at school, my youngest is at home full time with me (will start nursery next Sept).

I think it is fair that I do most of the housework as the SAHM, I have no issue with this. I am also the tidier one, and many years ago realised that if I wanted things to my standard of tidiness then I would have to do it, and it was unfair of me to expect him to have that same standard.
I think I just get frustrated when I see him on his phone all the time whilst I'm doing loads of stuff and have to constantly ask him to help. This is at the weekend too.
This morning, for instance, I was making the lunches whilst my toddler repeatedly poured his water down himself, whilst DH is oblivious on his phone. He is in senior management at work and is being lined up for promotion. He is very capable, works hard and has achieved lots in his career. I wish he could prioritise things at home a bit more, but then I suppose he is entitled to 'down time' too. I think I just have to accept this.

The showering issue has only recently become a problem. He has never showered every day, but only in the last few months has there been a smell problem. I have text him this morning, was very firm about it, and he has apologised. Hopefully it will improve.

Thanks again for your replies.

A "smell problem" won't do much for his prospects at work.

Could you encourage him to see the task of breakfast as including putting away the milk and cereal, and keeping an eye on the toddler, not just plonking breakfast in front of the child and that's it?

Do tell him that running everything is wearing you down and ask for his suggestions to improve things.

I he works in senior management, the shower issue could be a problem at work too, honestly, so raise that with him.
Shower aside, I don't think he's done that little in the morning. He needs to focus at work, you're at home and it's not like he got up with a hangover, got dressed and stumbled out of the door into the working day without even acknowledging he's got a family.
How old are your DS, those who go to school? In our house DD has a checklist (she's 7). When she comes from the childminder, it's checking the HW and signing it, then she hangs up her uniform, prepares stuff for the next day including the clothes to change into, followed by emptying her lunch box from wrappers, washing it and putting stuff for the next day into it so I can put in into her schoolbag in the morning. She's always ready within 25 minutes, saving us lots of time, plus she learns responsibility.

I am horrified at the thought of him never showering every day.

Sorry but how on earth can you share a bed with him?