To think they should just do a railcard for everyone?

[Itsgonnabeacoldone]

Like other countries do. There's lots of people in their 30s, 40s and 50s struggling. I know there is the two together card and network card but obviously they have limitations.

DS1 (20) and a student looked into getting a rail card but none of them would let him travel at the times he needed to get go and from college.

Sorry if I wasn't clear - my point was that you said giving 'everyone' a rail card would encourage the use of off-peak trains; my point was that an off-peak railcard exists (the network railcard - yes, I know it restricts where you can travel, too, but even on routes it covers you see plenty of empty off-peak trains) and it doesn't work as you suggest it would, as most people have little choice about when they travel.

Why don't they just decrease rail fares?

I completely agree that that's the answer, but unfortunately that "they" is private companies who aren't going to voluntarily reduce the price of their service without a bit of arm twisting. I say let's get twisting! Or better yet, how about we bring the railways under public control?

@Itsgonnabeacoldone Off peak trains are often empty, they could make more money with this

Do you somehow think people are choosing to pay peak fares and travel on busy trains?

There a much more structural change that needs to happen with working lives and hours before you can hope to make a dent in the volumes travelling at peak and off peak.

I think you could already have a student railcard up to age 27 anyway as long as you bought a 3 year one before your 25th birthday.
I think the whole ticketing system needs a damned good overhaul. Why is it so complicated? In my youth there were only a few variations on tickets and you just bought them at the station on the day of travel. Now you need a degree in train tickets to work out how to get the best deal. And they're too expensive unless you book way in advance or travel very early in the morning or late at night.

I see what you are saying about off peak and the network rail card. But as SoMuchToBits has said prices are much cheaper in the south east, so it's hard to draw much from that and it always has a minimum fee that has been creeping up.

I love the train, but I drive or fly everywhere and I'd rather not and be more environmental.

I agree, train fares are prohibitively expensive. When I lived in Peterborough it was only a 45 minute journey into London, so DH and I thought we could do lots of London days out/trips to the theatre etc. Only it was eye wateringly expensive so we only did it once!
Now we live a 7 hour journey from family. Same travel time on the train, so we'd rather do that as it's more relaxing. But it's far, far cheaper to drive.
My brother once flew from his home to family as it was cheaper than the train.
It's more environmentally friendly, but at the current prices, where's the incentive to use the train?

I lived in SE rail network and there was the Network Rail card which anyone over 16 could purchase for around 30 quid. It gives a third off off peak any certain other fares.

Train dares are just stupid. I travel a lot with work and the mind boggles at some of the fares. London to Manchester can be up at £700 any time corporate or as low as £90ish.

I don’t see the point of giving everyone a railcard - they may as well just bring them back out of private control and subsidise the fares.

They just need to sort out the ridiculous farce that is train pricing.

DP and I are in our 30s with no children, so not entitled to any rail card. The last time we went to London we ended up hiring a car because it was cheaper! It shouldn't be like that.

Its true. I travel from Birmingham to Exeter. The cheapest way to do it is to buy tickets as follows

Birmingham - Cheltenham
Cheltenham to Bristol
Bristol to Exeter

Its about £10 cheaper than Birmingham to Exeter maybe more.

In some Europeon countries they charge a flat rate by the kilometre travelled and actually show it on the rail ticket - I dont know if they have different rates for different times of day but at least its logical

Nice idea, but I earn barely more now than I did when 30.

It's the basic ticket prices that are the problem. I'm due to a friend's birthday party in a couple of weeks but since I didn't book a ticket a few weeks ago and don't want to tie myself to a single timed return train I'll be paying £50-something on the day rather than £9 each way. That's a massive factor in whether or not I can afford to go.

I agree that you should be able to buy a railcard whatever your age.

They are fairly expensive in the likes of Germany and Switzerland, but it's worth it if you travel a lot.

I get a network southeast card as my husband has a season ticket, but you can only use it for certain routes.

I think that the entire system needs a restructuring. It technically denationalised but it's not free market and all the consumer benefits that come with that. There must be a way that doesn't involve long standing monopolies.

if you're close to London, the fares are nuts. It's off-peak £24 from here (£16 with a rail card) and that's very restricted hours, making it almost useless for day trips - it wasn't so bad when there weren't evening restrictions, but now there are, so you can't leave til after 10, and by the time you've waited for the first train after 10 and got down there, it's close to 11.30, and you have to be back to get the train by 4.15 at the latest to come home, and it's barely time to do anything - and no room for delays!

If you go earlier, it's close to twice as much.

And yet, for those prices, you can sometimes get advanced fares all the way to Scotland! Or even not specially advance fares, but going in a different direction, and you go much further. In fact, you can go THROUGH London, en route to Cornwall, sometimes for cheaper than a ticket that finishes in London! (But restrictions on the ticket machines don't let you use it for just a trip to London)

You can get from London to Birmingham for about £5 off peak.
From where I am to Birmingham (which is actually a bit closer), it's £30.

Fares seem to have nothing to do with distance and cost of the journey at all - it's all about who they can charge most to to make the most profit.

I am lucky and will benefit from this but I agree they should just sort out the farce that is pricing. Re-nationalise the railways and run them not-for-profit. On most routes there is no choice of providers so no competition so no benefit from them being privatised for the customer.

Good trains benefit everyone by being greener and reducing traffic. Advance tickets are a pain in the arse and often not practical. And it drives me mad that if I want to do a "triangular trip" (e.g. London-Birmingham-Bristol-London" it ends up costing me 3x as much as a normal out-return trip instead of just 50% extra like it would if I had a car. Absolutely outrageous.

Not to mention the bloody ticket machines that will sell you an off-peak or super-off-peak ticket but you have to wade through the website to find out what times you can travel on any of them

Or the ticket machine at London Bridge which offered me 3 different options with 3 different rail companies for a trip to gatwick, all priced within 50p of each other, but nowhere did it say who was running the train I wanted to get and no option to buy one valid on any service

and then they wonder why the traffic is so bad!

My DS was living in Belfast for a year. It was cheaper for him to get home by plane and onward short rail journey than it is for him to get back from Hull ( where he lives now) - even with a railcard. We are in the Midlands. I know flight tickets are also variable and have to be booked in advance to get a good deal but he didn't have to travel at silly times of the day to get a bargain.

heron98 you can get a Two Together railcard, 1/3 off rail fares as long as you both travel together.

We've just ordered a Two Together card for me and DH. I used £15 worth of clubcard vouchers (they double it up) which we had lying around so it hasn't really cost us anything.

One handy tip if you're willing to spend a bit of time on it is to break your ticket into legs. My boss was going from Manchester to London peak time, cheapest through ticket was £145. I looked at where the train stopped and booked two separate tickets - Manc to Staffrd for £24 and Stafford to London for £80 so £40 saved. You stay on the same train, might have to move seats. If you're changing trains it's always worth looking if it's cheaper to break the journey.

The answer is to re-nationalise the trains

That will only solve issues re cost at best. Conditions will likely get worse given that the British government seems to be completely incapable of running public services (just look at the roads and the NHS).

I have a network railcard, I pay £25 for it and it saves a third on adult fares for up to 4 of us at a time, and 2 thirds from kids fares, again up to 4 at a time.

Me and my 2 DC used to do a lot of rail travel using a family rail card. Fantastic when they were young, not hugely bad when the first turned 16, had to cut back hugely when the second one did. Even when the group save kicks in as it classes as 3 adults together the fares are still too much as its 3 (all be it reduced) adult fares on one adult wage - both DCs in school so not earning... We just stay home and don't see friends so often. Getting then student cards not a huge amount of help as I'd still have to pay full fare

But I don’t think they can be used to commute to work, which would be of more benefit. Only off-peak.