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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To not understand flipping car seats!?

41 replies

MumsOnCrack · 21/09/2017 11:54

Jesus! How hard can it be?! I'm really struggling to understand what kind of car seat I need to get for DD (10months).

Does anyone understand? (I don't think I'm thick but I'm scared of going to Halfords et al and being conned into buying one that's £300+ when I don't need to).

Have the powers that be made it especially difficult? Any recommendations re isofix car seats that last as long as possible that aren't hundreds would be great! Also have zero idea whether forward or rear facing.

Maybe I am just dim!

OP posts:
WhirlingTurkey · 21/09/2017 12:46

In Car Safety Centre x1000 - they are so helpful and will advise you fairly, not try and flog you something you don't need.

We have the 2-way Pearl - which fits on the same base as our infant carrier and we can keep rear facing as long as possible.

WhirlingTurkey · 21/09/2017 12:48

Someone told me it was the law that children HAD to be rear facing.... so why are places still selling forward facing seats?

There are two laws running concurrently at the moment. One that goes by weight and the new law that goes by age.

Writerwannabe83 · 21/09/2017 12:49

There are two laws running concurrently at the moment. One that goes by weight and the new law that goes by age

And people can just choose which law to follow dependent on what car seat they want?

AntagonyAunt · 21/09/2017 12:57

Look into the Britax Dualfix. I got one secondhand in excellent condition for £100. Amongst other things, it spins which obviously isn't necessary but I do smile inside everytime I can lift my son in and out so much more easily. Also good for when he wants to throw a tantrum and plank to try to stop me strapping him in.

liquidrevolution · 21/09/2017 13:06

Not much help but I have a Britax Dualfix which rotates for extended rear facing. DD has sat in it forward facing since 11 months as she hates rear facing. I bought it because of my bad back.

My DH has a Britax Prince because he doesnt have Isofix.

BertieBotts · 21/09/2017 13:07

It is not just you. It's very complicated. I've got my head around it only because I have a total saddo interest in the topic. But you'll get mixed information because many people don't understand the regulations and training in high street stores seems to be hit and miss.

Writer Yes, that's correct. If you have a seat running to the R44.04 standards - this is any seat not currently being sold as "i-size", it will also say R44.04 on it somewhere - you can turn your child forward facing when they reach 9kg regardless of age or height.

If you have a seat running to the R129 standards - these are sold as "i-size" and are about £1-200 more expensive - you MUST keep your baby rear facing until they are 15 months old no matter how tall or heavy they are.

In both cases:

  • Infant seats (the carry ones) will be usable until about 12-18 months depending on the size of your baby. It's very unusual to outgrow one at 9 months. It usually only happens when the seat is very small (some models are) and the baby very big.
  • It's always safest to rear face for as long as you can do so within the limits of the seat you have. Rear facing seats are always safer than forward facing - for any passengers! - But especially so for babies and toddlers, who have big (heavy) heads and weak vulnerable necks.
  • You must stop using a rear facing seat once the baby's head reaches the top of the seat shell, or when they reach the maximum weight limit for the seat (which will be printed on it) as it isn't safe any more. You can buy a bigger rear facing seat or if your baby/child is big enough, change to forward facing.

Do bear in mind most babies' growth slows down during the second half of the first year, so if they have a few cm left, you've probably got a good 3-4 months left to choose.

Unlike many car seat fans on MN I don't think rear facing until they can drive themselves is necessary although I do accept that it's safer. I don't think car seats are only about getting the top safety at all times. However, if safety happens to be your top priority, rear facing is a clear winner.

BertieBotts · 21/09/2017 13:10

Also, in reality, a policeman isn't going to poke their head into your car and ask to check the regulation number on your car seat. They'll see that you have a baby strapped into a seat which looks roughly correct and think nothing more of it. The only time you're likely to have an issue is if you start driving along with the baby on your lap totally unrestrained.

By which I mean, don't overthink it!

sparklewater · 21/09/2017 13:12

The law is about which car seats companies are allowed to make, not what retailers can sell or consumers can use. The two laws are running side-by-side at the moment as they phase out the old one. Imagine the madness if they suddenly said all the old ones weren't legal anymore!

I have the Nuna rebl and really love it! Expensive but worth it. The Joie 360 isn't massively different though, and much cheaper. I'd have got that at the time if it was in stock.

Am going to keep rearfacing until 4 as that's the safest way to do it.

WhirlingTurkey · 21/09/2017 13:25

And people can just choose which law to follow dependent on what car seat they want?

Pretty much... until the old style seats are phased out and the new law becomes the only law IYSWIM? I am not sure what the timeline for that is though and CBA to look it up now.

IMO it's best to get an iSize seat now that complies to the new law, as the new law is more conservative (in terms of safety) than the old law. However people are still free to buy the old style seats that go by weight, rather than age, for turning forward facing (thus you can generally forward face much sooner than under the new law).

IMO the law should be rear facing for longer than 15 months, but I suppose it's better than nothing!

QueenOfTheSkies · 21/09/2017 13:34

We have the joie 360 spin and i love it. It was £250. I agree the handle to swivel it is hard to reach but i can manage and it was the only extended rear facer in my price bracket. DD is 20 months and comfortably rear facing in it. because of my make of car i can't extend the seat away from the actual car seat to give more legroom so i may not get her to age 4 but i will persevere as long as possible. The only 'issue' i have is because the seat and the base are all on one it cant be used in DH's older car that doesnt have isofix as there is no option to secure with a seatbelt so had to get another seat for his car. bought the joie tilt for this which is only £75 but it is awkward to get DD in and out over the seat belt now she's bigger.

I will keep DD rearward until 4 if i possibly can and i say this after 3 other DC who all forward faced at 15 months as was advice at the time and it 'never did them any harm' as many people say to me!

Ttbb · 21/09/2017 13:49

The staff at mothercare are usually very good. If you go in with your child and your budget they will measure and weigh them and give you a few suitable options.

PineappleScrunchie · 21/09/2017 13:55

Mothercare very rarely have good prices though so worth checking online once you know what seat you want.

BertieBotts · 21/09/2017 13:59

One thing which is useful to understand about car seats in Europe is the Group system. And even that has become horribly complicated so I shall explain from the basics. I'm going with R44 standards here, because R129 is different, but R129 seats are currently being produced roughly in line with R44 groups anyway, so it's still the most useful to understand.

Group 0+
Probably what you're using right now. This covers weight category 0-13kg and usually fits birth to about 15 months. The most common type of seat in this category is the carry handle type seat which is sometimes compatible with a pushchair. These seats are always rear facing except for a couple of specialised lie-flat ones which go sideways. But this group can never be forward facing.

Group 1
This category covers the weights 9-18kg and is sold as being from 9 months to 4 years. These seats can be forward or rear facing and are most commonly sold as a (relatively) permanent fixture in the car with a harness. You can also get seats in this category which use an impact shield, these are forward facing seats.

Group 2 and 3
This is a slightly more confusing category but basically covers high backed boosters and backless boosters, both used with the adult seatbelt rather than an integrated restraint system. They're usable from 15kg (highback) or 25kg (backless) but highback boosters are always sold as Group 2/3 so cover the top end of the weight scale too (up to 36kg - but realistically - no top weight limit). With modern car seats the reason it's useful to have these separated out is that combination car seats sometimes cover group 2 but not group 3, meaning that the seat will have a maximum usage weight of 25kg - but more on combinations in a second.

Got that? Grin Right. Then more recently manufacturers have started producing combination car seats. So you used to get the following "basic" combinations:

Group 0/1 or Group 0+/1

  • These are seats which are rear facing for Group 0 (babies), but then install forward facing for toddlers. They're not designed to be taken in and out of the car. If you look at these be careful to check the maximum rear facing weight, because sometimes it's lower than the standard 13kg (for complicated historical/cost cutting reasons I won't bore you with). This used to be a good alternative if you wanted to rear face for longer than a Group 0+ seat alone, because the seat shell is taller, meaning you usually get the full 13kg out of it (for most children, around 2-2.5). These days it's much easier to find a seat which covers Group 1 rear facing meaning it will last much longer, so this kind of compromise isn't necessary.

Group 1/2/3

  • These are seats which start off with a harness (or impact shield) for Group 1, but are designed that when your child gets to about 3 or 4 years old you remove the harness and it converts to a high backed booster you can in theory use until they no longer need a car seat.

THEN, "Extended Rear Facing" or ERF became more popular. For the purposes of this discussion, ERF is rear facing in any weight group past 0+. (Rough age: Rear facing past a year old.)

So you now get lots of combinations but the main ones are:

ERF Group 0/1 seats - Essentially, a rear facing Group 1 seat which can also be adapted for smaller babies and used from birth.

Group 0/1/2 seats - A seat which covers from birth to 25kg - This is usually although not always harnessed right the way through to 25kg, rather than converting to a seatbelt booster. Check the individual description. Usually ERF to Group 1, occasionally to Group 2.

ERF Group 1/2 seats - Usually, a seat which is RF harnessed for Group 1, and then either harnessed RF or harnessed FF for Group 2.

Group 0/1/2/3 seats - Often marketed as "The only seat you'll ever need". The Joie one is, I believe, okay. Steer massively clear of these seats as sold by the cheapest brands like Nania, babystart, own branded seats. It's unlikely you'll find this combination as an ERF seat. I don't think this option is useful for most people, I think it's a false economy in terms of safety. What they are useful for (especially the Joie) would be somebody like a childminder or grandparent needing a spare seat which will potentially be used by children of different ages, who doesn't want to have to store several extra seats. For somebody looking for a seat which will primarily be used by one child, I think it's better to get something with fewer groups involved.

Ummmm yes did I say it was complicated? Blush

BertieBotts · 21/09/2017 14:00

High street good options are Mothercare and John Lewis. Halfords are crap for car seat safety and don't even sell any ERF seats.

Daffydil · 21/09/2017 14:17

Our local Mothercare, Halfords and John Lewis were all hopeless with anything slightly less common - i.e. Extended rear facing.

The in car safety centre were amazing. Really, really helpful.

BertieBotts · 21/09/2017 15:07

Yeah ICSS probably the best! :)

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