I need to have a rant about the cost of my childcare

[MGFM]

£2200 a freaking month!

This isn't a stealth boast about having enough money to pay out this much in childcare and I also want to say I feel lucky that I used to have plenty of disposable income and I feel lucky to have two wonderful children and I don't think the state should help me pay for their care (although I most certainly have signed up to the tax free child care) but oh my fucking god , I want to cry every time I think about it!

We will have enough left over for food and fuel and clothes when desperately needed and the odd treat but it is going to be freaking miserable.

I was in an outlet store yesterday and tried on a beautiful pair of skinny grey jeans. They were soft and luxurious. I thought they were only £29 but then I saw they were £50. Hung them back up and left the shop. I have just lost all my baby weight ( I put on 3 stone - it is now all gone and I am back to my not al size so I am desperate to buy some new clothes and now can't afford any) I need a tiny violin to play for me somewhere as I feel so pathetic.

I just need to rant about this really and I have moaned to real life friends but they might get sick of me droaning on about how broke we are

While I am more like your mother's generation, I am very interested in this thread as my daughter is likely to be grappling with these issues before too long. From my perspective, I applaud those of you still working, against the odds of all the juggling and having to pay these costs. I was a stay at home parent until my daughter was 3, having previously enjoyed a very well paid, fulfilling and somewhat demanding career. I gave up work because, mistakenly, I thought it was the right thing to do. I lost confidence, skills and in short order my marriage!!! Fast forward a year later and I moved to a different part of the country so my lovely parents could help me, went back to work in a completely different public sector role (not so lucrative - my dear dad commented 'is that all they're paying you'? Thanks dad!!!). I met my lovely husband there and eventually retrained again via the OU and went into education. That time my marriage broke up was the scariest of my life, no job, no income, mortgage at risk. I have always told my daughter to make sure she has some financial independence, so important. All those of you working hard against all the odds have my total admiration. The childcare financial issues will seem a mere short space of time when you later look back at the whole picture of your lives - society is indebted to you that you are using your skills, sadly we have a societal structure at present that is only working for about the top 1-2% of the very wealthy. So frustrating and wrong.

The cheapest nursery my colleague could find was £65 a day (in the south-east, but 30 miles from London). After travel costs and deductions, she'd have been working for around £10 a day.

She worked out that she'd be significantly better off working 3 days pw, which reduced the tax/NI take and meant that her student loan payments would be suspended. And then an unexpected vacancy cropped up at a great childminder just at the end of her road.

Another colleague and his partner went on "compressed hours" so that they both did 4-day weeks and only needed 3 days child care. Despite being on average incomes, they were both above the threshold for tax credits.

Childcare costs are absurdly high, and it benefits everyone for them to be subsidised by the tax payer imo.

I feel your pain! I'm a single Mum (with no financial help) with one DS. He's just started school and I've worked out that I've spent (so far!) an eye-watering £53K on his childcare! That is a hell of a lot of money.

Life is full of choices but society should encourage the right kind of choices. Women taking higher education (accruing the same amount of debt as men for same degrees) and paying taxes whilst also having children is a good thing for society, not just the individual. Women not taking higher education or leaving work after higher education due to cost of childcare or unfriendly working hours is very bad for society.

I think you conflate several points here....and need to replace "society" with "the economy". Women leaving work after higher education due to cost of childcare or unfriendly working hours is unarguably bad for the economy. It was better for me and for my family, so I clearly prioritised that over economic considerations. Is it good or bad for "society"? I think you can argue it both ways.

But as to the main point - you can loosely divide women with children into three groups: 1) those who can't afford to work, 2) those who can't not afford to work and 3) those who can afford not to work. (If that makes sense!). You need very different strategies and incentives to get 1s back into work from the ones you need to get the 3s.

what the fuck? that's more than DP and I earn put together!

It does sound alot. I think I would give up work!

Thinking about it one of my friends has made it work. Good job in the public sector, she was there 10 yrs before having a child & they paid for her degree so believe in her. After DC1 she worked 3 days with no impact to her salary (as in hourly rate) or her role. She also got a back to work bonus. She's gone back 2 days after DT & once they are all in school she's planning to change her hours again to suit. She's lucky that they value her so much and a very accommodating re flexi time etc.

What Mia said
I feel your pain! I'm a single Mum (with no financial help) with one DS. He's just started school and I've worked out that I've spent (so far!) an eye-watering £53K on his childcare! That is a hell of a lot of money.

But as a SAHM I will have lost that in the equivalent of lost wages over the years.

It's swings and roundabouts.

i agree Natalia, it's also not clear you'll ever get 3s who can confer most benefit to their families back into work when their DC are under school or primary age, it might not benefit the economy, but it certainly benefits the children.

I honestly don't know how people on average incomes manage with high housing costs and high childcare costs.

Childcare of £2k a month and £1,000 rent would eat up 75% or more of net pay. That's just not sustainable imo.

Not everyone can get a well-paid job and there will always be jobs that are essential but low-paid. The lack of investment in future generations is frightening. These children are the people we'll all be relying on to keep society functioning in 30 years time.

It always makes me laugh when people suggest that you should just give up work. Your outgoings are normally linked to your earnings. If you give up work, who is going to pay all of your bills - mortgage or rent, any loans/ credit cards, food, petrol etc etc. The magic money tree? Bizarre attitude.

Oh and plus if I'd taken 5 years out from my career it would probably take me another 5-10 years to work my way up to the same level I'd left at (that's if I could get a job back in it at all even at a entry level).

oh i couldn't get the same job back - after 2 ML, and being unable to travel as much as the firm would like, my skills are already rusty. If I had another break I'd be looking at competing with young grads with far better technical skills than me for entry level positions. Or admin/cleaning.

I have up work when DC1 came along. I have four kids and I've never gone back to working outside the home. DH and I set up our own business and it did well enough for us to be retiring now in our early 50s.

I am immensely grateful not to have spent my life on some kind of hamster wheel. Although we didn't have a lot of money when the kids were small, we always had plenty of time and a great quality of life.

I think it's dreadful that so many people are working so hard for such little reward, society has gone a bit crazy.

I am desperate to buy some new clothes and now can't afford any

What - even charity shops?

In reality, the cost of childcare is just one piece of the puzzle. What we really need is a complete overhaul of work/family and how it's managed, which would include...

Pressure on workplaces to be more family friendly in terms of hours and expectations.

Greater availability of part time and flexible working.

High quality, subsidized childcare.

Greater access programmes and support for women returning to the workplace.

Some mechanism for pension provisions to continue when on career break (tax breaks available for this to come out of 'family' money for instance. This obviously needs a lot more thought).

And that's just for starters.

And on another point, one thing that really pisses me off is whole 'you can do it if you lean in' attitude.

We're not all fucking Sheryl Sandberg. And we shouldn't need to be superstars at our jobs to stay in the workforce, achieve a reasonable work/life balance and maintain our financial security.

Heebie

This is something I have wandered about because I have been into charity shops and I have never seen anything decent. My mum once got a pair of m and a jeans. Once. Where are these Charity shops that actually have nice stuff in them? I have no issue wearing second hand and a lot of my kid's clothes are second hand. But honestly the ones near us aarent great.

One of the other reasons I wouldn't want to quit work - what if my husband dies? We have life insurance which will pay off the mortgage but what about actually living and paying for stuff? Grieving and worrying about how to buy the school uniform doesn't sound good to me. I remember thinking about this when there was that awful story in the news about that poor family on holiday and the husband and one of the kids were killed by the speed boat. He was a very high earner by all accounts. She gave an interview about a year later I think where she mentioned having to go and find a job. I don't want to be in that situation.

And I guess there is always what if my marriage breaks down? We are happy and healthy but you never know what might happen.

It's awful isn't it. Mines £1400 a month for 2.5 days

Mia1415 - I thought her dh worked and the reason she wants to keep working is more for her career rather than to pay the bills

There would be just as little left over if we were relying on just his salary and the bank would probably laugh us out when time to remortgage!

well, (I do work FT) but, if DH died, the life insurance would pay off our huge mortgage and we would move into a smaller place. When the chips are down, having to get a job or move isn't the end of the world. So I can see how it's possible to make different choices - you've got to roll with the punches whatever life throws at you :)

Our house isn't big enough or worth enough to actually downsize. It wouldn't release much money. I just wouldn't fancy worrying about money with my husband lying dead somewhere. Then struggling to find a job. That's a pretty shit situation all round.

idk - clearly you feel this is important in why you work - that's fine. i feel though, that it's pretty much always possible to downsize, and find some sort of job. It wouldn't compare to the tragedy of losing my DH or be especially significant.

But if it motivates you, that's good. What motivates me to keep working is that both of us can retire about 10 years earlier than otherwise if I do...