DS's RS teacher "polygamy not that bad"

[IfyouseeRitaMoreno]

and when asked why women weren't allowed multiple husbands he said that this wouldn't work as you wouldn't know who the father is.

DS was annoyed bless him but didn't challenge. I felt a bit rageful because really he should his evo-psych opinions to himself and it's not exactly great for his female pupils to hear.

But then maybe that is life and he's just describing it like it is. Genuinely not sure IBU.

Well it's true .. the argument as to why polygamy cannot be 1w multiple m is because of the desire to determine parentage. Often in older cultures this could be to stop in-breading too much.

And if the kids were saying it's disgusting and evil or whatever, he may have been asking them to temper their views with his first statement

I would lodge a formal conplaint. Others have said the he should not judge religious beliefs but that is bollocks. Polygamy is practiced in different ways on different religiouns. Some prohibit it, others allow a person (regardless of sex) to marry as many people of whatever sex they want, while others allow the kind you have described. Most importantly polygamy is illegal in the U.K. And it is important to understand why and how this impacts religious freedoms. Failing to go into an indepth analysis instead explaining it away like that teaches children to be intellectually lazy.

A formal complaint? ? FFS. I am an atheist RS teacher and on any given day might have to deal with questions about suicide, abortion, why God allowed the holocaust, why God destroyed Sodom, does God hate gays, why did he make people 'wrong' etc. They don't always ask things in context of at the right time and you have to give the best answer you can in ten seconds without derailing the whole lesson (otherwise you cant set the homework as planned on the right day and yes then we do get complaints.). I know loads of teachers who won't / hate teaching PSHE because they feel.uncomfortable teaching 'issues '. In this instance the teacher gave a correct answer and moved on. That's all.

If you want religion taught in schools then that is what your going to get. If you want morality taught in schools then we need to make schools secular
Teaching morality and religious studies are totally different.
Teaching religious studies is about learning about and understanding many different views. Religious studies is not 'teaching religion' at children because there's an official church. Religious studies is a secular discipline learning ABOUT others. Just like you may learn about other cultures.

Also, teaching morality is vastly more problematic than teaching children about different religions.

E.g. which moral code forms the basis of 'morality lessons'? Why that form of morality?
If anything teaching 'morality' is much closer to teaching a specific world view than learning 'here are what different people believe and it's important to lesrn about them because society is multicultural'.

But paternity is a huge reason as to why its doesnt work for women to have multiple wives. Or at least that what people in theae relationships say and/or believe.

So the teacher was asked why? He answered with the answer that is the one given by people in these relationships.

If you ask why many religoons dont agree with homosexuality, you will get the reason of 'its a sin as sex should be between a man and a woman to make children'bor similar. Wether the teacher agrees or not. They are giving the explanation the religions give. Not expressing their own view.

Rs should be about the students exploring their own opinions and thoughts on these subjects.

While schools should be teaching about religions in a neutral way I think it's a bit naive to assume that that will always be the case. Teachers are human and some bring their personal viewpoint to the classroom. Which isn't always a problem but certainly can be especially in classes which have a lot of scope for opinions as well as facts.

Polygynous communities (one male to many females) tend to be bad for everyone except the men at the top of the tree. I'd expect that a good teacher would be able to facilitate discussion about the potential effects, and relate that to his class. It's fairly obvious that it's bad for young women to be married off as junior wives to the much older patriarchs and live a life of servitude. It is also very bad for young men who often are expelled from the community as they have little function other than workers and no hope of families of their own.

Teaching morality and religious studies are totally different.

Never a truer word...

They're usually complete opposites!

nooka
Personal views can seep into any classroom. It's why we have to be reflecti e and mindful of this so we can be sensitive or open when we have views.

Personally, I'm wary of any teacher who saya they have no views in the classroom. Much better to say 'i have personal views. I am aware of them and because of my awareness I am mindful how I teach'

Rita and all the offended atheists: you think outlawing religious teaching will end discussion of alternative set ups?

Ha. Must tell the several polyamorous secularists I know.

you think outlawing religious teaching will end discussion of alternative set ups?

Which post are you referring to?

Rita and all the offended atheists: you think outlawing religious teaching will end discussion of alternative set ups?

yes because that is exactly what I said.

Like PP said it would have been good to discuss why it's illegal here in the U.K. and in many Muslim countries too. He was discussing it in the context of Islam so that is relevant.

RS could be interesting if it were discussed in terms of morality but at DS's school there seem to be quite a few restrictions on what the kids say. This is of course according to DS. I've never sat in on a class. Maybe I should!

MaisyPops I'd be very pleased with any teacher who took that approach. Of course we all have biases and I think discussing how those biases affect our opinions would be a very helpful and educational exercise.

I just think that RE as a subject can very easily get into ethics and beliefs (and should, it would be a bit sad if it became a purely fact based class) and so teachers can easily get into slightly dangerous territory where their opinion can become what the children think they should be learning or where children feel anxious if their beliefs and opinions differ too much. This is possibly influenced by living with my mum who taught RE from a Christian viewpoint mainly because I don't think she really could do otherwise (I suspect she was an excellent teacher despite/because of her beliefs) and even more so by the very very odd person who first taught me RE who was very anti-Christianity and pro both atheism and witchcraft and taught us very oddly indeed.

The primary objective is for the student to be able to explain the theological bases for different beliefs. They have to focus on that more than the sort of broader sociological analysis you want them to

Well it seems impossible to teach religion without discussing morality because so much of it is immoral.

And so much of it is cultural. Is polygamy religious or cultural?

I don't think you can separate religion from the messiness of human nature or morality.

Because religion arises out of both.

And students need to know that. Else how can they look at it critically?

I think your DS should do a bit of research about how female-centric polygamy/sexual practices were snuffed out in Asia by colonialism and present it. The teacher sounds like an ass.

Nuttynoo That sounds interesting. Do you have any links/articles you could point me to?

You do have a 'partial' choice, as a lot of schools now dont teach RE, 25% in recent reports. I moved house to the catchment of a 'secular' school. They dont teach RE and get round the Ofsted requirements by saying they fit 'religious' topics into other relevant classes even thought they really don't.

Works well and DCs head isn't filled with crap about polygamy or sky fairies.

I think RE is dying out in the UK and given a few more years when over 50% have dropped it, the government will just let it be subsumed into history.

Sow the seed and reap the whirlwind

Keep the womb aloft

Never truer words spoken.

which moral code forms the basis of 'morality lessons'?

How about the morality that most people teach their children ie modern British secular morality. Human rights, the Geneva convention, the rights of children. Laws we have passed like, no death penalty, why we pay taxes, the NHS. Freedom of choice, free speech, sexual equality... Is it really so hard to work out right from wrong without a questionabel diety to tell you?

This would make it much easier for different cultures to integrate into British society.

How about the morality that most people teach their children ie modern British secular morality. Human rights, the Geneva convention, the rights of children. Laws we have passed like, no death penalty, why we pay taxes, the NHS. Freedom of choice, free speech, sexual equality...
So the stuff that is mainly in the PSHE curriculum that is already taught in school and the British Values that are already written into thr Teacher Standards.
Is it really so hard to work out right from wrong without a questionabel diety to tell you?
You miss the point.
The point of Religious Studies is NOT to tell children what to believe.

The point of Religious Studies is to EDUCATE young people about a range of beliefs that people hold in the world. Because like it or not people do have different beliefs.

I can't see anything nice about religious people thinking their religion is better than others. Equally, atheists who make unhelpful comments about beliefs and believers are just as smug with a sense of superiority.And to be honest, the amount of sneering about religion on this thread only reinforces to me why it is so important to learn about different beliefs.

So the stuff that is mainly in the PSHE curriculum that is already taught in school and the British Values that are already written into the Teacher Standards.

Yes, that is exactly right.

The point of Religious Studies is NOT to tell children what to believe.

Teach children to be tolerant of other people regardless of belief, there is no need for a school to teach them what other people believe, because like polygamy most of it is irrelevant.

Of course there are elements of every faith that are questionable from a secular moral perspective, but since billions of people hold those beliefs anyway, it is imperative that we try to understand them. Too many closed minds here.

Yes but surely the fact that these elements are morally questionable should be discussed?

As it stands, in DS's school, such conversations are discouraged.

Were they actually even talking about religiously motivated polygyny, or about polygamy in general?
There are plenty of modern atheists in the UK in consensual and informed polycules, possibly even a group raising a child or children in your DCs school.