To continue to avoid having anything to do with my DB? Trigger Warning

[Mittens1969]

I've previously spoken about my DM and appreciated the advice. I'm back with a far more uncomfortable dilemma, which might be distressing for some of you.

The problem is that I can't face my DB. He has serious MH problems as a result of abuse all 3 of us suffered as children. Things happened to him as well, but he also did stuff to my DSis and me, as a result of him copying behaviour that our father was doing. I don't actually blame him; the police asked us if we wanted him prosecuted and we said no, so they're only going to interview him as a witness.

The other thing is that he's claiming not to remember much and certainly nothing of what our father did. He remembers one incident which was reported to the police before, but the CPS didn't pursue it. Our father wasn't involved in that.

We haven't actually told him anything and he still hero worships our father, visits his grave regularly and talks about him a lot. That itself makes it impossible for me to be around him. I'd find it so hard to listen without saying anything.

I can't talk to him, not for more than a few minutes, and my DH often takes over from me. He's constantly calling though, I feel awful as he's obviously missing having contact with my family. My DSis also feels like this, so we're both avoiding him.

Basically he makes my skin crawl; I do care for him but I can't help how I feel.

It's also impossible to have him around our DDs; he shouts at them, bumps into them and blames them for being in the way, and is generally surly. DD1 used to love being around him, but the last few times she shied away from him. We haven't seen him for more than a year now.

I have no reason to believe he's a danger to my DDs; he copied what he was seeing as a child but there's been no indication of an unhealthy interest in children as an adult.

I understand he has a mental illness and was damaged terribly in childhood but so were you. You need to look after yourself and your own wellbeing not put it aside for someone else to your detriment. You can't pretend it didn't happen and didn't affect you and be a dutiful little woman. You count too.

DM knows about my father and about DB. My brother did more to my DSis than to me, as she was younger than I was, and was around him more than I was as I was at a private school by then (I didn't board).

I've stopped taking to her about it as she just ends up in tears on the phone or saying that she doesn't want to spoil a happy day.

She puts all the blame on my father and won't talk about what my brother did. Because he's a victim too. I get it of course. But she mostly seems more worried about him than the effect on my DSis and me.

I actually don't really like her way of caring, she just becomes very controlling.

She once allowed my him to come to a church event that I was at with my DDs and I saw DD1 shy away from him, scared. So I just won't do it again. I've insisted that he must never be around when we're there and she's respected that.

I do find her attitude to what he did to us quite strange, it's like she's in complete denial that it happened, it's almost like we're not allowed to be angry. I was the age my DD1 is when it was going on, and my DSis was 2 years younger fgs.

You have my empathy. You have described my mother and brother very well. You have to think about what happens when your mother dies. My brother has the same problems as yours (and has married the female version of himself, which does not help either...) My mother died just before Christmas and I am constantly having to explain to him that I am not Mum and I will not be replacing her for him. I have three kids and am not available to be on the phone for two hours while he processes a thought. I don't have the time or the emotional energy. I will not be yelled at when decisions he has made affect him negatively. I do not have money to give him. It is impossibly hard, but I am hoping that now Mum has gone he will be forced to grow up a bit. She left money in a trust for him that has left him financially dependent on lawyers. I can see this money being eaten up pretty quickly in fees, but that is none of my concern. I have had to become very hard in order to protect myself and my children. (We are all a little frightened of him, tbh... He is enormous and prone to aggressive outbursts and it wouldn't be responsible to let him be around my kids too often, and never unsupervised!). You need to talk to your mother about arranging some kind of adult guardian for him for when she is gone so that you can get on with your lives.

@justilou, that is so similar to our family situation. I am sorry about your DM. That must have been hard.

My DSis and I are also concerned about my DM potentially getting dementia, she is a bit forgetful and confused sometimes. She's extremely bright, and obtained her PhD a couple of years ago.

My DH and I have talked with her and she says she'll set up a trust fund for him; we've just sold our childhood family home, so it's a good time to do it. My DM does tend to think only in terms of money, and money isn't the issue. A guardian is a good idea, and it can't be me or my DSis, especially if we end up having to care for DM's needs as well one day. We also have MIL, who is a year younger than DM and also has health needs. And our DDs, with DD1 having Attachment Disorder.

I've been struggling with an eating disorder as well this year, and I was drinking too much a year ago, though this is well under control now. That was the PTSD of course.

My DSis has moved right away and she has a lot of commitments, 2 school-aged children and an adopted third child, aged 2. And she also has anxiety.

It will be a very complicated letter to write! And I can't just wash my hands of it, though leaving my DB to the care of a guardian will mean that I have the possibility of doing so. And I'm going to have to do that, for my own sake. I'm not good at thinking about myself, I was taught that was selfish as a child and I ended up with low self-esteem.

Thank you for enabling me to talk through the issues with people who are outside of the situation.

My DB yells and becomes defensive just like yours, very similar to you. I will need to learn to be very hard too, and I'm really struggling with that.

Thank you for sharing your story with me. You'be obviously been through a horrendous time.

Mittens I have a similar situation too. A DB in the same predicament, a DM who is looking after him, a damaged childhood etc.

My DB never did anything to us and my DDad was EA and damaged us all. I am unpicking the damage session by session.

I, like your DSis moved to a different country in order to survive and be happy. This of course means that I can't help regularly. My DM helps him with practicalities but won't takle the real issues and is unable to open up that wound. She worries about what will happen to him once she goes. So do I.

I live with guilt. Am I selfish for not caring? I do care but I cannot help. The guilt does not recede, it only hides.

I am so glad you have started this thread because it is one subject I cannot talk to people about, because it is not easy to be understood.

@therealpippi, thank you for sharing. I agree, it's something that can't easily be said out loud, as I feel a lot of guilt. The hardest thing is that I can't explain to my DB why I can't be around him and every time the phone rings and I don't answer, the guilt increases. I think I will need to write a letter setting out where I stand, and long-term decisions need to be made.

My father was definitely EA, as well as all the other things. I read some of his letters to my DM last year when helping her with a sort out, and they were full of emotional blackmail. He was also constantly accusing her of being unfaithful, he once told me that he believed a woman's adultery was worse than a man's adultery. I suppose that helped him rationalise his behaviour.

Thinking about it, it was similar in a way to my DB. My father was ill with Parkinson's Disease for many years, and my guilt over the fact that I actually hated him, and couldn't bear for him to be near me, is probably one of the factors in me repressing the memories. I was in so much denial.

It's horrible, the damage it did to us all. And DM really believed that we had a wonderful childhood. She was too busy to notice any different. Now she tries to make up for it by doing all she can to support my DB. She does try with DSis and me, but she's out of her depth and just becomes controlling. Her way of helping is problem solving not listening to what we're actually saying.

And she really loves her DGC, though she has a tendency to overstep the boundaries. But I don't think she realises she's doing it.

I'm glad this thread has helped you. It's helped me to be completely honest and to read other posters' stories.

Hi OP,

I live in Australia, so you should look into the exact legal situation where you live regarding adult guardians.
One thing my mother didn't really understand was that you couldn't simply leave someone an (non-functional) adult in her will. She kept deciding that she would appoint someone as his guardian (family member, friend, etc) without discussion. Legally (here) that is a position that must be mutually agreed upon. (Thank goodness, or I would be saddled with my brother.) Mum was of course horrified to discover that none of the extended family or friends wanted to be in this position, which is why his trust is being doled out by lawyers. (At his cost.)

Just make sure that you are not left with the fallout.

Mittens, have you dealt with the role your mother played in your abuse?

@justilou, we do have the same role for guardians here, my DH had a much older cousin who had a guardian take care of her interests, she was in a home in the end, but her mind was like that of a young child. It's a great idea, my DSis agrees, so I'll compose an email to DM proposing this.

@TheSparrowhawk, my DM has always insisted that she knew absolutely nothing about it. It's possible as she was so busy with her work, quite a few people who knew us then have said they felt at the time that she neglected us. She also loved my father too much to believe he could be doing anything wrong.

My parents ran a residential language school. Someone who worked there for them said that he was discovered walking around past the upstairs women's dormitories. They told my DM apparently and he was banned from going to the school (they had sold it by then). She claims not to have known about that either.

I've turned the page in my head. She just becomes tearful when we try to talk to her about the past, says 'Please don't ruin my time with my DGCs.' Or words to that effect.

The police will be interviewing her and my DB at some point, they asked for contact details. So I can't talk to her about it, I have no choice but to leave it behind. She is in her late 70s now, my father is long deceased and my DB isn't well enough to face up to it.

So there it is.

Sorry to like that wound. If you'd rather not talk about it, I understand. I know from my own experience that the failure of others to protect you can in many ways be just as upsetting as the abuse itself. Her claim she didn't know what was happening and her refusal to help you deal with it now (which is what the crying and guilt trip tactics are all about) are extending the damage.

Shit that should say sorry to poke that wound.

Thank you, @TheSparrowhawk. No it's ok, I find it kind of therapeutic online, and I like the fact that it's anonymous and I can be honest about how I feel, iyswim.

I do understand DM being upset, but she should be capable of holding it inside enough for DSis and I to talk to her about the past.

Exactly. I think the 'upset' is a tactic to avoid dealing with it to a certain extent. She can be upset and still make the effort to help and support her children.

So sad that you've all been through this as kids. Unfortunately it sounds like there isn't much you can do to help him and for your own and your family's sake you should go no contact if being around him makes you feel like this. You need to put yourself first.

Yes, DSis and I have already been doing this, without telling him that. I know it's hard for DM to know we're unable to be around him, and I feel so guilty about that, but I have no choice. My DDs come first and I have to stay mentally healthy.

I've kept my DDs away from him, that's a no-brainier, but it's the question about how to handle the telephone calls.

That's why I like the idea of a guardian. It's a way of being able to go NC with a clear conscience.