To worry about seeing little cyclists on busy roads

[heartstornastray]

It's nice that family's all get to go out cycling and learn how to be responsible on roads but there's no way i'd have a small child cycling behind me on a busy road like i often see. You really can't depend on car drivers seeing the child. Also if something's overtaking on the other side and a car has to pull in the child would be killed. Surely if they must cyvle on busy roads the child would be safer in front.

The other day we passed a man with two children, both cycling behind him and the smallest one (about 6) was wobbling precariously trying to keep up with dad, he could so easily have fallen into the path of a car, and the father wouldn't have even been aware, why put your children at risk.

That amount of space is to allow for people tumbling off their bikes.

I get your point pagan but many drivers havent ridden a bike in traffic because its bloody dangerous and they choose not to risk their, or their childrens lives like that. I have been driving for over 30 years and have had two perilously close calls with cyclists, both children, both losing control of their bikes and both ending up in the road, inches away from having their heads and faces crushed by me running over them. On both occasions I was driving safely under the speed limit set by law and managed to avoid killing these children, once by emergency stop and once with a swerve which nearly took me into another car, carrying a family (as was I). These near misses still haunt me. Children should not be allowed to cycle on or near roads without having passed strict proficiency tests and a theory test. And for those who.use the health benefit argument, take your kids to the park, or off road, or to the gym. Somewhere were they won't end up with their brains spread out on the road!!

I think cyclists fall into two categories. Lycra clad daredevils and sensible riders who pay some attention to cars. The daredevils ride down the hills around me three abreast and at full speed swerving round any car making its way up the hill. Also, they never use the cycle paths which separate them from the traffic. I don't have the paths in my village but they are provided elsewhere. They also whizz past my house, heads down, in the middle of the bridleway often skidding to a halt when a walker appears around a blind bend. It's just grandstanding, shows no consideration for others and stupid.

Family groups tend to go steadily, use the cycle paths where provided and don't really abuse their space on the road or bridleway and everyone is careful, including drivers. We have few passing places so don't overtake cyclists. (Can't keep up with some of them!)

Unfortunately the racers are the norm around here and some are aggressive towards walkers. I keep well away but hopefully country roads won't be closed to cars: I live up a steep hill and need to get home!

We need more cyclists!! Our air is way past legal limits for pollution, and we endanger our health by being too heavy.

Just out of interest hearts were they all wearing helmets

I love this cartoon: twitter.com/tweetymike/status/792394346385575936

I was driving out of my estate the other day behind two boys, probably of early secondary wpsxhool age. One was on a bike, weaving back and forth across the road. The other lad had a skateboard and was being pulled along by the one on the bike, by him holding on to the strap on his back pack. Neither wore a helmet, the road has parked cars, so no chance of giving them a wide berth as it's too narrow with the parked vehicles. Add to that a couple of younger ones on bikes riding out of a side road without looking and it's a nightmare just to get to the main road.

the road has parked cars, so no chance of giving them a wide berth as it's too narrow with the parked vehicles.

Obvious answer then would be to stop people storing their property on the highway. If I left stuff on the road I would quite rightly be charged with fly-tipping, but apparently car-drivers are special and can clutter up the highway, obstruct other road users and post repetitive and tedious threads on here about parking. It's OK if there is a diagram though.

"storing their property on the high street"
I live in an upstairs flat. My car is too wide to get up the walkway at the side of the building,and too heavy to carry upstairs. Where would you like me to keep it?

@dementedma So car drivers should have part of their test which educates them about cyclists. Will cyclists have something about cars in their test.....oh, wait. They don't even have to sit one. They can learn to ride a bike and wobble straight onto the road but it is the responsibility of the car drivers who have had a series of expensive lessons and pased a strict test to watch out for them???? Why???

Not this again.

80% of cyclists also drive a car (link below)

Don't you think that makes them rather more likely to understand and appreciate different road users' needs and perspectives than someone who has never sat outside their metal box? i.e be a better, more rounded driver.

(www.gov.uk/government/news/drivers-and-cyclists-agree-lets-look-out-for-each-other)

Another thread where half the posters haven't read the Highway Code. If you can't give the cyclist enough room to pass safely, wait behind them until you can. Simple. Its cars that are the dangerous heavy machinery, so if you're worried about hurting other road users while driving then maybe you should go for some more driving lessons.

We need more cyclists!! Our air is way past legal limits for pollution, and we endanger our health by being too heavy.

This. Yes I also get scared seeing small children on bikes but we cannot go on being a slave to the car. We need to change the way we live our lives and build our towns and cities. The more cyclists that are on the roads the safer it will become for them.

If you are worried about hurting other road users whilst driving then perhaps you should go for more lessons

Yes, this in spades. I never understood why you could take lessons and pass your test in Hicksville but can then go and drive in the middle of a huge city after using a motorway to get there. It's like passing your flying test in a micro lite then being allowed to fly a Boeing Airbus - it just wouldn't be allowed. Also you can pass your driving test decades ago and never need to resit it despite the ever changing roads and rules and increased traffic.
My brother works offshore. He has to keep all his safety certificates up to date at his own expense or he would never be allowed to step inside the helicopter to take him to work. Everyone accepts that this is normal and a good thing, but cars, no it's fine to get into a metal box on wheels travelling at speed without ever rechecking that you are still competent enough to do so.

I think posts like this just legitimise the idea that some car drivers seems to have that cyclists are 'idiots' or somehow not ordinary people and therefore they pay less care and attention to them then they should. Why is asking people to notice what is on the road in front of the too difficult?

No my thread legitimises that some cyclists are idiots because they actually are. Unless you're saying that a father let's his 6 year old son cycle behind him on a busy road is responsible behaviour. That is what my thread is about, not cyclists in general, just idiotic people.

Unless you're saying that a father let's his 6 year old son cycle behind him on a busy road is responsible behaviour.

The assumption behind this is there are too many irresponsible drivers on the road, hence 6 year olds should stay off it. To an extent, I agree with you, but think it should be urgently addresses so that it is safe for anyone to cycle.

Not necessarily irresponsible drivers. In the latest scene i witnessed i didn't see anŷ irresponsible drivers. They were driving along a busy road with not much room to manoeuvre. If a child stumbled off his bike the driver of the car would not have been able to prevent it. There's no way i'd let a 6 year old on a road like that.

the driver of the car would not have been able to prevent it

Rubbish. Look at rule 125 in the Highway code. The onus is on the driver to be able to stop or avoid any collision. If they are incapable of doing so, they shouldn't be driving.

What, you'd rely on a rule in the Highway Code to prevent your child being killed? Ffs if everyone obeyed the HC to the letter we wouldn't have any deaths on the road. . The Highway code was not written to be accounting for 6 year old cyclists on busy roads anyway.There are many roads (including the one i was on) that, if someone was on a bike and stumbled towards the cars there would be nothing to prevent it. Slamming on the brakes immediately would not save the child. Rule 25 will not save you ffs. But it seems like you think it's ok. I was talking about an irresponsible father allowing his child to cycle behind him on a busy road, but you think it's ok because of a rule in the highway code. Unbelievable.

I'm going on a course tomorrow to learn how to deliver Bikeability levels 1 and 2 to primary aged children. All those worried about letting your child cycle should look into these courses, hopefully they will be delivered at your school.

I'm going because I cycled my children to school and realised they needed some formal training. So instead of moaning about it, or banning them from cycling, I'm doing something about it and I'm going to train other children too.

I'm also actively recruiting more parents to go on the course so that more children can be trained.

There are tons of videos online, even an app to help everyone become better cyclists. It also describes primary and secondary riding positions. Yes OP the father should have been riding behind and to the right of his child on the road.
One only one adult and children that is the correct riding placement.
Cars should overtake safely (i.e. Plenty of space) in case rider wobbles or hits a pothole and if they can't do that - they wait.

Definitely scifi they should certainly overtake safely and allow for cyclists, unfortunately some roads aren't wide enough to allow for that. Room to overtake safely yes, but if a cyclist wobbles and falls outwards a car would have nowhere to go, as i experienced the other day.

Some roads aren't wide enough???? I thought single track roads existed mainly in the far hinterlands. What do you do if you are stuck behind a slow moving tractor or a horse rider? Like someone mentioned earlier, if there is no room to overtake safely, you wait, no matter how much this puts you out. Any decent, considerate cyclist will eventually pull over and let you past. As would any decent, considerate horseman/woman. I delivered Bikeability for years and continue to educate (mainly adults) about riding in the primary position. Unsurprisingly it's a little known thing because it's rarely mentioned anywhere, even in the Highway Code. I have been actively campaigning for years to try to make it more widely known.

I would not cycle on busy roads. I do cycle to work fairly often, but a fair bit of it is a footpath and most of the rest is quiet residential streets. I'm a very cautious cyclist as well.

Recently saw of family of three - adult, two young children - cycling on a busy road, taking up the whole of that side of the road, meandering along. It did worry me.

On the other hand I saw a family of five, both parents, one with toddler on back of bike and two young children cycling on an incredibly busy road. I don't think I could do it and thought the children were too young, but they were all cycling well and safely. No meandering and no blocking the road.

I would like to cycle the school run with DS2 (then cycle to work). Unfortunately there is no safe way for him to cycle. The council have just built a lovely new cycle path most of the way but it ends on one side of a horrendous roundabout and there's nowhere to go. Absolutely no one will use the cycle path (the super confident MAMILs don't either it just ends in a ludicrous place where they wouldn't be able to get back on the road) and the road is too busy to have an 8 year old on it.

It's very frustrating. We do need to reduce the volume of cars on the road. But putting in poorly thought through and impractical cycle paths doesn't help.

Im getting so annoyed reading this thread. Hearts if there is not enough space to overtake the bike with a whole cars width between you and the bike i.e moving your car fully to the other side of the road over the white line like you would if overtaking another car there is not enough room to overtake and you wait behind the bike until such an opportunity presents itself. You should also wait behind the bike at such a distance that you would be able to stop without hitting the bike if the bike was to suddenly stop.

Also cyclists can cycle two abreast and in the middle of the lane - cycling in the middle of the lane is cyclist speak for "it isnt safe to overtake me at this time"

www.cyclinguk.org/blog/margaretanneorgill/what%E2%80%99s-legal-%E2%80%93-what%E2%80%99s-bike