Aibu to think that hospitals should do more to promote sleep for patients on wards

[Twistandshout77]

The nhs seems stuck in a dark age that doesn't recognise the value of sleep and comfort on patients. How is anyone supposed to recover whilst getting next to no sleep on busy, noisy, hot/cold wards with bright lights, staff talking and creaky metal bin lids banging? I'm just back from a 2 night stay with my LO in which I averaged 3 hours broken sleep a night - it wasn't me that's sick but I came out feeling so! God knows how anyone with a serious illness manages. There's SO much that could be done - and not that expensively. I'm sure they'd see much faster recovery rates and therefore savings too if there was a focus on it. Aibu to think the NHS needs to revolutionise its attitude towards sleep for inpatients? What can I do to start a campaign?!

I had a single room after emergency C-section. Lovely. Except the curtains didn't meet in the middle (by about a meter), and the orange street light was right outside. Very hard to sleep with that shining in my eyes, quite apart from the whole lack of privacy when changing. I think the whole stuff car park saw my post natal catheter removal...

Cinderella you poor thing! One of the wards I've been on the parents of a long termer raised money to but black out blinds for every room - such a small thing but makes so much difference

IMO, as someone who worked nights for years, the most important thing for consistency and good management of nights is regular night staff. Most trusts do rotation of days and nights which actually I don't think it works that well in terms of managing the ward at night. When there isn't enough staff to cover all shifts, nights are the last shift covered which means, agency staff ultimately.

Our trust stopped doing night contracts many years ago but I was able to continue with nights until chose to stop. I was the last person to stop doing permanent nights on our ward and so many patients and staff have fed back that they miss the continuity of regular staff working regular nights, those who know what they are doing. Plus if you don't predictably have a regular staff Nurse on a night shift, it's harder to get good agency staff when needed.

Managing a ward at night is so different to during the day; a lot of the time it can be very quiet, but you have to be very responsive and proactive in dealing with emergency situations and doing so with minimal senior staff support whilst miniminisng the impact on the rest of her ward.

In mental health, I would say completely anecdotally and from my personal experience , that most serious self harm incidents occur during the night shift and managing those completely horrific situations on a skeleton staff is a seriously underestimated skill and challenge.

youcanttakethesky we had a private patient moved out of their NHS side room because another patient actually needed the separate room. The private patient got put on the ward!

Doyouthink - thats a really good point

Off to try and get some sleep now

I went 23 hours with no sleep on one of the days I was back in hospital after csection complications. Doctor, junior doctor, anaesthetist, consultant, some of whom came at 2am and 4am to discuss what was happening next, then cleaners, midwives and auxiliaries throughout the day. I was so grateful for the fantastic care I received but I was seriously losing the plot after a week there and felt i recovered much better at home when i could rest undisturbed.

have only skimmed the thread so sorry if this had been mentioned before, but southampton children's hospital are running a great project to try and deal some of these issues - recognising how important good quality sleep is, especially on a children's ward.
The project is called SHH and they're doing things like having set bed times and lights out times (agreed with patients), using torches with red lights, less disturbing night time checks, etc. And it seems to be working well for staff and patients.
Here's a link: www.uhs.nhs.uk/AboutTheTrust/Newsandpublications/Latestnews/2016/Southampton-clinicians-lead-pioneering-childrens-sleep-project.aspx

I have to chime in here.
-Antenatal with ds- hell. Was next to the window which was broken open. It was snowing outside and apparently there were no blankets left. Fucking noisy bastard bin. Noisy bitch nurse chatting in another language to staff then cackling at 4am having turned on the lights to the ward to do someone's ctg which she could have used their personal light for. I actually hated that nurse and went to pals over her. She was an almighty horror.

-Postnatal with ds on ward- hell. What the actual fuck is wrong with people?? Go the fuck home it's 1am and I don't need to hear you yelling at your girlfriend because she's not handing over the money for your weed you stupid prick. Staff did nothing. Also, fucking noisy bastard bin.

-postnatal with ds but in private room; peace and flippin quiet. Except my exceptionally loud ds and broken shower, that was a heavenly space for a week. Bin even closed quietly

• postnatal with ds2; private room, end of corridor and bloody lovely. Angels, all of the staff.

• ds admitted a few months back- infection so regular (hourly) obs. They were so respectful, so kind. Even when I had to nip home (emergency admit to hospital so nothing with us) they had students sit with him and watch dvds. Play specialist came in. Oh god they were so amazing. I woke to his every hourly ob but he didn't. Ds talks about it now- his little trip to see the girls in hospital 😊

Even the bins were quiet. No lights put on unnecessarily. No nurses congregating chatting noisily. Small things can make such a huge difference

It costs nothing for nurses to have their (non-emergency) conversations in low voices. It's a culture issue not a financial one. I once got woken for a shower at 5.30am because apparently it was 'easier' if the night shift organised patients' showers. Easier for who?

PollyFlint the examples you cite are all taken to an extreme, and not necessarily what the OP was suggesting (i.e a climate controlled ward) but many hospital wards are hot and noisy, hence why I've often found patient's dozing after morning rounds. Jesus, contrary much?

I had one 2 week stay, one nurses squeaking shoes all most made me kill her. The noise went right though me and you could get everywhere on the ward. No sleep for anyone for nights on end

I agree its awful.

My dd is 6 months into a hospital stay. What i find worse is they dont like you to leave the parent bed down at all during the day. So whilst you could potentially get a little extra sleep after rounds etc you aren't allowed.

The Southampton scheme is insaine. 8pm is too early its just at shift change over. Its not enforced more than 25% of the time. And actually my teenage dd doesn't want to go to sleep at 8pm. They need a core 8 hours protected.

They need to bed plan better.. ie babies together teens together. If that means moving patients then that needs to be done.
Bins need to be consistently soft closing.

The noise nearly drove my grandad insaine. It really didn't stop. I think adult wards are worse in my experiance.

The side bays with 4-6 beds in need doors to shut to reduce corridor noise.

Nurses are generally quiet and overnight admissions. Can't be helped.

But there is a lot of small things that could be done.

Completely agree.

My mum was in and out of hospital with leukaemia and she suffered terribly from lack of sleep. It had a terrible effect.

While I know it's a hospital and not a hotel I think a much stronger set of noise rules for nighttime would be helpful. Obviously difficult for wee ones.

A little pack with a sleepmask and set of earplugs like you get on certain airlines would be a bloody good start.

So would telling patients BEFORE they go to sleep if they are going to be woken during the night and why. Managing expectations is hugely important.

Totally agree. I've spent far too much time in hospital over the years and nights were hell, nurses calling and shouting to one another and laughing loudly and those bloody noisy bins ( or rather the people using them!) were the worst.

And patients talking on their phones all night!!

Dimmed lights.
Only essential care between 10-6 (NOT asking people what their menu choices are or getting them up for showers)
Mandatory headphones in tech from 10pm.
Staff can absolutely be expected to speak in less than raised voices when anywhere near bed bays unless an emergency.
And yes yes yes to the bastard bins.

yanbu at all.
smaller occupancy rooms would help. 3 patients max.
night matron to endorce quiet time.
parients who need regular obs at night need to be in single roooms do the other patients are not disturbed.

non squeaky shoes for nurses/other staff.

and yes to the bins, they are horrendous.

I work in residential homes. Used to manage them, now just work relief. A big theme in these home's is managers wanting to feel like they're getting their money's worth out of nights staff, so giving them many cleaning tasks to do overnight. This is obviously noisy and disruptive - the priority should always be facilitating the best nights sleep possible for the residents or patients rather than satisfying a managers sense of fairness beause they feel night staff get an easier shift....

OP YANBU at all! Family members have been in and out of various hospitals over the past few years and the differences between them have been remarkable. The very worst had staff shrieking with laughter all night, beds which didn't wheel straight/porters who couldn't drive which banged into doors, beds and walls, clanging bins, Tvs on all night etc etc. The best was a haven of peace. It was clean, calm and dad got incredible care on a range of wards both night and day. I think it depends on the overall standards expected by the managers tbh.

I should add I did have a side room so was on my own but the person who came in to take my food order in the middle of the night snapped all the lights on too
I was like "I've just had a 5hr spinal op 7hrs ago and not slept yet, just order me anything!"

Oh yes, this has really hit a nerve with me.

Ten years ago when I had my DD - after a three day labour followed by crash section - I spent the first 24 hours getting better with medication and pain control and reducing swelling, and the subsequent 48 hours getting steadily worse from lack of sleep and food. I was supposed to stay five nights but begged them to discharge me after three as I was starving and exhausted to the point of hallucinating. I fell asleep in the car on the five minute journey home.

It's left me with a phobia of hospitals and healthcare which is really becoming a problem. My DD now needs a routine operation requiring a probable three night stay and I am really dreading it; her last stay was a similar nightmare. She is very nervous about the op and I'm trying hard not to let her pick up on my fear but at the same time planning as though for a nuclear winter. I really feel for parents staying with their kids when it's a more serious situation

It makes me sad because I'm a big defender of the NHS and public services in general and I fully understand all the pressures but just think these issues could be dealt with. It would be a great campaign for Mumsnet to lead, as there are obviously so many experiences and ideas!

Yanbu.. I spent 2 nights in hospital last month and it was very hard to get sleep.
However I don't think it can be helped. I had to have obs done every 4 hours so if the noise didn't wake me then that did!
I was able to sleep during the day tho. I really can't see what could be done to change this, unless each patient had their own sound proof room!

When I was in for an extended stay before the birth of DC1 I was so fed up of all the wake ups (I was on a ward in a large city which had people like me being failed to be induced but also all the poor mothers who were coming in with pre-term problems) I went to the reception and asked for ear plugs and a night mask (like you'd get on a long haul flight)- they looked at me as though I was insane, but the noise was something else and I always questioned the link between this chaos/stressful environment and DD1s apparent insomnia. Having ear plugs and night masks would be a simple measure that could help.

I agree however having previously been on the receiving end of through the night care I can see how the noise can often not be avoided