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Original poster

Fence (Who's the CFN)

38 replies

Lockstoc · 04/08/2017 16:49

Bought house 3 years ago, terraced house.

One side of garden fence is the one with the issue. This possibly shared fence (deeds just state boundaries, not who's responsible for it). Has an access gate (Vendor had paid for this gate and some fence panels, receipt was in with the various paperwork when we bought the house. Unsure if gate was a replacement or new).

Access has only been used across the neighbours back garden once or twice a month maximum by our Gardener and to put the garden waste bin out. It's not ever used whilst they're in the garden and no damage has ever been made to their garden. (They don't maintain their garden; overgrown with grass, brambles and nettles. Rubbish also dumped in there).

They've now put a lock on the gate fence so that we can't use it. We asked why and they said they didn't want us to use it. We've asked them to remove it nicely which they've refused. (They're not nice neighbours).

We really need the access in the summer (rarely used if at all Oct-Mar). We don't want to have the gardener taking the lawnmower through our house each visit or want to do the same ourselves with the garden bin).

To add neighbours moved in just over a year ago. Previous tenants had no issue with us using our gate.

OP posts:
honeylulu · 04/08/2017 16:54

Ahem! Where's the diagram?

ohmyblob · 04/08/2017 16:56

Do you have a right of way across their garden? We can't decide without a diagram.

RainbowPastel · 04/08/2017 16:58

Don't you have your own rear gate to an entryway? Sounds weird if your only access is through your neighbours garden.

YouCantBeSadHoldingACupcake · 04/08/2017 16:58

If you have right of way across their garden they are the CFN ,if you don't then you are

teainbed · 04/08/2017 17:01

I think you're the CFN! We have this except we're the mugs who let our neighbours gardener tramp through our garden repeatedly with no right of way. I spat the dummy and fitted a lock, it's been bliss ever since.

user1471548375 · 04/08/2017 17:01

Is the gate there because you have right of access? Or because of an informal agreement with the previous neighbours. What do the deeds say?

SantanicoPandemonium · 04/08/2017 17:02

Check you're deeds to see if you have a right of way across their garden - it's fairly common with terraces that don't have rear access.

If you do, they're legally obliged to give you a key for the lock. If they refuse, you might to get a solicitor involved but this might have to be declared if you sell your house in the future.

user1471548375 · 04/08/2017 17:02

Ignore last one - deeds not clear! If that's the only external access to the road from your garden they are BU

JumpingJellybeanz · 04/08/2017 17:03

Do you have a right of way across their garden? If you do, the they're out of order locking it. If you don't, then you're the CFN.

teainbed · 04/08/2017 17:04

I think if you buy a mid terrace you have to suck it up unfortunately.

BewareOfDragons · 04/08/2017 17:06

I imagine you have a right away if it's the only external access from your garden to somewhere other than through your actual house. H&S and all that...

JumpingJellybeanz · 04/08/2017 17:08

You can't assume access because it's mid terrace. My last house was a mid terrace and only had access through the house. As did the house I grew up in. It's not unusual.

RaptorInaPorkPieHat · 04/08/2017 17:13

If the deeds don't state right of way, then you don't have one.

Just because you're a mid terrace doesn't mean you will have external access to the garden (our neighbours don't).

RatherBeRiding · 04/08/2017 17:17

It's not the gate that's the issue. The issue is the fact that the garden is their own private property, and unless there is a right of access then you are not entitled to use it as such.

You need to take legal advice I'm afraid.

Anecdoche · 04/08/2017 17:18

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

teainbed · 04/08/2017 17:21

Indeed! We live in a terrace of 20 houses there's no way all those houses could have right of way over each other! Bins have to be stored at the front of the house or brought through on bin day.

paxillin · 04/08/2017 17:25

What access you "need" is irrelevant, if you don't have right of way you have to make other arrangements. If you do have right of way, the lock has to go.

John4703 · 04/08/2017 17:25

To add neighbours moved in just over a year ago. Previous tenants had no issue with us using our gate.
Are the new neighbours also tenants? If so it might be worth contacting the owner or agent and asking if they are aware of the lock being fitted.

honeylulu · 04/08/2017 17:26

OP you need to explain!!
So the gate is positioned in the fence between your back garden and neighbours garden - its that right?
And you/ your gardener have historically give through through the gate, into your neighbours garden, to get access to ... what?
Is there an exit in your neighbours back fence into a rear alley? And your garden does not have this access directly?
Why do you think there is a right of access via your neighbours garden?

Gentlygrowingoldermale · 04/08/2017 17:28

Access through house only is not unusual.

Access through other people's gardens and house is not unusual - lived in one for a couple of years.

The deeds are the key, what do they say?

Gazelda · 04/08/2017 17:28

I think it's irrelevant who owns the fence. The only consideration is whether or not you have right of way across their garden. Your deeds will say you do if you have.

Collaborate · 04/08/2017 17:30

For many older terraced houses the middle houses have right of ways across the other back yards to be able to deliver coal. that is usually a ROW for all purposes. You can, for £3 (£6 with a plan) download your deeds from the Land Registry. Have a look at them. If you have a ROW send your neighbours a copy and give them 24 hours to remove the lock. Also point out to them that as the receipt for the gate is with your deeds the gate belongs to you, so they are not allowed to affix anything to it.

Check you home insurance for legal cover. If the neighbours don't immediately relent, see a solicitor.

Even if there is no written ROW the existence of a gate suggests that one has arisen due to at least 20 years usage. I'm willing to bet money though that there is a documented ROW on the deeds. There's probably also one on your neighbour's deeds. Download those as there will probably be a note that their land is burdened by a ROW.

paxillin · 04/08/2017 17:30

Are the new neighbours also tenants? If so it might be worth contacting the owner or agent and asking if they are aware of the lock being fitted.

Well,, tenant or not, they pay for the use of their private garden. The LL could give in to his tenants to use his property, who pay him, or the neighbour, who does not. What if the neighbours want to use the kitchen or bedroom on account of them being tenants?

All of this is void if there is right of way of course.

Allthebestnamesareused · 04/08/2017 17:34

If the deeds grant you a right of way then you have one.

Just because the previous owner put a gate in the fence does not mean you have a right of way. (See CFN thread about people putting doors in to get access to OP's private garden).

Ascertain from your conveyancing solicitor or the deeds whether you have a right of way over their property. If you do let them know you wish to exercise your legal right of way.

If you do not have a right of way they are entitled to keep trespassers from using their property.

rightwhine · 04/08/2017 17:35

Did any of the other terraces also use the gate? A right of access would normally be there for all those in the terraces.

If they are tenants then appealing nicely to the landlord may solve the issue if there is no right of access but you can't go in guns blazing, if he backs up his tenants.