To be shocked that this documentary is almost 20 years old?

[MrsOverTheRoad]

The Eyes of a Child was made in 1999 and highlighted the terrible neglect and poverty experienced by some children in the UK.

I remember it coming out...it's just as shocking today as then...I am surprised there hasn't been a follow up!

I hadn't seen this before, terribly sad but I feel this is more about neglect in the context of poverty rather than poverty alone. I would love to know what happened to david, he seemed very intelligent and insightful and l imagine would have done very well in school with a bit more love and support.

Thanks for the link...will watch later

I just watched this & have to say I'm speechless. Some of these kids were my age at the time. I was thinking of what I was doing as a 6yr old & how lucky I was to have a childhood. It's sad to see & know this does happen. What a shock to the system. I'd like to think that all those kids got a second chance at a good life. Did they ever do a "where are they now?" Episode?

This documentary came up in my youtube recommendations the other day and I'm finding it so powerful and harrowing that I had to search to see if there'd ever been a thread about it here to talk about it.

I did find a digital spy post from about 2011 which said they had researched into the documentary participants and the twins looked happy, both working as hairdressers in Bradford. There was no source for that though and I don't know how reliable it was.

I would have been a year or so older than the older children in this documentary in 1999. I don't think of myself as coming from a wealthy family (in fact my LEA paid my university tuition fees as I was classified as being in a 'low income' family) but this film is something else. I had a very sheltered upbringing. If I had any awareness of children like these ones, I would have been afraid of them and considered them 'bad'. An adult perspective on what they are saying and what is shown is heartbreaking.

Maybe I'm still naïve but I don't think things are quite this bad anywhere in the UK now, are they? I sincerely hope not.

Just been watching this....extremely depressing. The filth of those girls! poor kids.. no way was that just being ''on the dole''..that was pure fecklessness, not washing them or their clothes.
How could a place get that bad?? the children would be in their twenties now...sincerely hope they are not repeating the cycle of deprivation.
Love costs nothing, attention costs nothing, reading a bedtime story costs nothing...it is like Jack London's ''People of the Abyss'' all over again. [1901 era]

Came here looking for ''updates'' on the children..but no one seems to know for sure what happened to them.

I had my 6th child in 1999 so a tad busy but have looked on the link.

Beyond sad op but not the dole. Both dh and I had dads on the dole in the 70s and trust me we were washed and fed.

This is neglect and bad awful parenting

Might watch tomorrow

Is that the one where the little girl said she gets called a scruff, but she can't be a scruff because she has a bobble for her hair?
If it's the same one it's heartbreaking. I watched some of it on a neglect course recently.

Thing is, there was an initiative to tackle this - Sure Start. Iirc the criteria for being considered for a children's centre was a certain percentage of babies with low birth weight, a certain percentage of unemployment, a certain percentage of parents accessing mh services etc - it was all very targeted. They ran classes and sessions every day covering all stages of 0-5 together with intensive parenting classes etc and the take up was huge. Also I think what helped is that they actively looked for people from the community to train in childcare qualifications to continue the work of the centres. So there was locality and ownership built into it. Now largely gone by the wayside but one of the few well thought out Labour programmes that, had it continued, looked set to genuinely make a difference.

Sgree sure start was an incredible achievement by I think Tessa Jowell?

It’s loss will cost us all dearly

It really will. Particularly because people did properly embrace it, including the so-called 'hard to reach' families identified by Cameron later. Of course they did, because most people aren't bad, most people don't really not give a shit, and if you sell them something that involves them doing the best for their children and being active participants in the process - not being talked down to or poor you'd but being treated as intelligent thinking agents - then yes, they will respond. Plus the fact that they were community rooted meant that there was an element of wanting to do the right thing because that's what everyone around you - all your friends, all your neighbours - were doing. It reached people on so many levels.

I read an update on the comments section and the girl who said she can't be a scruff, is ok now...they all are. Much better situation all round.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-stoke-staffordshire-44532905

For all those saying oh filth is not poverty it is neglect. Perhaps but there are schools where teachers expect the children to come into school filthy, that rent uniform. There is barely enough money for rent, electric, gas, food it a struggle. Cleaning products become luxuries that can't be afforded. The parents don't want to be in this situation but can't escape. Some schools are stepping up. But it really is a world that you can't imagine unless you have come face to face with it. It really feels impossible that it can be happening today in the UK. But it is.

Hills, I think it's complex. Obviously when you can buy a bottle of all surface cleaner for a pound, it's not a case of never being able to afford to clean your house for an entire six months, or six years. But actually what living in poverty does to a person is very often put them into a state of low level depression. Not so that they're slashing their wrists, but so that every single damn day involves the same thought processes - kids are bored; what can I do with them; shit that costs money; fuck it can't do that; let's just get by Fancy something nice for tea tonight; shit, that costs money; can't do that; fuck it let's just get by.

Until your whole life becomes a mere chain of just getting by, because you can't do anything, can access anything, there's a whole world closed off from you because you don't have money and everything gets smaller and smaller and your environment shrinks to just getting by, just doing the minimum to stay alive because it all takes so much effort. And like fuck are you going to clean the skirting boards, because you are already drained mentally just thinking about what you can get hold of to eat that's hot and will fill everyone. And then cleaning the sink feels like one more fucking faff too far when you've spent days working out how late you can pay your council tax before they send you a letter while still being able to top up the metre, adding to the neverending sums you do in your head that never quite add up. So the sink gets left as well. And so on.

So, yes, it's neglect, but it's a neglect that has its roots in poverty rather than carelessness. And in desperation, and in just not having enough mental space to think of even one thing more because your head's so full already.

This reminds me of my first proper boyfriends family. I come from a very poor family, but my parents really tried their best. My boyfriends mother was a functional alcoholic and barely held it together.
It is poverty and the parent or parents not coping for a variety of reasons. And often either no extended family to fill the gaps, or extended family that was also unable to cope. In my boyfriends case non of the extended family or his father was involved. His mum and the 4 kids were just left to their own devices.

In her case I suspect she just couldn't cope with 4 kids alone and with very little money and living in a seriously rough area. This was back in the early 80s and I don't remember there being any help at all. And benefits for families were far lower then.
I think many people who parent fine would also struggle in these circumstances. I think you have to be mentally stronger to cope okay.
His mother had worked as a cleaner for many years, but was no longer working due to arthritis.

Exactly, crunchymint - her life would very likely have been different if she'd had a husband pulling in a decent wedge, or even people around her offering support or an ex who was in any way useful. So what was the real problem - the fact that she couldn't cope or the fact that she was in a terrible situation?

If this is about neglect and poverty, you can still have neglect and money, which would make for uncomfortable viewing