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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder why the NHS plans where the it gets completely decimated isn't being reported?

34 replies

JustATadConcerned · 06/06/2017 21:40

As leaked and published in the health services journal, available to view online (with a subscription) and backed up by North Devon 's hushed plans to shut emergency and maternity services. The plan talks about unpalatable changes being needing to be made, and "challenging the value base" of NHS leaders.

It discusses cuts to staff, bed, theatres and services. It plans to limit the number of outsource companies the nhs can use, so less operations can be offered on the nhs. Fertility treatment and 'low value' treatments will be cut, and some prescription items removed.

It's horrendous. And yet it isn't anywhere in the news. I'm posting in a desperate hope that this can't be allowed to happen. I'm an NHS nurse, I'm not normally passionately political but please, please, vote anything but tory on Thursday. I'm absolutely terrified. Sad

OP posts:
BillSykesDog · 06/06/2017 21:42

'Leaked' in the HSJ? Can you please cut and paste this?

JustATadConcerned · 06/06/2017 21:52

Yes, here you are.
re.

Exclusive: New national savings drive will 'challenge the values' of NHS leaders
5 JUNE, 2017 BY DAVE WEST, LAWRENCE DUNHILL, BEN CLOVER, ALLISON COGGAN

Closing wards and services, blocking choice of private providers, systematically extending waiting times, and stopping some treatments are all being considered under a national programme targeted at the health economies with the highest overspends.

The controversial measures are currently being discussed privately by national NHS England and NHS Improvement officials, with senior local NHS leaders, as part of the new “capped expenditure process”. The principle of the process, introduced this year, is to “cap” NHS spending in the targeted areas so that they meet ”control total” budgets in 2017-18.

NHS leaders from areas covered by the CEP have been told to examine “difficult decisions” and “think the unthinkable”, including modelling changes which are normally avoided as they are too unpleasant, unpopular or controversial. HSJ has spoken to senior officials in most of the areas.

One chief executive said it was the most extreme and difficult NHS finance process they had experienced, and that the some of the options - if pursued - would “challenge the value base” of NHS leaders.

Ideas under consideration across several areas include:

Limiting the number of operations carried out by non-NHS providers so the funding stays within the NHS. Considerations differ between areas but include both limiting patients’ choice of providers, and reducing work which is outsourced by NHS trusts. In some cases it would require the NHS to find the capacity to carry out more operations.
Systematically drawing out waiting times for planned care, including explicit consideration of breaching NHS constitution standards. Some plan to target delays at specialties/areas where waits are currently lower than average.
Stopping NHS funding for some treatments, including extending limits on IVF, adding to lists of “low value” treatments, and seeking to delay or avoid funding some treatments newly approved by the National Institute of Health and Care Excellence.
Closing wards and theatres and reducing staffing, while seeking to maintain enough emergency care capacity to deal with winter pressures.
Closing or downgrading services, with some considering changes to flagship departments like emergency and maternity - though these would normally take too long to deliver savings this year.
Selling estate and other “property related transactions”.
Stopping prescriptions for some items, as suggested by NHS Clinical Commissioners earlier this year.
Leaders in the areas have been told to first consider whether they can make further efficiencies by normal means, such as reducing follow-up appointments or unnecessary referrals. But all of those HSJ spoke to - covering more than half the areas involved - said they were also putting forward new “difficult decisions”.

Meetings to discuss the CEP proposals with regional and national officials, including NHSE and NHSI finance chiefs Paul Baumann and Bob Alexander, took place throughout last month. No proposals have yet been formally approved or rejected, sources said.

Decisions are expected after the general election, and some of the officials involved have been told they will be put to the new ministerial team. There is no expectation of details being made public until after the election.

About 14 health economies - most of which are sustainability and transformation partnership areas - are subject to the process. They were chosen because they were expecting to fall substantially short of their “control total” financial targets in 2017-18.

They include:

Bristol, South Gloucestershire and North Somerset;
Cambridgeshire and Peterborough;
Cheshire (Eastern, Vale Royal and South)
Cornwall;
Devon;
Morecambe Bay;
Northumbria;
North Central London;
North Lincolnshire;
North West London;
South East London;
Staffordshire;
Surrey and Sussex;
Vale of York and Scarborough and Ryedale.
The programme comes amid the longest ever sustained squeeze on the NHS budget, and with lower spending growth in 2017-18 than last year. These areas report gaps between plans and targets running into hundreds of millions of pounds, but NHSE and NHSI have not made public the total national gap.

Several sources complained that the national process - which is likely to require some 2017-18 contracts to be reopened - had run more than two months into the financial year, rather than being completed earlier.

Many also said that, while they had put forward “difficult decisions”, there were no sensible options which would save significant sums during 2017-18, without storing up problems for the future.

There is also debate over whether it is fair to target health economies based on their “control totals” - which require some to have surpluses and are based partly on past performance - rather than looking at absolute surplus or deficit.

An NHS England spokeswoman said: “Within their fair share of the NHS budget, local doctors and hospitals are planning how best to deliver services to patients focussing on the priorities of the public, including modern cancer care, expanded mental health and convenient GP services.

“While many options will have been considered locally, the choices of which options to pursue are still to be evaluated and agreed and would require national sign-off in due course.”

OP posts:
DarlingCat · 06/06/2017 21:56

Too tired to post anything sensible but bumping for you in the hope more clued in posters come along.

Joyofscreamingjoy · 06/06/2017 22:01

Because the people who are in charge of the reporting are benefiting? All geared toward privatisation to line the pockets of the mega rich.
Just a guess.

tigerdog · 06/06/2017 22:02

I can confirm that this is happening nationally, across the NHS. Every region is being asked to make massive savings. Rationing that isn't being driven by clinical need is taking place already. NHS performance standards are deteriorating daily so people are waiting longer. Loads of services were moved out of NHS funding to local authorities a few years back too, for example drug and alcohol services, school nursing etc and these stopped being ring-fenced. I saw first hand contracts cut by 40-50%, reducing services to a shoe string. It's been pretty dire for a long time, pretty much since the Tories have been in charge.

acquiescence · 06/06/2017 22:10

It is likely to not be reported because the people in charge of our national media are massively rich and in favour of Tory taxation policies and do not want to show what is actually happening to this country under their rule.

This is pedantic and I am not trying to undermine your point at all, but 'completely decimated' does not make any sense as 'decimate' means to kill/destroy one in ten.

I'm also an NHS nurse and I back up and support your plea to everyone to vote anyone but conservatives on Thursday. Thanks for sharing.

JustATadConcerned · 06/06/2017 22:24

@Acquiesence the dictionary definition for you.
decimate
ˈdɛsɪmeɪt/Submit
verb
verb: decimate; 3rd person present: decimates; past tense: decimated; past participle: decimated; gerund or present participle: decimating
1.
kill, destroy, or remove a large proportion of.
"the inhabitants of the country had been decimated"
drastically reduce the strength or effectiveness of (something).
"public transport has been decimated"
2.
historical
kill one in every ten of (a group of people, originally a mutinous Roman legion) as a punishment for the whole group.
"the man who is to determine whether it be necessary to decimate a large body of mutineers"

OP posts:
acquiescence · 07/06/2017 07:17

Yes, the dictionary definition backs up that 'completely decimated' still makes no sense, it would mean to 'completely remove a large portion of'. If it was just a 'large portion' it is not 'completely' as this would mean all.
But as I said, I was being pedantic and the main point is what matters.

JustATadConcerned · 07/06/2017 07:42

And you making that point is the reson I don't post on mn anymore. Derailing the topic completely when even if my grammar is poor or wrong, it still gives an inkling of what the subject is.

This article is huge but lets just nit pick, ffs.

OP posts:
pumpkin321 · 07/06/2017 07:47

This is indeed absolutely terrifying, I've posted something similar on fb this morning. I dread to think what will happen to our NHS if tories get back in.

DarlingCat · 07/06/2017 07:50

OP, I am glad you posted this. We all make grammatical errors from time to time especially on threads, it's not exactly a report or essay you we're writing. Saying that I am always grateful to be corrected on my grammar as long as it's not patronising, which I didn't feel Ack was. The main thing is that the NHS is being decimated and too few people truly know the extent of it.

DarlingCat · 07/06/2017 07:55

pump not if but when they are in charge Sad Sad Sad.

Have you seen today's DM headline? They are in for the kill propping May and destroying Labour, very much as expected. The headlines today as loud and garish as the "Enemy of the people" ones last year.

The Daily Mail and their Russian sponsors are in charge of our beautiful country now.

ssd · 07/06/2017 08:01

I dont know why labour dont bring out a tv advert actually telling people this stuff, instead of airy fairy wording...the people don't know the nitty gritty and the media will never report on it so most people don't actually know the facts.

This is horrendous.

SayNoToCarrots · 07/06/2017 08:05

What are you talking about acquiescence? To completely decimate something you only need to remove 10%. If you are going to be a pedant, at least get it right.

AlternativeTentacle · 07/06/2017 08:06

It's horrendous. And yet it isn't anywhere in the news.

And who is running the news? People that are in need of the Tories being voted back in?

ssd · 07/06/2017 08:07

FFS stop arguing over ONE word, this is too important to turn it into a squabble about one shitty word...we all know what the OP meant.

ssd · 07/06/2017 08:08

thats why labour need a party political broadcast telling just plain straight facts...and soon.

bruffian · 07/06/2017 08:13

This is all discussion and ideas.

We need to do something to the NHS.

People have to be allowed to discuss what to do with it without people freaking out.

bruffian · 07/06/2017 08:14

No proposals have yet been formally approved or rejected, sources said

Headofthehive55 · 07/06/2017 08:15

I do wonder about some appointments though. Recently going through the genetics department it seemed impossible just to get the test without the several appointments surrounding it.
Even though we were health literate professionals who said, yes we understand what we are asking, have studied the subject in detail, but no, several appointments had to be done first.

JustATadConcerned · 07/06/2017 09:31

North Devon NHS have said that they need to close maternity and a and e but they aren't allowed to announce before mid June...

OP posts:
JustATadConcerned · 07/06/2017 10:38

It's now being reported in the independent and the daily mirror.

OP posts:
notanewuser · 07/06/2017 10:47

Oh and here we go - is it 24 hours to save the NHS again? Or is it 7 days or 3 is it? The election gets close the NHS gets rolled out as the weapon of choice for the left.

bruffian · 07/06/2017 12:14

this is why the nhs should be completely depoliticised

cross party committee to run it

thetemptationofchocolate · 07/06/2017 13:20

I have seen the report about North Devon's A&E/Maternity closures. I can well believe there is a plan to do this but am wary of being manipulated by people with a political agenda. How can we check this?