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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to feel my children school have joined a cult

77 replies

Schoolcultworry · 06/06/2017 17:35

I have 2 children at primary school. It's a lovely warm school which I was very happy with.

Recently they signed up to 'Leader in me'. Looking at the information it feels a bit cult like to me and I don't feel comfortable with it.

Does anyone else have children who go to a 'leader in me school'? What are your thoughts? There are very few in the UK (only 12 according to the website) most are in the USA.

OP posts:

YouTheCat · 06/06/2017 19:11

I hate these 'one size fits all' shitty nonsense things. It is my own personal bugbear, currently.

DarlingCat · 06/06/2017 19:26

What's a MLM?

"Hard to pick my least favourite 'Habit' but I think it's Habit 2: Begin With the End in Mind • Have a Plan - are we saying that human activity is pointless and to be discouraged unless it has a pre-decided 'outcome' attached? "

What about creativity?

TakeThatFuckingDressOffNow · 06/06/2017 22:28

I would be flipping my lid if the school were trying to brain wash my kids!!!!

Exactly - not evryone can or should be a leader.

Fuck me, what is the world coming to!!!

Littlepleasures · 06/06/2017 22:31

I Agree with harder. How would our society work if everyone was aiming to be the leader? What a load of tripe. Having worked in schools for years, I thinkwhat children really need is to discover and be valued for their actual strengths which will vary wildly according to a wide range of factors, inherited and environmental. Glad I'm out of education now. Was way too soul destroying to have to follow ideologies that went totally against common sense and basic understanding of healthy child development.

emmyrose2000 · 07/06/2017 05:38

What a load of revolting, unrealistic claptrap.

Be Proactive • You're in Charge
What happens when everyone's trying to be in charge at the same time? It's a recipe for disaster. Not everyone is cut out to be, or wants to be, in charge/a leader. The leaders need people to actually be in charge of!

Yura · 07/06/2017 06:15

That craze went through big companies about 10 years ago. Haven't heard about Covey in tve last 5 years, guess they are looking to get money from schools now...
i'm cynical, but these sort of things do tend to go through big companies regularly and everyone gets crazy abouu them, but schools...

Mummyoflittledragon · 07/06/2017 06:15

This sounds awful. It isn't applicable to children. Children are learning. Life isn't about synergy, goals and end games or being in charge and sharpening the saw, whatever that means. It's about learning from mistakes, experimenting and having as much as possible, that's how we learn the most. If children actually follow this indoctrination, there would be no sports clubs and ballet schools and riding schools. Because for 99.9% of children, who will never carve a career out of this, there is no end game beyond taking part for the pleasure. i would not be happy with my dd in this school.

jennielou75 · 07/06/2017 06:32

We are looking into growth mindset stuff and I must admit it has me on edge. I really don't want to label a child in my class as prince or princess charming!

Mumteedum · 07/06/2017 06:33

Ds ' school is going to end up an academy. This is exactly the kind of thing I'm worried about.

Bananamanfan · 07/06/2017 06:42

Sounds ridiculous. I would not be happy with this ethos in my kids' school. Playtime must be interesting with so many little leaders marching about.

ArgyMargy · 07/06/2017 07:05

It is not ridiculous, it is a very well established programme. I went through the 7 Habits training many years ago and it includes excellent ideas and practical tools. It is absolutely not "me me me" and not designed to force everyone to be the leader. Try thinking about this habit "seek first to understand, then to be understood" - could be useful to most of the posters on this thread!

ArgyMargy · 07/06/2017 07:07

Oh, and "you're in charge" applies to yourself not the group. You are in charge of yourself and how you respond to others. Bit obvious really.

Ceto · 07/06/2017 07:08

I once worked somewhere where the managing partner was a total sucker for this kind of thing. He'd spend a fortune getting people in to train us, we'd all give it a go and find out the defects, then quietly shelve it till his next big idea. I wouldn't mind, but the manager never actually took the training on board himself, so he didn't exactly lead by example..

MaisyPops · 07/06/2017 07:10

Mumteedum
If it helps put your mind at rest, none of the academies I've worked on have done that kind of thing.

That kind of big spending on fads would make me raise an eyebrow at a school.

Any decent school can promote leadership habits without buying in a programme.

Ifailed · 07/06/2017 07:13

Does the head get a kickback if the school joins

It's an Academy, so almost certainly someone associated with the school or the various suppliers making money out of it will be.

AppalazianWalzing · 07/06/2017 07:13

I'd strongly recommend you read the seven habits book- it's not as bad as it sounds in many ways, but tbh it's not something I'd see as for children. I'm sure they've adapted it, but would be curious to see how- I know there's a seven habits for kids book. Get them from the library, I feel they've got enough money!i worked for an organisation that had bought in a covey plan: it was used to redesign our performance appraisals and mostly involved adding a layer of wanky language to everything.

As an adult, I found the book vaguely useful. I don't think it's a cult. However I do think some of the points are inappropriate for children and the stage they're at. I think the leadership language in the book is actually more about self-control, and not in a selfish way- there's a lot about 'service' to your community etc. It's more about not drifting. But- children are meant to drift.

There's also a whole bit about love as a verb and how a friend of his was going to leave his wife because he didn't feel the love anymore and he told him love is a verb, spend some time understanding your wife's life, give her love and support and do things for her and see if you feel differently. And obviously in the book this saved their marriage, and it's not the worst advice in the world if you're in a relationship rut and taking your spouse for granted. Or even in general relationships: to think about the other persons motivations. But again- not advise is want a teenager entering into relationships to have.

In general, is be shocked if it had to much of an effect. I agree entirely the money could be better spent. But I wouldn't freak out two much: they've adopted the flavour of the month in management circles from twenty years ago. It's not as individualistic as it sounds. It's a bit like they decided to redesign PE classes around a spinning guru- a bit confusing and baffling and a bit of a one-trick pony but the kids will still be getting cardio.

Mummyoflittledragon · 07/06/2017 07:19

Argy. Perhaps you should also seek to understand first. I get that the in charge is in charge of yourself. Try teaching that to a bunch of 5 yr olds, who will understand the former. I stand by what I said. This is not a good programme for children, who should not be in a end game and goal oriented environment.

ArgyMargy · 07/06/2017 07:23

Mummy you have decided it's inappropriate and yet admit you don't know anything about it. So read the book - better still, read the version designed for children. Better still, talk to the school's leadership team about what they intend to do with this programme. Rather than stating it is damaging and a waste of money.

Brokenbiscuit · 07/06/2017 07:28

I think the 7 habits are sound, and they're more about individuals taking personal responsibility for their lives than "leadership" as such. I wouldn't object to my dd being taught this stuff in school, if it was done well.

However, I can't get past the cost of this programme. Given the issues with school funding, that seems a huge amount to be investing, and I'd be rather concerned.

ArgyMargy · 07/06/2017 07:32

There is no evidence that the school has paid $50k. I think OP found this price on the US website.

mummytime · 07/06/2017 07:38

Yura Schools are always getting into new things, which are often applied in a half baked way and then fade. School I know have been into at various times: "Styles of learning" eg. Kinetic etc., Myers-Briggs modified stuff, NECTAR (where each lesson had to be taught to meet Needs, Engage ....etc), Growth mindset and so on.
Even the good ideas are often carried out half heartedly by some of the teachers, and others (learning styles) turn out to be bunk.

Personally I would talk to the school and get them to explain what they are doing and why.

And a lot of these programs seem to involve children learning stock phrases or technical language without actually really teaching them anything. EG. my son was given an intervention in reading where a big part seemed to be teaching them to refer to "phonemes" rather than sounds.

Mulledwine1 · 07/06/2017 07:46

Sounds quite good to me too. I read the book ages ago.

Those saying it's not suitable for 5 year olds, I guess it has been adapted for the age group so will be suitable.

It's definitely not a cult!

Mulledwine1 · 07/06/2017 07:47

I forgot to say that I have done a few courses since I started work and I often wish I'd done them earlier - they would have been very useful at school.

Yayne · 07/06/2017 07:56

It'd be enough to move my children - I don't want them to model an effective business leader in primary school. I want them to learn to read, write, love learning, think for themselves and be a good friend. You don't need fancy programmes, just great teachers.

I thought ours with a 'growth mindset' was weird enough

diddl · 07/06/2017 08:07

There might be some valid points, but wouldn't it be possible to adapt something along those lines to be suitable to a primary shool without having to buy in & use that particular spiel?

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