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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To wonder if there are supporters of grammar schools who didn't go to grammar schools themselves

849 replies

WildebeestH · 24/05/2017 14:57

Just that really. The only friends I have who support grammar schools went to grammar schools themselves. I'm intrigued to know if there are many people who support them having not been to a grammar (or other selective) school and if so why?

OP posts:

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Peregrina · 28/05/2017 11:52

What I expect to happen, certainly in my area, is that some of the struggling Independent schools decide become Free schools and market themselves as Grammars. Which will be popular with some parents, because who wouldn't want to save £3000+ a term?

GreenGinger2 · 28/05/2017 11:53

How is it going to become a grammar? Literally hardly anybody is interested or sits the 11+, there are no other comps in the academy?

BertrandRussell · 28/05/2017 11:54

And whatever happens, privileged children will get more privilege...........

noblegiraffe · 28/05/2017 11:55

How is it going to become a grammar?

How can you be sure it isn't? Tory plans so far have allowed for current comps to convert to grammars.

MaisyPops · 28/05/2017 11:55

A private school in a nearby town has done just that.

It's converted to a free school. So you had a lot of parents paying fees to.send their child to the primary for the 2 years prior to conversion to guarantee their child a place at it once it was in the state sector.

Sounds a bit like "we weren't making enough money charging fees and could make more if we go state". I always thought it was funny that the funding wasn't available to help struggling schools in that town get better.

GreenGinger2 · 28/05/2017 12:06

Could you just remind us what a privileged child is?

BertrandRussell · 28/05/2017 12:17

Children like yours and mine.

GreenGinger2 · 28/05/2017 12:29

You don't know what my children are like. What is a privileged child?

BertrandRussell · 28/05/2017 12:38

A privileged child is a child with aware, involved parent/s. Who is warm and well fed. Who is talked to and read to. Who has clean clothes and a healthy lunch box. Who has books and good television. Who has space and time to do homework. Who is safe and allowed space and time to be a child. Who gets positive attention.

MaisyPops · 28/05/2017 12:54

betrand
Part of the problem trying to discuss privilege with people who have lots of privilege is that often people are blind to their own privilege and start being picky to hide from the fact that some children have a very lovely upbringing, some have money thrown at their education, some are read to from a young age and fed well whilst others don't know if they'll have hot water or electricity that night, have to sofa surf for a week because mam and her boyfriend have split again and he's kicked them out, can't be helped with their school work because mam and dad left school with al,oust no qualifications, have been in care on and off their primary years.
(All true things I've seen within 10 mins of where I teach).

But accepting that some kids may have loads of otential but have had a shite hand in life doesn't sit well with the MN people on education chats because it suits them to ignore the reality of life for many kids up and down the country,

GreenGinger2 · 28/05/2017 13:00

But privileged is having special rights what Bertrand has described is simply what the majority of children in this country have.

RoseandVioletCreams · 28/05/2017 13:03

My DF was not privaliged according to your definition BR and he had to work long hours.

He got to G school because his teacher said he had potential and told him where he was weak and he got help within the school. Changed his life....Of course he wouldn't have got in nowadays, because the rug has been pulled from underneath pupils like him by primary schools withdrawing help and yes - left to the dc of interested parents.And of course those at private preps.

RoseandVioletCreams · 28/05/2017 13:05

maisy I had much of that too actually, I was moved around a succession of B and B's for a time, no hot water, leccy regularly off...freezing cold in winter and all doused in lashings of alcohol abuse, occasional violence and great instability. But guess what! I went to private school.

noblegiraffe · 28/05/2017 13:06

Around 400,000 kids in this country don't even have their own bed.

www.familiesonline.co.uk/life/news/thousands-of-uk-children-don-t-have-their-own-bed

RoseandVioletCreams · 28/05/2017 13:06

Green some people don't know their arse from their elbow.

MaisyPops · 28/05/2017 13:11

I have never said it couldn't happen in private school.

I said that children have a range of upbringings and that is often forgotten in these discussions.

Now it's just turning into a 'but what is privilege' as a way to deflecting from the fact that any adult with an ounce of sense knows exactly what privilege is. It just suits people to pretend it doesn't exist.

I was a privileged kid because my parents who had nothing in their own childhoods worked their arses off to buy a smallish house close to good schools. If I'd stayed in the failing school I was in then I wouldn't be where I am now.

The kids in my current school are generally from leafy suburban areas with about 1/3 from more deprived areas. They are privileged.

It's just disingenuous to go around pretending that some kids haven't had a more privileged upbringing that means the system works in their favour.
And it's the people who benefit from the system who are often more willing to deny the issue.

GreenGinger2 · 28/05/2017 13:26

A child having their own bed is not privileged.

GreenGinger2 · 28/05/2017 13:31

And chucking the word privileged in even when it isn't even used properly to tug at the heart strings is ridiculous.I think some posters wouldn't know what underprivileged is if it bit them on the bum.

RoseandVioletCreams · 28/05/2017 13:32

I have never said it couldn't happen in private school.

^^ I know - sorry not directed at you but to previous poster who doesnt seem to understand how varied things can be

BertrandRussell · 28/05/2017 13:34

"And chucking the word privileged in even when it isn't even used properly to tug at the heart strings is ridiculous.I think some posters wouldn't know what underprivileged is if it bit them on the bum."

I honestly don't understand that post.

MaisyPops · 28/05/2017 13:40

Ah right rose. I thought it was.
Yes, things can be very varied.

The longer I'm in education, the more I feel the system is set up to preserve the interests of more affluent parents and their kids though.

Headofthehive55 · 28/05/2017 13:41

From the outside, we look privileged. I would say my children are quite disadvantaged really. However there are different forms of disadvantage. Some of which don't get much recognition.

BertrandRussell · 28/05/2017 13:43

"I would say my children are quite disadvantaged really"
I am assuming they meet the definition of privilege I gave earlier?

Headofthehive55 · 28/05/2017 13:49

there is considerable uncertainity whether I will be around to see them through school. They know this, and see me quite poorly at times. They also know it may affect them in the future, which does have quite an impact.
But yes, they have a bed!

BertrandRussell · 28/05/2017 13:53

I am very sorry to hear that.

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