DS thinks he can teach himself to pass an exam in a week. AIBU to think he is wrong?

[user1494154933]

This is going to sound ridiculous and I wasn't going to post, as you'll probably call me stupid or irresponsible, etc.

My son is now 18. He isn't a 'genius' or anything like that. He did ok at GCSEs but didn't try hard at all. I used to try my best to get him to revise for him exams, he refused to and said it was pointless and exams don't help etc. which is ridiculous because as much as I do agree it's about memory, you clearly do need to know, anyway, he did ok and got accepted into sixth form, he decided not to go and got a part time job but did a part time photography course in the evening (he is still doing that).

I don't really know how it came about but I think I brought it up about how his exams were important and does he agree now he has matured and he was saying how he doesn't agree because exams aren't showing how intelligent you are, etc. and anyone can do them if they learn the exam technique. Last year (around december) he was telling me how he was going to prove it, he booked himself into the Maths AS exams for this summer (last year you can do these ones I believe). He hasn't learnt anything yet and I keep bringing it up (he spent £150 odd pounds for the exams (private candidate) and will sit them at his college he goes to part time) and he is telling me 'to wait and see'. He says when he has a week until the exam he will start learning the technique of it? I could slightly understand if a different subject, but he seems to think for Maths it works the best. I really don't understand his whole thinking behind this, but can't wait to be like WTF when he doesn't pass...

AIBU to think this is just stupid and not possible?

I have been following this thread with fascination, and will be very interested to see how OPs son does! Please will you let us all know his results when they come out?

Ok seeing as all the Maths geeks are here, may I ask some questions please?

I grew up and was educated abroad, in a very different system. I did the Maths & Sciences stream in our 6th Form equivalent. Except it isn't really equivalent - it was four years rather than two, age 16-20; and much less specialised: Everyone in my stream did Maths, Applied Maths, Physics, Chemistry, Biology, Geography, History, literature and linguistics of our native language, two MFLs, and either Art or Music. The kids in the other streams did Maths and Sciences too but took them less far/covered less stuff, devoting more time to e.g. MFLs if they were in the MFL stream.
So we did four years rather than two, but much more spread out over many subjects, rather than concentrating on just three or four. Now I have always wondered how what we did in Maths would compare to Maths A-Levels. On this thread most people who have real insight into Maths A-Levels have been pretty certain that it would take an exceptional individual to achieve what the OP's son is trying to do. I of course have no way to judge but it what everyone was saying seemed to make sense. Then OP's DS did those mocks and surprised everyone...

So I had a look at the A-Level Subject Content as published here

Except I don't really understand how that document ties up with what people have been saying here what with C1, C2, applied modules, etc and what is AS vs A? And where does Further Maths come into it - a few instances in that doc refer to 'Further Maths only' e.g. complex numbers.

I am asking because I'd like to understand how amazing it is what OP's DS is trying to achieve, but also because this thread has made me consider re-visiting my maths. Perhaps even go and do some A-Levels as a private candidate (giving myself more than a week to get up to scratch though!)
I would be doing it out of interest, because Maths is fun. But also on the background of having been out of work for a long time with nothing really to go back to, so having a recent qualification might help with getting back into work eventually. Or is that silly?

For info, having looked at that document linked above, we did do pretty much everything on there in our course. Including complex numbers and matrices. Though things like the kinematics mentioned, we covered in physics rather than in maths.
I was very good at it then, achieving A* equivalent without much effort apart from turning up to class. But it has been over 20 years since and most of it is gone. It would be quite an effort to re-learn it all. Any thoughts from the maths people here?

Bigweald, A level maths changes from this September, so it won't be broken into stand alone modules such as c1, c2 etc.

Further Maths is a seperate a level, so students can take two maths a levels, (or currently even 3 if they really want to).

I can explain more about how the modular system works, but if you are looking to take a level maths in the future this won't apply.

Thanks Kitten, so that subject content I looked at is the new one (it says for teaching from 2017)? And it will be one exam at the end of a two year course covering the entire content, presumably?

Whereas OP's DS is doing modules, one exam each week, C1, C2 are modules, and FP1? (Is that further pure maths rather than an applied module such as statistics? Or is one applied module mandatory as well?) But in general it is still intended as an exam at the end of a 2 year course, just that the exam is split into several parts to be sat on several days?
Sorry for all the questions, this thread has made me really curious :)

I've been following with interest glued to it. On tenterhooks to hear how OP's son gets on in the real thing. DS came home desolate yesterday after C1, saying the paper was really hard. Going back I can only see one poster mention it, so asking you all "How difficult was it?"

Have bought the new calculator too!

BigWeald if I have understood correctly from this year A level Maths will become linear rather than modular.

At the moment students can pick from a number of modules (though it isnt a totally free choice, come modules are compulsory). They take the exams for those modules. Depending on how many of the available modules have been taken the awards available are AS level (advanced subsidiary) A level Maths, A level Further Maths.

An AS student takes the lowest number of papers and a student studying for A level Maths & Further Maths will have taken the most. Currently students are able to be strategic and decide whether they want to 'bank' results to collect the level achieved or carry on to take more papers. At the moment my DD is planning to 'hold' the results of the A level papers she takes this year so that she can optimise her chances for good grades in both A level maths and further maths.

From next year AS and A level will become separate complete linear courses. Edexcel is offering AS Maths and Further Maths and A level Maths and Further Maths, I assume the other boards are doing similar.

This might be a useful read:

qualifications.pearson.com/en/qualifications/edexcel-a-levels/mathematics-2017.html#tab-3

Sock, which exam board did your dc use?

Gnome explains the system very well. 3 modules for as, 6 for a level. fp1 is further pure 1.

Ok, thanks Gnome, I think I get it :) From those specifications it seems that A Level Maths by itself is a less comprehensive than what we did (two decades ago in a different country in a four-year course) but if you do Maths & Further Maths you get to about the same place.

Just one more question, out of interest: In the soon defunct modular system, would you take exams on those modules throughout the year? At certain points within the year? At the end of each year? Or simply at the end of 6th form, i.e. at the end of the two year course?
And if you got bad results on a certain module, could you try again in the following year? Or supersede it with results from a different module?

SockJr is taking AQA AS this year (and A2 in 2018). Yesterday was C1, next week is C2 and a fortnight later it'll be D1. He revised plenty and was quietly getting good C grade on practice papers. Yesterday's paper was a bombshell and he got totally flustered AFAIK.

Going from what DD is doing, modules are taken at the end of 1st year of 6th form and at the end of 2nd year 6th. The student gets the marks for the ones taken at the end of 1st year but not a grade unless they are just doing AS. If the marks are good then the student will take further modules either just enough for the A level or more to achieve the Further Maths A level as well.

The student can opt to resit modules where they feel they lost marks but that will tend to impact on their ability to study for additional modules.

I actually think the modular maths approach is quite good - introduces the idea of strategy into the process!

Gnome, I think they are given a grade for their AS results and then they also count for A levels. Unless, they choose not to for some reason.

musicPosy, your DD's view of the C1 (?) AQA yesterday sounds like SockJr. Do any of the maths teachers here .... Noble? ... have a view?

My school does OCR not AQA, students' view of C1 was 'not as bad as last year's, but the answer to everything was a fraction and the questions were not like previous past papers'.

OP, how is C2 going?

DD sat the C1 for edexcel yesterday. Her view was that it was a bit harder than the past papers they had seen but fine overall. Today they went through the mark scheme and DD was happy with what she had done.

I talked with her about the modular system she is in. Her view is that it works well for students who are sitting on grade boundaries as it allows students to resit multiple times to maximise grades or points.

They benefit from having a senior teacher who was a former examiner for the exam board and who knows how to get the best out of the system.

You get grades for AS on your result sheet. If you go on to A level they might be different. DS1 got AA at AS and AB at A2.
Of course there is no A at AS.

The exam board also figured out the best combination (aside from the compulsory ones), to get the best results.

It's weird that there is no a at AS! Some schools sit the a level maths in year 12 and further maths in year 13. Modules with 90+ ums are graded a when they are being used for a level but a when used for as level.
That's right isn't it? Or do they just award the grade for the total UMS for each level?

That's strange Kitten because A is only awarded for A2 modules. To get an A in maths you have to have a 90% average over C3 and C4. It doesn't matter what you get in C1, C2 or either applied module so long as you average an A in those. So no A* for M1, S1 or D1.

oh ok, I'm completely misunderstanding that bit Noble. I've not got my head round it at all!
When dds college grade as mocks, they give a* marks for over 90% but make it clear that they will get an a in the AS.
Thanks for the clarification.

How does it work for further maths?

As I understand it, for Maths & Further Maths there is a bit of juggling about with the non-core papers to decide which ones are put forward for Maths A level and which for Further Maths. From next year the jiggery pokery stops as they are all separate courses.

I think this is a bit of a shame. The modular course allowed students to start A level Maths, decide that it is not for them but still come out with an AS.

For Further maths they maximise the A-level maths grade first by using your best modules. Then they look at what's left - obviously some FM students choose to take extra modules on top of what is required so to get an A in FM, you need to average 90% in your best 3* A2 modules. FP1, M1, S1, D1 are AS modules, so anything ending in a 2 or higher can count towards it, and they could all be applied modules.

From next year the jiggery pokery stops

From what I hear on twitter, some schools are having to stop running Further Maths because no one's willing to give it a try when they only have three choices. Maths take-up has also dropped because no one wants to risk taking it, finding it really hard but still having to take it for 2 years.

Total disaster.

Marking place!

My school are completely bucking that trend noble, we've got more students opting for maths A level than ever. And we've got slightly more than normal choosing further maths. Dd's school aren't offering further maths from next year, although they almost didn't run it this year either and changed their mind when pupils and parents complained. Dd would have moved school if she couldn't do FM, she'd have come to my school (and hated having to make that move)

Sorry noblegiraffe my jiggery pokery comment was a bit tongue in cheek. In my second para I hope I made it clear, I agree with you. For many students beyond GCSE is leap of faith especially in Maths where the subject changes hugely.

In DD's school many, many more students start A level maths than finish. Having a flexible system which allows them to demonstrate understanding beyond GCSE though not the full A level. Modular AS level gives them somewhere to go if the leap proves too much.