AIBU to think there's nothing wrong with buying part of an old country house?

[notborntothemanor]

DH and I are moving (within Yorks). We've been house hunting for a while like 3 years so no hurry then. Three DCs. Finally found a place I really like. Old Victorian house divided into three, each with 4+ bedrooms a third of the garden etc. I'd say manor house but not really that grand or big more like big old country house for some rich old Victorian bloke. Mostly done up. I love it. High ceilings, big windows, details, wood floors and so on. DH is worried about offering on it for the following reasons: (1) There are several like this around the areas we are looking and they all take ages to sell and price drop a lot or go off the market (we've been looking at three of them for years and none sold, one in this same house). Maybe the prices will go lower, he says, and more importantly (2) why aren't people buying them? Is it because (3) homebuyers reports often show roof and windows problems, spot of mould etc, or (4) septic tanks and shared driveway responsibilities? But this place is literally twice the size of something newer, and it's grand-shabby outside (I quite like that). Am I missing something? AIBU? If you wouldn't buy a place like this, why not? I could post in property, but I'm more interested in what the people not in one of those stress chain situations would say, I think....

The lack of control of repair bills and maintenance costs can be very stressful, esp when you first move in and are strapped for cash.

Plus if you don't get on with your neighbours, it could be tricky. It sounds like living in a large flat, with all of the associated hassles.

I really don't understand these responses, yes stuff could go wrong, that's the same for any property if you think hard enough for the negatives.

Our home is somewhat similar, it's an old listed building, a large old house split into two. Although we each have our own gardens, we have effectively a shared drive, it's a private road, and in three years I've never had a problem. The neighbours are great. We even socialise together, people laugh when I call it a semi detached house but that's what it basically is and no different to any other semi detached I've lived in before.

It's not a shared garden, they each have their own garden and the houses are split, like a terrace or a semi detached.

Op, you won't be outing yourself by posting a link, I'm sure many folks have viewed the property,,,I'd also say if it's to be your forever home it's important you love it and there is no reason to think you will fall out with your neighbours,,no more than if you were buying any other semi detached or terraced property.

I'm a rural surveyor and whilst I don't work in agency, I have got involved in quite a few similar set ups with party wall disputes and repair liabilities on shared access/parking/gates/gardens/common areas.

They don't sell well because people are apprehensive of them so bear in mind if you buy, you could get a good deal but selling may we'll take 4-5 times longer.

Personally, I wouldn't touch it with a shitty stick.

I've lived in one of these for a short time. I agree with the poster who said you're getting a terraced house with a detached price tag. That said, you also get much grander surroundings than you'd get with a similarly sized, normal detached house on a street. So it's horses for courses.

The shared freehold thing can be a problem if you get one person who is stupidly tight and refuses to pay for essential maintenance, so it's worth looking at the detail of this.

Septic tank? Agree - not a problem. If you have one, it's probably because you're too remote for mains. We have one. It gets dealt with and isn't a problem at all - you just have to be a bit more careful about people flushing tampons etc (but you're not supposed to do that anyway, even on mains).

Not my cup of tea at all.

Old houses have thick external walls but the walls separating you from your neighbours in this case will be thin internal walls. I lived in a Victorian conversion and could hear my neighbours chatting through the walls far more easily than I can hear my kids on the next room in my superinsulated modern building standards house.

Friend had a similar one in bath and just had two years of a leak in the kitchen as one owner refused to allow access and pay their third to mend the roof as that bit of roof didnt effect them. Id avoid anything like this as a result.

Among other things the absent Landlord of the rented flat would concern me. Is he easily contactable? Does he care about the state of the property? What condition are the other two flats and the rest of the house in? Are you going to have to spend much on repairs and how would you deal with hidden costs?

Could you not rent a similar property and rent out your current home?

Roof is mended now but cost alot more than should as went via solictors. Several false starts too. No avoid avoid avoid! My friend went through hell. Every morning he had another story to tell. (Work friend). Theres a reasons he and his wife have sold it now.

I think you need to be clear that the property is right for you enough to deal with the potential major complications of a dispute over repairs and maintenance. I've seen too many friends live with years of stress and conflict, literal and legal, while, for instance, rainwater damages their property from a roof that the upper flat refuses to fix.

I wouldn't touch it - I want control or nothing. But that's me.

I've had very positive experiences of shared freehold -- management committees have been easy to run, even with landlords who rent out their part of the property.

It's also much better value than leasehold (which I would run a mile from).

I think it sounds lovely, OP! I agree with PP who suggest that other locals may see these properties as a 'semi', and that's why the lower value.

I bought an amazing place with similar perceived 'downsides' (set off the road, so up a path and no off-road parking) which meant it was a great price and I got a great deal and was very happy with the choice. If it's right for you, then great!

Places like this are REALLY hard to sell. One near me has been on the market for 10 years. It even featured on Escape to the Country, and although the couple loved the house they said no way due to the close proximity of neighbours.

If you are determined, offer low, and accept that you won't be able to move easily.

It's the shared drive that would bother me. My friends have one that needs complete resurfacing. That would cost c£30k. The neighbours are refusing to pay, and they can't afford that by themselves so have to drive down what is effectively a pot holed muddy lane to their house.

I live near a development like this and as others have highlighted, you need to watch out who your neighbours are. The worst was the lady who originally owned the whole house and who could not let go of her status which even translated to her dictating to us what we could and could not do in our entirely separate house well away from the development.

I think some original owners cannot accept that they have sold off part of their property and truly believe they are the landlord and the new rightful owners are the sitting tenants.

These houses take around 3 years to sell. Even one with a building plot which was reduced by nearly £100,000 still took a couple of years.

There are four homes there, three of which are holiday homes and the owners want to bring the Cotswolds to the NW and it simply does not work. Permanent residents receive letters about our hedges, gardens, allegations of stealing land and general dislike for the "untidiness" of the countryside in general. They are not committed to the community and are very noisy, rude, snobbish, inconsiderate people.

The new owner of the main part of the house has already been to see us, having been manipulated by the holiday home owners and even complained about another neighbour's hedge and trees which he cannot even see from his home. I think the point I am making, generalisation it may be, but sometimes these properties attract a certain type and petty squabbles can become magnified.

We are off grid and oil is an issue you need to consider as it is basically like filling your car up with petrol and you are subject to price turbulence. Septic tank not really an issue - the only issue being shared ownership and ours is not. We also have a private road. The road owner had it dug up when he had his barn converted. He then asked us to pay to reinstate it. I think not and we are under no obligation within the deeds. I am happy to pay to maintain the road, but not to put right his mess. However, no bad feelings between us because he is well known for his try-ons.

If there is no plan for essential works do you trust the other owners have £50k knocking about to put towards the roof / drive / other structural aspects when the problem arises?

If not how long will the property have to go with a leaky roof before repair?

They may all be nice but if there's no emergency funds you could still be living in a glorified tent with sheeting for a roof for months on end. During which time it would also be impossible to sell.

I don't think the house is split into flats, unless the op says otherwise, I think this is effectively a semi detached or terraced set up? So no different to any other semi detached or terraced house.

If your husband doesn't want the house it's wrong to try to pressure him into it.

I don't agree with the terraced house comparisons.

A roof constructed as one piece is different to one built as three roofs joined together. Surely that's obvious? Also if it's an old building is it listed? Would it require specialist materials to repair? I cannot imagine a specialist roofer agreeing to repair or maintain one third of a roof. It's not something someone reputable would be keen on doing.

The same will be true of other structural elements of the house. They won't be able to be worked on piecemeal in the same way as different houses in a terrace can be.

Our flat in London was very like this....big old house portioned off into flats.

Pros were: massive bedroom, living room and kitchen compared to a newer flat. Literally double the size. High ceilings, big sash windows, big chunky skirting and coving, really lovely looking place all together.

Really lovely for entertaining, parties, hosting guests etc. Room to move about and flexibility about what we could do in rooms as opposed to friends who really were stuck with how many people they could accommodate.

Cons were: much much bigger heating bills than a modern place, those high ceilings plus old construction = freezing in winter.....

Much more upkeep than a modern place eg roof tiles would come off in quite mild winter storms due to their age and state of repair, so a slightly stormy night to everyone else would quite often be a 5k bill for us (high ceilings = high roofs =scaffolding all the flippin time).

Very poor sound insulation...really easy to overhear conversations etc from the neighbours because as an old house designed for one family no sound insulation between quite thin internal walls. At one point we accidentally bought the same bt handset as our neighbour and had to change it as if we were in another room and heard the landline, we couldn't tell if it was our phone or the neighbours ringing without going to check.

Also share of freehold an utter, utter pain in the arse. One owner didn't really have the money to do anything but the absolute minimum and often then we would have to chase and chase as they simply didn't have spare cash to spend yet the work still needed doing. Another owner was very keen to organise us into restoring everything properly to a high standard eg replastering the whole facade when we couldn't afford to do merely cosmetic work....Its one thing to own an old property that needs a lot of maintenance on your own, but when every repair involves negotiating with other owners who might not have the money, this is a pita, and led to a lot of hard feeling.

We really enjoyed living there as we were young, no DC, quite a lot of disposal income, wanted to have lots of parties etc....we moved out of london after dc and now wouldn't consider a similar set up now, as our priorities have changed.

(Incidentally, we had an equal share of the freehold, but that meant we were leaseholders with a share of freehold, (not sure you can just be a freeholder if only a share??), so we needed a limited company to manage the freehold between us which meant company bank account, monthly maintenance charges, annual returns to HMRC, AGM,s, minutes, freehold insurance paid for between the leaseholders etc etc

A roof constructed as one piece is different to one built as three roofs joined together. Surely that's obvious? Also if it's an old building is it listed? Would it require specialist materials to repair? I cannot imagine a specialist roofer agreeing to repair or maintain one third of a roof. It's not something someone reputable would be keen on doing

Are terraced houses constructed with seperate roofs? I do not think this is the case in most instances and yes of course reputable builders fix one part of a roof, you can see many terraced houses where one has a new roof.

My neighbour had roofing problems that did not impact ours, they pay to put it right and I can assure you they use very reputable roofers.

Incidentally, I think the time to sell issue really does depend on location...there are a lot of these type of homes in London and they don't take ages to sell there, might be a regional thing so that wouldn't necessarily put me off, depending on area. Our flat was valued Friday morning, we gave agent go ahead of fri afternoon, was due to go on market on monday morning but they brought three couples for a preview on the saturday morning and all three made over asking price offers on the saturday, so was sold before it officially ever went on the market.

I'm in Oz where septic tanks are far more commonplace and they're no bother at all.

They come and empty it when it's full...we can't put anything down it...that's all. So no "accidentally" flushed tampons or anything. We've had no bother.

The terrace analogy is wrong...the reason the repair bills are spilt is not because its one roof (like a terrace) but because freeholder pays for structural repairs, if freehold is divided into three, each freeholder pays 1/3rd for repair, regardless of whose bit of the property the repair is in. That is why it is completely different to a terrace.

So I would totally buy I house like this however I don't think I would buy this house.

Things like septic tanks, no gas, flying freehold, listing are just lack familiarity. You can overcome all of this if you accept they are a PITA but worth it for the building. Ditto higher heating bills if you have the budget enough jumpers

What would really put me off this house is the absence of a management company. Your interests will never be the same as the person who is renting their property. Eventually bills like guttering, driveways, roof will come round and without an annual fee to the management company, you will have a massive hit. Plus you will be wanting them done so everything is lovely and perfect and the letter will be wanting to put it off to the last minute and scrimp on everything can you tell I have been there?

Share of the freehold is OK if someone is running it properly with accounts, returns, keeping extra money in the kitty etc etc - have seen flats like this and wished I bought one of those instead of mine.

It's usually better to be leasehold than to share a freehold.

This entirely depends on the freeholder/management company and the other freeholders IME. I have had a useless freeholder-sharer which was annoying but nowhere near as bad as borderline criminal freeholders who threaten legal action over nothing, refuse to maintain and extort money for fake insurance policies.

Not that relevant to the OP! But for others reading, just in case. And a freehold share on a small scale can be done through a simple trust - no need for a company.