Detention for "under achievement"

[oddbin]

School question: DS1 13yo had an assessment and they didn't do very well on some of the questions. The teacher says they can resit that part of the assessment. However if he again doesn't do very well on that part of the assessment he will get a 30 minute after school detention. Is that normal? AIBU to say he is not doing a detention for that?

oddbin:

Of course it is. Provided the question is different, he will only pass if he revises. That is no less real because he failed before.

There are very few exams you can't resit. I took my driving test 3 times. By your logic I woildn't have been able to do that.

But it isn't a GCSE or a driving test it was an assessment of his ability and learning. Any child who didn't get 100% could be made to reset every assessment they ever have. It's not realistic.

oddbin:

Let's take what you just said for a moment:

Any child who didn't get 100% could be made to reset every assessment they ever have. It's not realistic

If the assessment is a Maths exam, it is testing the students on certain skills. These are things they can either do, or not. Yes?

Okay. So, if the test is 'repeated' but the questions are different each time, and eventually the child gets 100%, what is 'unrealistic' about that? Surely it just tells you that the process of learning/testing has (eventually) resulted in the child understanding how to do each type of calculation?

so I am now wondering whether she is worried about a certain number of her students underachieving it may look bad on her LOL

Yoi do know that these assessments will place them in ability groups for GCSE year don't you?

And you do know your DS is being given a second chance AND if she phrased is as 'Homework revision' you wouldn't be annoyed you'd be grateful?

Your son needs extra help - the only time she has is after school -

Just say NO and let him go in the lower set

I agree with Oddbin about resits. Yes, the student should have learned the content first time around, if they didn't then resetting the same assessment (and in my experience, it is exactly the same test retaken) doesn't actually give them a chance to learn the material properly - all they do is learn the answers to those three questions so they may understand that portion of the topic or they may not even understand that much and just regurgitate an answer they have learned off parrot-fashion.

Retaking assessments just gives students the idea that they don't have to put too much effort into anything because you just get to redo it over if necessary. Life, work and relationships don't generally work that way!

What I mean is it is not realistic for every child to get 100% in every assessment. Should they retake an assessment if they got 90%? If they got 95%? Are we saying that all students have to get 100% on every test and they will be made to repeat them until they do?

oddbin:

But nobody is suggesting that. Your implication is that you think your DS has already done his best (not just his best effort but the beat he is capable of) and therefore it is a waste of time him revising and being tested again.

Is that the case?

*best

Did your son get 90 percent 95? I highly doubt it if he's being asked to resit.

The tests at this stage look at his general progress and numeracy/literacy. Just let the teacher do their job or teach him the areas he's lagging behind in yourself. I find it ridiculous that you've even posted asking if this is unreasonable. No wonder teachers are leaving the profession in droves.

It depends on what the point of the test was. If it's to see if he had understood and revised, with no other purpose, then yes, he's failed that and there'd be no point to doing it again.
But if, as is more likely, it's to ensure that he knows X and Y before they move on to the more complicated Z - then, yes he should do it again. How else could the teacher be certain that he knows x and y? How long it takes him is important too, but it's not as important as the fact that he knows it before moving on.
The detention wouldn't bother me. If he was slow to understand, I would assume they would have mentioned at the teacher meeting. The fact that they didn't would suggest that his ability is fine, but he was just being lazy on that occasion.

Trifle you suggested that.

Okay. So, if the test is 'repeated' but the questions are different each time, and eventually the child gets 100%, what is 'unrealistic' about that?

Astro The detention is not for her to teach him this is if he doesn't get a very good score the second time round as a punishment. Like it says on the original post.

Unfortunate

It's not uncommon for children who've done particularly badly on a test to be retested. The point seems fairly straightforward; the teacher doesn't think they've revised the topic sufficiently so wants them to learn it again. I don't think it's about getting 100% - it's about making sure they've learned it well enough.

oddbin:

But you were saying it would be pointless to keep retaking if you had already 'maxed out' as it were, by achieving a near-perfect mark. I would tend to agree. But your DS failed. Unless you believe his failing grade is the best of which he is capable and no improvement is possible, I don't see your problem with him doing the work and retaking the test.

Subject?

Smellysphinx that's what I thought

Doing the work yes understanding it yes but re-doing an assessment and having their old score wiped off as though it never happened and a better score in its place is not reflective of the childs skill set at the time.

Is it a detention as in a punishment? Or more being kept behind to go over the work?

Dc's school do keep them back after school if work isn't to the required standard. It isn't called a detention though, and the subject teacher also stays back and goes over the work with them. It happens fairly often- they also do it as an optional thing if kids feel they need help.

oddbin:

Of course it is. As long as the questions are different (so he isn't swotting up on the actual test questions or getting answers from elsewhere) his skill level will simply be retested. It is exactly like putting in for your driving test two weeks on, practising in the meantime and doing better the second time.

What is your real issue here?

What was the purpose of the assessment?

You need to talk to you child and the teacher. I'm guessing either a lack of effort in class or lack of revision.
The issue is this work needs to be done. Redoing the test gives the teacher the chance to check this work has been completed and the detention would be punishment if the work isn't done.
If that's the case then I would agree with a DT.

Really no it is a detention as a punishment which is planned only if the score in the re-test is still bad

The detention is not for her to teach him this is if he doesn't get a very good score the second time round as a punishment. Like it says on the original post.
I think this teacher believes your son to be very capable of getting a good mark on this assessment and for whatever reason he didn't put in the effort to do so the first time round.

He is getting a second chance and considering many assessments at this point steer them into their GCSE groups it shows she has an interest in your son's education.

The threat of detention is this teacher taking an interest in your son doing well because she believes that he can and wants to force the issue with him. You should be grateful! Not all teachers would bother.

Trifle I don't agree I think the teacher doesn't want her students having bad scores because she thinks it will look bad on her, she implied there were quite a lot of students in the same position which leans me to think the teaching could've been poor. This has never happened to my child before.

She is not doing it for the learning because if he fails the second test he gets a detention and that's it. No more learning no more chances they move forward as is.