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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

baby boomers ..confused

125 replies

ZackyVengeance · 08/03/2017 10:26

how can a baby born in the early sixties be one?
baby boomer
nouninformal
plural noun: baby boomers
a person born in the years following the Second World War, when there was a temporary marked increase in the birth rate.

OP posts:
olderthanyouthink · 08/03/2017 13:39

Ssshhhhhh mega

Still a bit shit that yeah I can have a career and no ones going to stick me in a looney bin but I'll never retire and may never own my own home (or have somewhere to live that I can decorate/refurb/live in as long as I like)

Allthebestnamesareused · 08/03/2017 13:47

Eek as a November 1964 that chart puts me as a baby boomer - 2 months later I'd be a Gen X.

I think I am a Gen X as my parents are baby boomers!

FellOutOfBed2wice · 08/03/2017 13:48

Just googling and found my generation (I was born in 1985) being referred to as "Generation 9/11". Seems fitting as the terror fear has been a spectre over my adult life so far.

PunjanaTea · 08/03/2017 13:55

Werkallhouz that's a really interesting perspective I hadn't really considered the inter-generational debate in a US vs UK context before.

I was also just pondering that the focus on different generations diverts quite a lot of attention away from the problem of an ever widening wealth and opportunity gap across all age groups.

Megatherium · 08/03/2017 13:56

olderthan, there are plenty of the baby boom generation who have never owned a house and never will. And things like dying or being permanently disabled from TB and polio are a bit different from never being put in an asylum, aren't they?

DrDreReturns · 08/03/2017 14:01

There are two peaks in the baby boom - one in the late forties and one in the early sixties.
I've just read 'The Pinch' which is an interesting discussion about baby boomers. The main point is because the baby boomers have a lot of voting and financial power (because they are a large cohort) they can influence public policy more than other generations.

www.amazon.co.uk/Pinch-Boomers-Childrens-Future-Should/dp/1848872321?tag=mumsnetforum-21

senua · 08/03/2017 14:04

"Generation 9/11". Seems fitting as the terror fear has been a spectre over my adult life so far.

Yes, it was lovely before then. No cold war tension.
I had a plan formulated for when the three-minute warning came. Do you have a similar plan now?

WaegukSaram · 08/03/2017 14:06

I really hate the millennials = entitled crap. You're talking about a generation who have little career stability, are likely to end up living with their parents and won't be able to afford homes.

Gen Xer here. The one thing I don't want to do as I get older is cast aspersions on the people coming up after me. If I ever say the phrase "young people today" or "what happened to the common courtesy that I was brought up with" please shoot me.

DrDreReturns · 08/03/2017 14:10

I agree WaegukSaram. Young people today have it way harder than my generation (Generation X) or the baby boomers. Horrendous house prices, massive debt from higher education, rubbish pensions etc

wettunwindee · 08/03/2017 14:16

Technically my parents and grandparents a boomers

Get to fuck.

Never has a single sentence made me feel so old!

Smile
olderthanyouthink · 08/03/2017 14:28

mega I think less millennialist will own their home than boomers, I didn't say all boomers do/did. And yes not being put in an asylum is different to not dying of tb my point is that we shouldn't have to go back on things to get something else. Eg women having careers but possibly never being able to retire.

wettun sorry! It's only just true (maybe not true for all of at least 1 of my GPs) eg my dad was born in 1964 and his mum in 1946 (I think).

Batteriesallgone · 08/03/2017 14:39

I remember when studying history with the OU I did a piece on the 60s. I took it on myself to interview various people through work/family/friends etc who had been over 16 in the 60s.

The point that was hammered home was that your experience of it was wholly rooted in where you lived. Someone who grew up in rural Devon did not rush out to get the pill or shag about; someone who was in Liverpool in their 20s waxed lyrical about the music, the 'free love', the optimism...

This whole crap about baby boomers suffers from the same problem. It depends entirely on where you were and the opportunities you had. A London baby boomer will probably have had a very different experience to a rural one.

space83 · 08/03/2017 15:18

1983-2001 - New Boomers
1965-1982 - Generation X
1946-1964 - Baby Boomers
1929-1945 - Lucky Few
1909-1928 - Good Warriors
1890-1908 - Hard Timers
1871-1889 - New Worlders

The wikipedia page seems to have an interesting list of other country generations too..apparently in Taiwan if you were born after 1981 you're part of the 'Strawberry Generation'!!!! Which apparently makes you prone to being easily hurt and not up to hard work so all this generation talk is best taken with a pinch of salt. It's just distraction away from important issues anyway lol :)

WaegukSaram · 08/03/2017 15:23

This whole crap about baby boomers suffers from the same problem. It depends entirely on where you were and the opportunities you had. A London baby boomer will probably have had a very different experience to a rural one.

Obviously there are huge variations, but when people talk about baby boomers they're usually talking about the statistical averages that show they've benefitted from better health care, education, interest rates etc.

This article goes into some of those stats: www.theguardian.com/uk/2009/nov/06/1948-nhs-pensions-baby-boom

I don't have a problem with that, people can't help when they were born. I do have a problem with people tarring a generation with a single brush.

blackteasplease · 08/03/2017 15:26

I am Gen X.

The way this thing works, it puts my two not-much-younger brothers as Gen Y or Milenials.

The thing is, their experience of life is massively different from mine, from having had to pay tuition fees for Uni to not being able to get a mortgage after the crash.

So I think the seemingly arbitary dividing lines do mean something.

FellOutOfBed2wice · 08/03/2017 16:38

senua calm down, I was just commenting on an interesting idea, not attacking you personally. Jeez.

And no, no Three Minute Warning plans but I was a teen travelling on the underground in London on 7/7 and watched the events of 9/11 unfold on a TV at school. I also went on the anti war march as a teenager and then have loved watching The War in Iraq play out from the time I was literally an adolescent until now as an adult with children, so it does feel defining for my generation.

FellOutOfBed2wice · 08/03/2017 16:42

Batteries that's very interesting. My Dad was a teenager in the 60s in London and had a great time, remembers it as a golden age, shagged about, had long hair, believed entirely in peace and love, mannnnn. Whereas my friends mother is only a year younger than my Dad but had her sixties in a village in the East Midlands. Her sixties weren't quite as exciting! She jokes that that particular village didn't enter the sixties until 1983.

ZackyVengeance · 08/03/2017 16:47

MrsJayy Wed 08-Mar-17 12:51:06
Baby boomers are the devils children on mumsnet they got all the cheap houses and big pensions

see there it is.
the thing is we didn't get those things(I know no one who has in my age group) yet I know a lot of people struggling. people who were shafted in the 80's by massive interest rates.

university?? nah unlike now that was only for the well off.

toofarfromcivilisation Wed 08-Mar-17 12:56:08
I was really pissed off to be included in the BBC Breakfast thing this morning as a Baby Boomer! FFS I was born in 1964! I'm not retired or living in a state of financial bliss!!!

me too. I won't even have a pension as a carer. and dh will retire when he is nearly 70.

OP posts:
Batteriesallgone · 08/03/2017 16:57

Haha Fell exactly!

Healthcare is one example of something that is really variable depending on area. The NHS has always been a postcode lottery.

triedandrusted · 08/03/2017 17:07

I was born in 1966 and am definitely not a baby boomer. We are unable to buy a house that is big enough for our needs as a family, at least not without moving a few hundred miles north, and both me and dh will be working until we are 67, with not very big pensions to show for it. University for me would have been in 1985 when, oh whoops, it's no longer grants for all and is instead means tested. Those whose parents weren't prepared to contribute simply couldn't go. Had we been born in 1963, for example, we would have got a full grant no questions asked, and could have gone. Had we been born later when student loans came out, we could also have gone.

Not one of my peers is better off than their parents. Not one.

Werkzallhourz · 08/03/2017 17:09

Punjana I was also just pondering that the focus on different generations diverts quite a lot of attention away from the problem of an ever widening wealth and opportunity gap across all age groups.

My feeling is that we are reverting to "the Victorian/Edwardian norm" after a fifty year-ish anomaly created by the destruction of wealth, property and inherited privilege caused by the two world wars. That the post-war experience of social mobility, more income equality, more equality of opportunity was a "blip", not evidence of a natural path of enlightened social progressiveness.

When you look at the British context in the 20th century, you have to recognise just how much destruction the first world war caused. It wiped out a generation of young men, some 700,000 plus in the UK. That is approximately equivalent to the entire annual birth rate in Britain today (and we have upwards of 20 million more in population than back in 1914).

So there were 700,000 fewer men in the UK in 1920 than there should have been. This had extraordinary demographic implications: those 700,000 men thus never needed jobs, homes, wives or fathered children in the 20s, 30s or 40s (you are looking at possibly over 1.5 million children that were never born, just from that generation alone). It's also important to recognise that a significant percentage of these young men were from extremely privileged backgrounds: public school alumni died at twice the rate of the average Tommy. Eton lost over 1000 former alumni, which was more than the size of the entire school in 1914.

So, from this, you can start to see how the old class and socio-economic system was dealt a very harsh blow. Take the fact that a lot of the young of the privileged elite class were wiped out. Who then took their roles in society, politics and culture? Who then ran their family businesses or estates?

This is when we start to see the first signs of "social mobility". This is when we see the advent of the Labour party. And, of course, we do because the men who would have previously taken those roles are now dead, leaving those opportunities open for other types of people.

Then WW2 comes along. We see another 383,000 military deaths with 67,000 civilian deaths, and again, a huge destruction of wealth.

In short, over a thirty year period, Britain loses a million plus young men (who then never father children). We are talking about a demographic gap that could number, by 1950, six million or more people ... all of whom would have been reliant on the British labour market, would have needed homes and services, but don't because they were either killed or never born.

And what happens when something comes along that eradicates huge numbers of the population over time? Well, labour market supply is far lower than it should be, so wages rise. Opportunities open up. There's no longer dynastic strangleholds on political positions or business opportunities. Social mobility occurs.

Our problem now is that all those old class, wealth, power and privilege systems have re-consolidated, and are far more formidable than ever. We are seeing the start of political and business dynasties again. We are seeing the accumulation of vast wealth in assets, businesses and property, which, for the Edwardian elites, were eradicated in the loss of wealth caused by WW1 and the need for the state to tax heavily (death and estate taxes) to cover the coat of the war.

And I haven't even gone into the political, economic and social implications of the destruction of state and private wealth caused by the two world wars, but, as an illustration, WW1 wiped out the value of the endowments and assets held by Oxford and Cambridge, and the cost to the British state of both WW1 and WW2 was some £1019 billion in today's money, which is two thirds of Britain's annual GDP today.

In short, we have reverted to the 19th century economic, political and cultural status quo.

5foot5 · 08/03/2017 17:15

PlymouthMaid

I was born in the same year as you (1962) and agree with very much of what you say. But I was surprised by this:

When I retire I will get state pension only (if they haven't abolished it) as private pensions were not a thing when I was younger

Of course they were a thing! I have been paying in to one since I was 22.

triedandrusted · 08/03/2017 17:16

Good and interesting post Werk. What can we do to help ourselves do you think? What's the future?

olderthanyouthink · 08/03/2017 17:16

werkz Shock

MrsJayy · 08/03/2017 17:18

I didn't say I thought baby boomers are the devils children I meant there is countless threads on how they have everything which is ridiculous

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