to think encouraging GC to judge others' appearance is just vile?

[parentsvsPIL]

Have moaned about this before... but dear bloody mother has stepped it up a lot recently. She has always been monumentally judgy and bitchy about other people's taste and appearance. She loves nothing more than a good bitchfest with someone about how awful someone else looks. Generally my sister is very happy to oblige...

"D"M has always encouraged my 8yo niece to join in, because apparently this is how you teach taste and glamour - because girls do need such things of course. 8yo niece has made comments about relatives (in front of them) about how ugly and badly dressed they are - my mother thought this was too cute for words, sister thought it was hilarious, when I said it was unpleasant and not something to be encouraged, DM and DSis rolled their eyes, DF said "she just says what everyone's thinking" and DN told me I was angry because I'm ugly and badly-dressed too. At which DM, Dsis and DF all roared with laughter and said "touché!"

DM has now stepped it up bigtime as my baby DS is conventionally "pretty" and gets lots of comments about his big blue eyes, ong eyelashes, pink cheeks, fluffy blond hair - DM and DNiece now constantly comment that he is going to be embarrassed by his mother unless I start wearing makeup and dressing better, that he is prettier than I am, etc. DF agrees with them.

This isn't new behaviour, but it's very ugly to watch DN being encouraged so much - and I can see DM is going to drag it into future relations with DS/me.

FWIW my appearance-related sins involve not wearing makeup, tying my hair back rather than having flowing locks for DS to pull, and wearing jeans, tshirts and fleeces a lot. I don't have issues with personal hygiene, I exercise, I am a healthy weight, etc.

Sorry to dripfeed - contact is via skype - we live in a different country. We see them once a year in person and thus DS' exposure is very limited (intentionally so).
Good advice on here - thanks. Need to address them so they'll listen rater than roll their eyes at me - some of Annandale's phrases might work!

Saying what you feel is important in this situation. Clearly they do. You don't have to copy my deathless prose Sometimes just saying something as simple as 'When you talk like that I wonder why I ever skype you' or whatever you are feeling, can be really powerful.

Even though she's being a snot, I feel sorry for your niece. If she's already been conditioned at 8 years old to think that she needs to look stylish and glamorous to be deemed sociably acceptable by her own family, then puberty's going to be hell for her when normal teenage anxieties about appearance come into play.

Omg - did your family write "How to Develop an Eating Disorder in One Afternoon Visit"?
Jeepers they're a shallow bunch. I'd avoid.

No amount of makeup can make an ugly heart beautiful!!!

Love Maggiecate's line - try that one on your niece, or just refuse to speak to her until she can say something nice. You could tell her that ugly on the inside leads to ugly on the outside and has she checked the mirror lately?

This is horrendous and what an example to be setting!! Awful behaviour. Yadnbu to be upset by it! Don't know what to suggest though.

Can you use the Skype nature of the conversation to your advantage? End the call when they say those things. Warm them beforehand 'I don't want DS to think it's ok to comment on people's appearance, so I will hang up if you start'. Then when they do, you say firmly 'I asked you not to make that kind of comment. I'm hanging up now'.

End of call.
Do that every time and either they'll learn, or you'll have less contact with poisonous people. Their choice!

Jesus what horrible people! FWIW I'm exactly like you - beyond making sure I'm showered and in clean clothes I don't make a huge effort day to day. I live in jeans and don't wear make up unless it's a special event. My MiL is the opposite; she takes a lot of time over her appearance (has even had plastic surgery), she always looks amazing and passes for about 15 years younger than she is. HOWEVER she would never be judgy or bitchy. I think she's a bit bemused by how someone wouldn't want to wear make up etc. but just accepts that's how I am.

What Allfed said. Tell them you'll be hanging up the second this kind of shallow, unpleasant remarks comes out of one of their mouths. Or develop appalling tech troubles with your wi-fi and never speak to them again.

Do they realize DN will become a bully? Do they realize that she'll only make 'pretty' friends - who won't match up to her or make her feel inferior?
'I'd rather be kind than wear lipstick'
'DS will grow up to appreciate woman for their minds - no make up'

They sound vile.

My sister is extremely judgemental and never missed an opportunity to sneer at people, their clothes, hair, weight and accent.

When I had my first child, she sneered at the name, at the idea my child would look like me and DH (kept picking g our worst traits and saying DC would have my awful X and DH's awful Y and rolling around laughing. Obviously it came from some sort of insecurity but was very hard to the subject of and listen to constant criticism of everyone.

I reduced contact and now have pretty much no contact at all. That ended up hurting me so much, now I have got used to it but think of her so often though rarely miss her as she wasn't a very positive influence in my life, something I realised more and more when I stood back from her.

Maybe your family would allow you to reduce contact without going non contact. No contact is very hard as it is like grief.

I'm flabbergasted! I know it's hard but i wouldnt skype/see them, these women are setting an appalling example to your children and insulting you in the process.