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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

School disciplining with hidden cameras - AIBU to find this a bit off?

50 replies

SchoolIssue1 · 02/02/2017 17:51

DD started school in September and is in Reception. She has a few mild SN and is very sensitive. She is extremely eager to please and never puts a foot wrong.

She has started crying about going to school saying she is scared of the cameras. I couldn't make head nor tail of what it was at first so asked the class teacher if she could shed any light on it at all. She said no, that she didn't know what that could be. DD said last night that her teacher has said that there are cameras everywhere watching for naughty children - in the toilets, in the playground, in the cloakroom etc. I have asked a few other parents and they have confirmed that their children have said the same.

It doesn't sit right with me. Surely that's not a great way to discipline young children? Also, why would the teacher not tell me when I asked her about it?

I'm feeling really uneasy. Am I losing perspective?

OP posts:

Trifleorbust · 03/02/2017 09:19

I don't think this is what I would do, but it's somewhere between that and what I would find unacceptable. It depends whether she has said, "Don't be naughty or I will be able to see you on the cameras!" or "I am always watching you." Different levels of creepy!

twinmamma2b · 03/02/2017 09:21

If the teacher is saying it as a deterrent, how is that any different to telling children that Santa/God/Elf on the Shelf is watching?

Trifleorbust · 03/02/2017 09:23

twinmamma2b: That's a good point.

Scarydinosaurs · 03/02/2017 09:24

teachers was v wrong to deny if they have said this and didn't want to admit it.

I would contact again, apologise and say you're very worried as your daughter is insisting that the teacher said it and you can't work out where she was got this idea from.

Hopefully the teacher will be able to shed some light on where this has come from.

picklemepopcorn · 03/02/2017 09:25

It may have been a one off light hearted comment that the children picked up and ran with... Not cool, though.

picklemepopcorn · 03/02/2017 09:26

'God is watching you' and 'don't make the angels cry' is a hideous thing to do to a child. I speak as a church leader!

mogonfoxnight · 03/02/2017 09:29

Actually there was a staffroom thread last night which referred to a boy being caught stealing because of cctv in the cloakrooms. It might be worth checking whether or not there are cameras!

CMamaof4 · 03/02/2017 09:32

We have cctv in our school I thought it was the norm? My child was previously hurt by a child and this was watched by the teachers to confirm my child telling the truth, I was very happy about this. It sorts out any issues if an incident happens so you dont have to rely on who is to be believed as the proof is there.
I like them having cctv to protect the pupils and if it can encourage children to tell the truth by letting the kids know they have it I cant see a problem. Children should be taught to be truthful, I have to say lieing is a massive annoyence to me and one of the worst character traits someone could have.

janinlondon · 03/02/2017 09:50

When I was a child the teacher told us she had eyes in the back of her head. At 4, we believed her.....

VenusOfWillendorf · 03/02/2017 09:51

This would make me uneasy as well. I'd have no issues with CCTV actually being in the school (on safe-gaurding grounds, as mentioned earlier), but I don't think the teacher should be lying to the children.

However, I'm a lot more concerned that the teacher has also lied to you. If she HAS told the kids that there's cameras around, and then told you that she doesn't know what you're talking about, she is basically saying your child is at best, confused, or at worst lying. Your DD should be able to trust her adults to believe her, and it's hugely confusing for her to have the teacher tell her one thing and then tell her mum it didn't happen.

fuckingwall · 03/02/2017 09:56

CCTV isn't supposed to be used to catch children being naughty. It's meant to be for safeguarding.

Verbena37 · 03/02/2017 09:56

Our secondary has cameras (don't know if they're working) and I'm fine with them.

However, I do think it's a bit weird and creepy to tell reception age kids there are cameras in the toilets!

You aren't allowed cameras in school toilets and so to tell little ones that is worrying. At that age, they would think the cameras are in the actual cubicles, watching them go to the loo and that definitely isn't on.
Speak to the HT.

fuckingwall · 03/02/2017 09:57

From ICO

The CCTV operator must let people know they are using CCTV. Signs are the most usual way of doing this. The signs must be clearly visible and readable, and should include the details of the organisation operating the system if not obvious.

CCTV should only be used in exceptional circumstances in areas where you normally expect privacy - such as in changing rooms or toilets, and should only be used to deal with very serious concerns. The operator should make extra effort to ensure that you are aware that cameras are in use.

hackmum · 03/02/2017 10:00

Either there are cameras watching the children - which is really off in my opinion - or the teacher is lying, which is also unacceptable. Do we really want to teach our children that lying is acceptable in pursuit of a greater good?

I'd be asking for a meeting with the headteacher.

twinmamma2b · 03/02/2017 10:06

Is it something that the teacher has said on more than one occasion? If it was just the once and it was some time ago, there's a good chance the teacher has simply forgotten she said it.

MiniCooperLover · 03/02/2017 10:49

floggingmolly, normally I'd agree but OP has said her DD has SN so I could imagine this being quite a difficult thing for the little one to process.

JamieXeed74 · 03/02/2017 11:06

It it so wrong to tell children to be good because someone is watching you? I got this all the time when I was young, only it was god watching not CCTV.

Just teach dc to get used to it, the country is covered in cameras.

Trifleorbust · 03/02/2017 11:15

I'd be asking for a meeting with the headteacher.

Because that's not using a sledgehammer to crack a nut

BarbarianMum · 03/02/2017 11:19

Our school has CCTV to cover the main entrances - to deter break-ins at night, nothing to do with behaviour. All the kids including mine believe there are cameras everywhere - its a story they hear from each other, nothing to do with the teachers. They also believe the big metal phoenix in the entrance hall of the local secondary is a covert camera - all the Y6s get told that by kids who've already gone up.

The fact that no child has ever got into trouble due to hidden camera footage doesn't stop the legend.

BarbarianMum · 03/02/2017 11:21

F1GI · 03/02/2017 11:23

My kids classes got told there were cameras all over the place in infants school. It wasn't true. There are cameras in certain places but no school is going to have cameras in toilets surely!

Magzmarsh · 03/02/2017 11:27

We have cameras in the playground but none in the school. We've occasionally deployed the "well I'll look at the camera and see what really happened" but never for anything that happened in the toilets, that's despicable leading children to believe they're being filmed doing the toilet.

It's a pretty crappy way to discipline and most of the kids figure out you're lying about them quite quickly which is kind of ironic when you're trying to get THEM to tell the truth 😕

SomethingBorrowed · 03/02/2017 11:50

Mmh strange that the teacher denied knowing about it, but I wouldn't mind cameras (real or fake).
I sometimes tell my DC that I can see them using the (turned-off) video monitor in their room.

CancellyMcChequeface · 03/02/2017 12:07

YANBU and I find this a bit creepy. Teaching young children that they should do the right thing because there are cameras always watching them is a poor moral lesson and rather Orwellian. I feel the same way about the Elf on the Shelf, and using Santa as a threat to get children to behave.

It can frighten conscientious or sensitive children and once a child does 'something naughty' and nothing happens because obviously the camera/elf isn't really watching, it weakens their trust in the adult who told them the story. Not a good behaviour management tool in any way.

Even small children can have a sense of privacy and I imagine many would be quite distressed at the idea of cameras watching them in the toilet! Very strange thing for a teacher to say.

CripsSandwiches · 03/02/2017 12:47

YANBU Firstly why on earth would the teacher lie to you, unless it was such an offhand comment she didn't remember?

Secondly I'm fine with CCTV but obviously just for safeguarding issues and major incidents. Clearly it's not being used to catch naughty children and I don't like the idea that they're pretending it is.

While there have to be limits and consequences we should mail be teaching kids of the reasons they need to be good (avoid hurting other people's feelings, to stay safe) not because they're under constant observation and scrutiny.

I do think this is a general problem when schools try to scare kids into behaving or working hard. It works well on a certain type of child but is actually incredibly damaging to others that are more sensitive and anxious in their disposition.

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