To be sick of Ebay buyers taking the piss?

[FourStoneDown]

I run a small business selling preloved clothing on Ebay. I'm meticulous about the quality of items that I sell, I check things extremely thoroughly, and list very thorough measurements of everything. Most people are delighted with their items and leave me lovely feedback, which is really nice.

However there seems to be a minority of buyers, although that number is increasing, who either invent a flaw with their item when there isn't one, or say that an item doesn't fit them, and then return it to me damaged or worn. One seller has returned a dress today that she said didn't fit her; it was returned inside out as if she'd just taken it off and bundled it up, in carrier bag, with a broken zip and smelling of BO! It'd clearly been worn for a night out then returned to me.

Last week a lady wanted to return a jacket to me, that she had had for over 2 weeks as it didn't fit her. I said it was fine, and she sent a tracked item, but it was an old dirty anorak rather than the jacket she'd bought from me. I escalated to Ebay and they found in favour of the buyer and so I had to refund her £30! She then sent me a message laughing and gloating that she sent me an old piece of tat and got a refund and got to keep the jacket!

And another buyer a few weeks ago decided 3 weeks after receiving a top that the colour didn't suit her so therefore it wasn't as described and started a dispute. She refused to return the item and again Ebay found in her favour and just took the money and refunded her, letting her keep the item!

There have been many other cases recently of returns because something 'doesn't fit' when it has clearly been worn for a night out, then shoved in a bag and returned to me.

AIBU to be pissed off with it all?

Ebay is a buyers' market. My poor kiddo (14) has tried to exercise his entrepreneurial muscle on Ebay by selling some stuff and has dealt with some shockingly unethical buyers. It makes me want to kill them (I have their addresses!).

I am strictly an Ebay buyer, and I bend over backwards to be a fair one. Years ago I sold an unwanted present, a Prada leather bracelet that had a crackled-paint effect. The buyer kicked off, said it was worn to the point that the paint had cracked (sigh) and I had such a nightmare.

It's just not worth it.

Fourstone, I would report that to e bay, that is unacceptable. Yes I gather that it's not worth selling on e bay.

I gave up with it in the end, the absolute mindless unfairness of it all proved too much and was raising my blood pressure to epic proportions.

I sold a pair of my son's motorbike boots on there. Had no idea what they were worth so did my research. Then I offered them for a very fair price. I got one cheeky blighter who messaged me saying "You won't sell them for £x ... but I'll offer you £y for them." I said no thanks, will stick with my Buy It Now price - it's fair and what they're worth. Sold the next day to this lovely bloke, who gave me brilliant feedback and was absolutely thrilled with them. I hope he went back on and saw they sold.

Worst one was an international sale (sold to an American). I wrote in bold, caps, underlined "International Buyers Note postage at the price quoted is for the slowest, cheapest form of postage, and frome xperience, to the US that may be 5 - 6 weeks. If you want them faster, message me and I will give you a different price." She bought the thing. I messaged her saying "Are you sure you don't want to have this sent air mail? You understand this might take 6 weeks to get to you." A message back saying "No, I will go with the cheaper shipping and wait."

A week later she started bombarding me with messages asking where the item was. I had proof of postage.

Then put in a dispute. She was so nuts, and literally bombarding me with threatenng messages, just thought feck it, I'll refund the bitch.

I regretted not going through the dispute process as she ended up with the item and the refund.
I'd been on eBay well over a decade at that point so didn't want to lose my 100% rep on this idiot. So I couldn't leave her Feedback. I noticed she had decent Feedback and yet she must have been shafting Sellers left, right and centre - it isn't likely to have been a one-off. That taught me that even Feedback tells you nothing as it's mutually assured destruction if you do leave negative.

Another twunt left me a lovely comment but pressed 'neutral' like a dick instead of positive. I challenged her and asked her why she was unhappy. Worse still, she had bid on an item then gone on holiday later that evening and messaged me to say she'd pay when she got back. And I'd patiently waited. So gone out of my way for her (hope you're reading this). When I challenged her, and said I'd done nothing but been helpful, why the neutral that ruined about 14 years' worth of positives - she said "Oh sorry. The neighbour's cockerel keeps waking me up and I was tired when I did the Feedback." They can't change it, and you can't contact eBay or make them, to change it. I could delete it but then people would wonder what I'd deleted. So I left that neutral staring at me for a year.

So if you're the bitch with the cockerel excuse and reading this - I hope the thing you made with the material I sold you fell apart.

You haven't been able to neg a buyer for years so a buyer's feedback tells you nothing.

I have given up selling anything on ebay that has to be posted. Local cash on collection only. Even then I've had fuckwit non-paying bidders. Last time that happened was when I was moving house (downsizing) and needed to get rid of the items in a short time frame. I ended up giving away (the day before the move) a double bed, dining table with chairs, and a TV unit in excellent condition because the buyers didn't come through.

The bed was the most annoying. I'd put clearly in the listing "This bed is assembled and it's on the second floor. You will need to disassemble it yourself and carry downstairs. I cannot help with this as I'm disabled. I suggest it's a two-person job."

Woman who won then sent me a message asking "Can you disassemble please and deliver to me in a van. I'm 8 months pregnant."

Joffrey you could have just sent a feedback revision request, they could have changed it to positive. You get several a year you're allowed to send.

As for OP, if the gloating message was sent via Ebay message, or even the email associated with her address, call customer services, show it to them, they should ban her, and she won't be able to make a new account. accounts from the same IP address, same bank account, same paypal, same physical address etc, will be banned if she makes another one, even if someone she lives with has an account they'll get banned too. Some people have had accounts banned because a previous occupant of the address had gotten banned so it does work, and you'd stop her ever pulling the same stunt on anyone else.

It is very dependant on what you sell.

Clothes, kids toys, second hand electrical are prone to be troublesome.

I sell full time on ebay and rarely have problems. It's still a fantastic platform

That's terrible. How do people live with themselves treating others like this? Raggydolly3 I feel angry on your behalf! That's awful!

I think eBay need to reinstate the facility for sellers to leave buyer feedback (and I say this as someone who is predominantly a buyer). I understand why it was removed - sellers holding buyers hostage for good feedback - but it's driving buyers away.

It also makes it feel very awkward for genuine buyers to raise an issue - you feel that buyers will assume you're scamming.

Even aside from scamming, there's a real disconnect with some buyers as to what's realistic for the price and condition described - something described as having wear and tear that sells for 99p is not going to be flawless.

sellers^ will assume you're scamming

This is why I am so reluctant to sell my wedding dress! I sold a hardly worn tiffanys bracelet. The buyer tried to say I had sent the bag to them empty, until I informed them I had proof it was packaged and sent, suddenly they 'found it on the floor' 4 hours later? I also sold the chair covers from my wedding, which had clearly been used and returned as 'dirty', although I didn't lose any money other than postage, it was bloody annoying having them back! Buyers really are arseholes sometimes!

I've stopped selling as I found it more upsetting than I should. I don't know why but I take it really personally. I didnt sell loads but had a good run selling my old maternity clothes so then listed old kids clothes. The number of times people claimed they never received the item and eBay refunded, despite my proof they had, made me so angry. I was only trying to raise a bit of extra cash to treat my children. I don't know how they sleep knowing they are stealing.

I used to sell lots on eBay but hardly ever now because of the crap that comes with it. Have also found that hardly anyone bothers to leave feedback anymore so it's not even as if you are getting that. I've had bad experiences both buying and selling. Pair of shoes arrived with a hole in the sole, seller was really rude to me and it would cost what I paid for them to return them so didn't bother. So many people winning items and then just not paying. Such a waste of time!
I only sell now when it's really worth the hassle, something unique that you need a bigger audience for.

Worm - if you have online proof of delivery eBay won't refund a buyer. Send tracked and you will be fine.

I don't understand... So many e-bat sellers say 'returns not accepted'.
Can't you just do this?

eBay not e-bat!

no you can't Elodie. They can write what they like, doesn't mean they are above eBay rules.

I used to be a regular buyer and occasional seller on eBay till a buyer screwed me over for a iPhone.

Sent tracked,buyer messages saying no headphones, I point out the listing said no headphone... then suddenly the phone itself was not in the box despite the fact he never mentioned this is his first message, had admitted it was well packaged and that the weight on the label was clearly not for an empty box but also said it hadn't been tampered with. eBay ruled in their favour and took the money, well they didn't because it just put my PayPal in negative and like hell am I paying it back so I'm banned from eBay/PayPal. Oh well.

I used to use eBay a lot and I still buy a few special needs toys on there but for selling stuff I mainly use shpock now. eBay fees and pay pal fees are way too high and then there is the problem of untrustworthy buyers.

eBay used to be great for sellers but they're awful now. I've stopped using them too as like other posters have said they always refund the buyer regardless, which just leaves the seller without the item or the money.

I had a bad run of selling things to absolute lying arseholes last year, so left Ebay. Not worth the hassle.

"No returns accepted" is only applicable to non fault / change of mind returns (like "it doesn't fit") for private sellers. If the seller claims the item is faulty or mis described then the buyer HAS to accept a return.

YANBU to be pissed off, but these sort of things are unavoidable if you sell on anything other than the smallest scale. Buyers know that their feedback is valuable to you and in a case of it being your word versus theirs, big companies usually go in favour of the buyer because it is more likely for a seller to be the con-artist than it is the buyer.

This isn't the case in your example, but the seller has many opportunities to con the buyer: misrepresenting the goods, not sending them, taking too long to send them. The buyer has only one real opportunity, finding fault with goods that are not faulty (as with you here).

It happens in any situation where there is a supplier and a consumer. With clothes especially, people increasingly have no qualms about returning worn items and claiming they didn't fit. I've lost count of the "new" items bought in Argos that had blatantly been used and returned (and yes, they got returned a second time!).

It's shit, but it is part and parcel of selling online I'm afraid. If you can swallow the occasional loss like this then you have a business model, if not then you probably need to raise your prices to cover these losses or get out of the business entirely.

Any system that involves expecting everyone to be honest is doomed to fail...

This is scary.

I've recently become addicted to ebay buying and selling and have sold a lot.

Only bad things so far are an item that got lost in the post (but that wasn't worth much) and a buyer who said the item that the colour didn't look the same as the photo. It looked the same to me and I'd also described the colour in text. Nothing really happened though. A few email exchanges of 'I'm really disappointed it's different' and me saying 'I don't agree' but she never started an official dispute so I ignored it after a while. Nothing happened for ages then she just left neutral feedback, not even negative.

I have just sold a violin though which I'm terrified is going to break in the post. I've packaged it so carefully and taken pictures but still, there's no guarantee. I didn't realise ebay would find in the buyers favour if they claim it's broken but won't provide photographs though! That's awful!