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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to be annoyed at my vet practice

45 replies

Threeschools · 11/01/2017 12:25

They insist that my cat restarts its vaccination course because we are 3 months late to his yearly schedule? Apparently some practices allow 6 months. So they charge more and a second appointment is needed. Not happy.

OP posts:
3boys3dogshelp · 11/01/2017 13:56

It's a rough day to be a vet on here!
Our practice policy (and that if the other practices i've worked at) based on advice from the vaccine company is that if you go over three months overdue then you need to restart.
With the vaccines we use some
parts of the vaccine are required every year, with other parts every three years. So they have an injection annually but it's not the same every time.
There are blood tests available to check immunity but the last time I checked (admittedly a while ago now) the tests were prohibitively expensive.
My dogs are vaccinated following the same protocol that I recommend to my patients.
Try to think about it from our perspective too. If you come in 6 months late and ask if I think a booster is sufficient, I say yes and just give a booster to save you £12. your dog later becomes ill or dies as a result of an illness they are supposed to be protected from, who is at fault? The vaccine company won't accept any responsibility as I haven't followed their advice and I'm sure you would blame me rather than accept that you took a risk by coming in 6 months late.

Wolfiefan · 11/01/2017 14:00

Our cats and dogs are vaccinated yearly. I believe in offering them the best protection from diseases. They don't stay inside. They will meet other animals.
You can titre test to see if your dog (don't know about cats) is immune to some conditions. One owner I know does it after the first course of vaccines.
I would not forgive myself if my pets became ill as I hadn't had them vaccinated.
Find a vet you trust and follow their advice.

CrazyCavalierLady · 11/01/2017 14:22

Liefie yes titre testing is what is used here.

This is some recent info from the Australian Veterinary Association
[www.ava.com.au/about-us/policy-and-positions/topics/veterinary-medicines]

Can I please assure any vets here I have nothing but absolute respect and admiration for the work that you do and have no problem with you making a living; I am also very provacination for humans and pets however I am not pro over-medicating. I also recognise that as an island with strict quarantine laws Australia's protocols may not be valid or suitable for the UK

Threeschools · 11/01/2017 14:33

Thanks all. My conclusion of this all is that I should either decide not to bother with vaccinations at all or do it properly. And properly it will be as we love our cat. It is putting on weight so much at the moment and is always insisting on getting more food, he gets some food from DH first thing in the morning, then tries and pretends he is starving to me, quite funny. I think we will have to weigh his food and get quite firm with him, one more reason to go to the vet and get some advice.

OP posts:
mirime · 11/01/2017 14:39

Find a vet you trust and follow their advice.

This. We used to have a fantastic vet, lovely man, left to set up a cat clinic and unfortunately it wasn't practical for us to take our cats there. His advice was that our cats didn't need regular booster vaccinations after a couple of years. I don't think he'd ever have recommended anything that wasn't in the best interests of our pets.

madasa · 11/01/2017 15:29

Bill for my dog's lung condition currently stands at £4,800....I am in the wrong job

Nateismine · 11/01/2017 21:18

Masada - genuine question, what do you think you should have been charged, and how much of that £4800 do you think is profit?

Cherrysoup · 11/01/2017 21:47

Titre test, better than consistently vaccinating if unnecessary, although the new lepto vaccination seems worthwhile (always has been for me) if your dog goes near waterways or chases rats. Saying that, it doesn't last more than 8 months or so. Some vaccines do last longer and it is worthwhile asking your vet which brand they use.

There was a lab there that had chronic diarrhoea. Was costing her £600 to treat!! And the vet was still advising she kept the dog on pedigree

Prolly why it still has diarrhoea. Bloody awful food. I do wish vets would recognise that owners are starting to research food and are reading about decent versus ruddy awful quality stuff. Saying that, Purina has finally noticed and is producing a grain free food at last.

madasa · 11/01/2017 22:00

To be honest Nateismine I have been given itemised invoices and I haven't actually studied them. I might have done if the insurance company weren't picking up the bill. I have just been concentrating on getting him well again.

He ended up in a specialist centre and I know I am paying for their expertise and knowledge. There is no doubt in my mind that they saved his life and I can't put a price on that. It was a tongue in cheek comment,

PleaseNotTrump · 11/01/2017 22:27

Masada I'm not a vet, but I do realise Veterinary Science is one of the hardest degree courses to get on and attracts the brightest students, who then study or many years. Apart from the fact that they have to run their surgeries (equipment/staff/drugs/insurances etc), do you seriously expect these people to work for free? As it is, they could earn a hell a lot more in comparable careers.

PleaseNotTrump · 11/01/2017 22:28

Whoops - xpost!

madasa · 12/01/2017 07:30

Of course I don't expect them to work for free.....what a ridiculous statement

Snifftest · 12/01/2017 07:38

CrazyCavalierLady we have the same level of quarantine as Australia, we are a rabies free zone.

We don't vaccinate beyond the first year booster, there is increasing evidence it isn't necessary, though it is vets bread and butter. I guess we'd have to get them done if we wanted to put them in a cattery.

EdithWeston · 12/01/2017 07:39

If you think your vet is charging too much, then you are free to move to a different one.

And that will lead to uneconomic practices closing.

Which might be fine if you're in a city and there are several to choose from.

Less fine if it means you have to travel to the next town at inconvenient o'clock with an animal with an acute condition.

I do think the trend is towards fewer, bigger practices. And I'm not actually sure this is a good thing. But I expect other people will have a different view of the balance between price of treatments and value of the service and ultimately it is the number of paying patients that will make the difference.

BubsAndMoo · 12/01/2017 08:15

If vets are directly advising against the guidelines provided by the vaccine manufacturer, that is slightly concerning. It can definitely cause problems with insurance - I've seen that happen, refusing to pay out on a respiratory condition because vaccines had lapsed - no proof that the condition was to do with flu, in fact almost certain it wasn't, but flu vacc had lapsed so no cover. I have also seen animals where vaccines have lapsed have confirmed diagnoses of lepto, cat flu and feline leukaemia virus too. Titre testing has it's limitations, and costs a lot more than the vaccines themselves, as well as requiring a blood sample which can be more stressful on the animal than a quick injection - it's not unusual to need to sedate cats for a blood sample. So for me it comes down to - what reasons are there to not follow the vaccine manufacturers' guidelines? Either money - well, the alternatives have the potential to be a lot more costly. And actually at my practice, for existing clients, we don't charge extra for restarting the course, we charge an 'amnesty' rate which is the same as a single annual booster (and a lot of client's objections to a restart vanish when they realise it doesn't cost them any more). A fear of side effects? Side effects are vanishingly rare, clearly we would not be using something regularly for our own animals if we believed there was a significant risk of doing them harm. So unless someone has a philosophical objection or suspicion of vaccination in general, surely the rational decision is to stick to the guidelines we have, until we come up with updated ones when or if further evidence is beyond doubt.

FWIW, if a client asks me this question, I will have this very conversation, openly and without judgement. I have clients who choose not to vaccinate and I respect that and don't pester them about it, simply confirm their position when I see them etc. I still recommend an annual physical as a minimum, without which we can't prescribe POM parasite control
etc, and I vaccinate my own pets according to up to date manufacturers guidelines.

Btw one misconception on this thread - our quarantine regulations are nowhere near as strict as Australia. If they were then we might have avoided introducing babesiosis from the continent. A lot of us also consider it somewhat inevitable that an animal carrying rabies will get through sooner or later, it will probably be a fancy pedigree puppy imported underage with fudged paperwork from central/eastern Europe and sold on gumtree. That's a whole other thread though!

TaraCarter · 12/01/2017 10:33

Okay. This is a bit unfair. Vets advise such regular boosters because there has been no/little research to confirm whether the immunity persists for any longer, so they are acting with the best information available. I believe existing research was done by drug manufacturers, who have an interest in not finding out if any of their vaccines grant lifelong-immunity, don't you think...

I agree that it seems likely, as a layperson (important caveat!) that the vaccine effectiveness persists for a similar timeframe to human vaccines, but the research has not been done. Our pets do not have an NHS, which means they do not have a version of NICE funding research and analysing existing data in order to identify the most cost-effective treatments, in order to save public money. That kind of thing is why guidance has changed and we don't have tetanus boosters every five or ten years now.

Don't worry, I'm sure we won't have an NHS or NICE either soon.

iheartmyponeh · 12/01/2017 21:03

OP I'm really glad you've decided to restart that vaccine course as correctly advised by your Vet. We regularly see cases referred to us that have diseases preventable by vaccination. Some get better, others don't. It totally breaks my heart.

As a general rule, people in this country are totally oblivious as to how much medical care costs because of the good old NHS. I work in a practice that works to a high standard, and yes, medical care costs money. You would be astounded at how much it costs if you are doing things to the highest standard. We don't even cover costs for neuters when you take into account our state of the art theatres, anaesthetic monitoring equipment, drugs/fluids, personnel. The Veterinary field is progressing fast in terms of standard of care plus we have been guilty of hugely under charging for decades. The public needs to wake up to this reality if they want 'the best' for their pets.

It makes me very depressed that the costs of veterinary medical care are so massively underestimated. The perception that we are just in it for the cash is pretty insulting, and probably why our profession has such a high suicide rate. If you think I earn good money, you should see the state of my little old car that I can't afford to upgrade.

Sorry I'm tired, hungry and emotional. I'm just getting my lunch and I started work at 8am.

lljkk · 12/01/2017 21:52

Occasionally our vet advertises an "amnesty" where you can get caught up with the vax for price of a single jab. I would wait for that to be advertised, if it were me.

MistressPage · 12/01/2017 22:07

I didn't even know cats were supposed to have yearly vaccines. My cat is 11 and has never had any as far as I know....

lljkk · 12/01/2017 22:24

I think most people don't vaccinate, my vets hint as much (or deworm them). Reminds me... my cats are probably due next flea stuff drops.

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