Does anyone share their time between two places? AIBU to want to live on two continents?

[Aufwiedersehenpetrarch]

That. We are considering moving abroad for part of the year and staying here for the rest. If feasible summers here and winters abroad. Maybe from June - September and then from October - May giving us pretty good weather all year around. We now have two DC under four and would like a third, hence the decision to do this now is pressing on us before school "officially" starts and that complicates things. My family is from abroad and I lament the DC not being able to spend more time with them. DC1 misses physical contact with the grandparents. DP wants to stay here and just go for holidays every year. Which would be very expensive for a family of five as we would be dependent on school holiday prices too. :( In general the overall quality of life for someone in our income bracket is better abroad, but it is definitely less safe there which would be a bit stressful. Childcare for DC2 and possible DC3 would be cheap and reliable and schools good for DC1. Lots of outdoor activities but culturally not so connected to the world. We would be able to afford holidays and eating out or special treats whereas now this is not really possible and would be even less likely once there are three children. Our jobs would to a certain extent allow us to work from anywhere with a bit of work-related travel as part and parcel and so it seems practical from that side. We would have a proper family house in my home country and buy a two or three-bed house or flat in our town here we could let out for the part of the year we are abroad. Is there anyone on MN who does this, or knows someone who does? My biggest concern (and why I am willing to stop thinking this is the best decision for us) is that the regular moving between continents would damage the DC somehow. In particular when so young and not being able to understand why they have to leave that which is familiar to them all the time. I am a homebody and value my connectedness to people and places and so does DC1. I'm not sure about DC2. Knowing that DP isn't fully on board is obviously an issue as here is clearly where he is at home. DP is sympathetic and very willing to consider it, but if it were only DP's choice, would stay here. So, would it work? Or would we never feel fully "settled" and so feel unduly stressed? Would the children like it or dislike it? Is it plainly just a stupid idea? Should I have another cup of tea?

I think that as a couple you need to commit to one thing or the other and that you may have come up with this "neither one nor the other" idea as a compromise. We had friends who did this but gave up after 4 years because of the difficulties with the social side of things. its tough having a friend who sees you once a week for 6 months then completely disappears for 6 months and then when comes back expects you to pick up again. they found this particularly true of their kids and more so as they got older which is why they gave it up. their children struggled with friendships in both places because of this.

also the health care issue would be a real serious consideration for me. just like all those ex pats who come home every few months for their prescriptions, eye tests, hearing tests etc the NHS is really going to seriously start cracking down on this. all fine if you or the kids don't have any long term health issues or sudden health needs, but not so if you do.

personally, I think you should move abroad but keep your base in the UK and reassess in 3 or 4 years time.

I do know a single guy, divorced with children in their 20s and 30s who has a house he rents out for 6 months of the year in the Uk and another house in Italy which is rented out for the other 6 months. He is self employed and works from home

I think it would depend on the child, which you can't tell at preschool age.

Two of mine would hate it. Absolutely loathe it to the point of being very miserable. They'd feel always the outsider, and struggle to pick up at the change-takes both of them around a term to settle generally.
I think my middle one would love it. She's quick to pick up old friendships, and loves a varied life.

The problem is that I don't think it would ultimately be good for my middle one for lots of reason, including some of the reasons why she'd love it!

If your DC are at all introverted, it would be very difficult to pick up friendships for a few months, then drop them, then pick up new friendships, then drop them again. While young a lot of socialising will be depenendent on you - are you sure friends would want to pick up friendships again if you're transient and not around for a while?

Personally I wouldn't do it. I think I'd feel as if I didn't truly belong in either country.

Have you thought of this solution because your DP doesn't want to move full time to your country, so you're finding a way to be able to live at home while also living where your DP lives? It seems a compromised way of living that wouldn't really suit either of you if you could choose what you really wanted to do.

For a couple of years growing up my family did this and I hated it, neither place felt like home as I'd be away from it for months at a time, friends moved on as I wasn't there for huge chunks, i missed social events, i hated not having all my clothes and stuff wIth me there was nothing I liked about hopping between the two places. If you really want to live abroad, I'd commit fully to living in that country and just come back to uk for short holidays not huge chunks at a time.

I do this now and it's great. But, it takes a lot of organisation and the expenses really do add up. You'll have to buy two of everything and then replace the cheap second one that breaks (because it's cheap). Not to mention replacing the things that go missing/get stolen (my geraniums, tea towels and pillow cases), or that you forgot to pack in the last place or could not bring because of weight restrictions.

Bills, maintenance, repairs, WIFI and cleaning costs all need to be factored in. Travel costs add up too and you'll need to be well planned to take advantage of lower fares. I've lost a lot of money buying cheap tickets in advance because things have changed when it comes to the time of travel.

I don't want to sound too negative. Lots of people enjoy this lifestyle. But there's a high level of organisation and efficiency needed to ensure it goes smoothly, especially with kids.

My PIL do this, and have done for the last 14 years or so. It means they don't really have friends in either place, are forever catching up with the other house, and they have everything duplicated.
For children, flexible as they are, it could be really hard. I know my friends dd who lives on one continent with her mum and spends the whole summer with her dad on another continent finds picking up her friendships at home hard when everyone else has been spending time together, and isn't in the other place enough to have real friends

I do a version of this, though without children as yet. Definitely look into the healthcare implications. You can see a private GP in the UK, but it's costly - £80ish I think, and other things can be complex: getting repeat prescriptions from one country to another can be tricky; medical records are not all in one place; what do you do if you need medical procedures but you are scheduled to move from one place to the other between the consultation and the procedure etc etc. Most of these can be got round by spending money, but it can stack up quickly.

As regards social stuff, is there a reasonably large community of people who have ties with both the UK and wherever you would be going? My experience has been that you tend to make friends most easily among people who are living the same kind of semi-itinerant life and UK-non UK couples like yourselves. But it could be very different if there isn't a group of people doing the same. My feeling is I might be able to do it with primary aged children, but I would be looking to settle in one place by secondary age. Would ten (or however many years you have til your DC1 is a teenager) years abroad save you enough money to make it worthwhile?

I definitely think there are big advantages to a bi-cutural - maybe bi-lingual? - life though, and to closer ties with your family.

Do you really think this solution would be more affordable? It is incredibly expensive keeping two homes, even if one of your countries is considerably cheaper. What about cars, healthcare, bills etc? I think you may find that gradually one place becomes your home and eventually your visits to the other place become less and less frequent. You say your country is not as safe, how would you feel about that as your children become older and want more independence?

I think this would work out a whole lot more expensive than annual holidays, and not be half so enjoyable.

I agree with what others have said about the duplicated costs and inefficiencies of maintaining two households, and also the emotional aspect of living (and, especially, growing up) with a foot in both countries.

Living here and there also creates so many bureaucratic complications about 'residency' and your entitlements/responsibilities in each respective country. Regardless of whether you're a citizen or not, defining whether you're 'resident' somewhere is a PITA, because every government agency, service provider and commercial company tends to define 'resident' on its own terms. This means you get into endless complications with tax, healthcare, insurance, drivers licences, registering with the local authorities, education, banks, mortgages... almost everything official becomes a headache.

I lived in the US on a non-resident visa for several years: at one point, I was simultaneously non-resident for immigration purposes, but resident for tax purposes, but non-resident for education (had to pay overseas fees), but resident for state driver's license and insurance, but non-resident for banking, but resident for private healthcare, but non-resident for any public healthcare or benefits... and the list continues. But I wasn't counted as residing in the UK, either. When we moved back, and I needed to access pregnancy care, they were scrupulous about checking we were establishing residency and not just nipping back for some free healthcare.

I think it would be a fun way to live if you were super-rich and had people to deal with this shit, but mostly it just ends up feeling like you don't particularly live anywhere.

But if you rent one house out, friend has a 2 very nice places in 2 very expensive areas which are a magnet for tourists. He says he could live off the rental income alone and plans to buy a third property in a different location so he has more choice of where he can be. But he is a single guy in his 50s so is probably more flexible than a family with children.

Sorry didn't finish my first sentence
If you rent one house out for 6 months then rent the other out for 6 months then the rental income should cover any expenses. The only problem would be in lining up the dates.

If you rent one house out for 6 months then rent the other out for 6 months then the rental income should cover any expenses.

This would only be at all possible if both places had really buoyant rental markets, and even then I feel like it would be a matter of time before something went wrong, e.g. a tenant that trashed the place and then you had to move back in with three small kids.

Perhaps try it for one winter whilst the DC are still small, with no expectation that it will/ won't work out, and see how you find it. A plan to spend 8mo abroad is less scary than a plan to indefinitely spend your time between two countries.

DP and I moved to an Asian country in 2015 with DC then 2.3 and 5mo and stayed for just under 6 months. Initially we were meant to be there for at least a year but we came back early as I became unexpectedly pregnant and both DP and DS were developing health problems (unconnected to us being abroad I might add).

It was an amazing experience and DC adapted very well to the change, DD sometimes mentioned friends/ family here in UK but we skyped grandparents and she didn't seem distressed at not being able to see them. We were volunteers and not earning so didn't face any problems regarding tax and we had no problems using the NHS on our return (which myself, DP and DS all needed to do in first weeks back). We did find on return we were unable to claim some benefits as we had been out of the UK more than 3 months and we weren't able to claim again until we'd been resident in the U.K. 3 months from return and could prove we intended to stay permanently in UK.

How's the kids education going to work? Homeschool for part of the year in the uk? Wil that fit in with your working hours? Sorry if I've missed that bit.

Also I think you are at risk at being residence in two countries which is not good from a tax perspective. I would urge you to take specialist advice on this - do not rely on your own research as it can be very costly.

I'd also worry about the kids friendships. Five or six months is a long time for a nipper, and they are effectively going to feel like the 'new kid' all the time. Some kids cope great with that, some find it horrendous.

How is socialising in the uk going to work? If they're not going to school it's going to be trickier to develop friendships particulalry if only over for five months of the year.

I think it's something to do when the kids are very Young or after they've flown the nest, otherwise id stick to extended holidays over there, or vice versa.

Is it realistic to rent out your house for seven months of the year? Bear in mind that this would mean needing to store your uk stuff each time - and with three kids, that could end up a lot of stuff.

I think you risk, rather than the children having two homes, your children having none.

Every six months or so, they'd have to leave their friends. Their friends are not wrapped up and put into storage the way possessions can be. They continue with their lives and form new friendships, and when your children return they are 'extra' kids to play with, but maybe not friends any more. Especially since the other children know your children will be going away again in a few months. On every trip away they'll become less and less connected to your children.

This all sounds like homesickness on your part to me. You're basing your entire two-continent future on "I lament the DC not being able to spend more time with them. DC1 misses physical contact with the grandparents." DC1 is under 4 - I think whatever they're expressing to you about missing their grandparents is probably being picked up from your missing your parents. Children can be very empathetic. How does DC1 communicate this 'missing them' to you? Verbally? Do they get a cuddle when they say they miss them, to comfort them? Which actually encourages them to keep saying they miss them? Obviously that's my imagining a scenario which might not be how it is, but I think you should think through whether your very young child really misses them or whether they're empathising with you and saying what they think will comfort you.

I think you need to find a way to let your homesickness go, and consider where you are now as home. I don't think you've actually achieved that yet.

I know some people that live in different countries for half a year. They maximise the opportunities that each country provides and it works for them and they are happy. However, there are extra costs involved compared to a "normal lifestyle" where most people live in one country

However, none of these people have children

I think that the cost of living in two countries would be huge and I think that you would need to make a full financial list of costs and have savings for emergencies

I think that the most simple solution would be to live in one country and visit for holidays.
However, you would still have to take into account, what happens if your partner doesnt want to visit the same country every holiday and wants to visit and explore new places (I think that you assume too much that someone would spend their whole life visiting the same country for their holidays)

I suggest doing a trial run

This is what I am working towards. At the moment we visit for regular holidays, but the longer-term intention is that we spend Nov - Feb abroad and then do a fortnight or so in May/June. We'd spend more time in the UK and therefore retain residency. Both of us work flexibly in the UK and we are increasingly getting to levels where this could be done remotely and both of our employers are happy if it's in Europe (which it would be), as often the flights are cheaper than transporting someone from London to elsewhere in the UK on the train.

However we don't have children. And all of the people we know who do this - friends we have made near where we spend our time etc., either don't have kids or their kids are adults.

Those I know who do have young or school-aged children have moved abroad FT, as it is too difficult to keep moving between two countries on the kind of basis you'd like.

How would the children pick up from where they left off six months earlier education wise every time they return to their overseas private school- if I've understood that correctly. I do believe children thrive on routine and structure. I moved home and country plenty as a child and I really craved a settled home and school. Being the new kid is also not best fun although does give you good social skills in the long run. This might be an adult's dream life but not necessarily a child's.

Thanks for all the responses everyone. We've had a week of whywhygodwhy?! kids' illness so I've been MIA. Lots of help with thinking this plan through from you. Thank you.

I think your problem is in terms of thinking 6 months here, 6 there. I know lots of people who live most of the year in one location in the UK, but have long summer holidays 4-10 weeks depending on if in private school in their home countries. This is extremely common, one reason my dds don't have their school friends to play in the summer so much, often they are spending a month in Spain, or two months in Poland or whatever. I don't think this massively disrupts friendships, as most people go away in the summer anyway and continuing school friendships in the summer is quite hard whether or not people are living elsewhere. Doing 6/6 risks that they feel at home no-where, but spending several weeks/a couple of months in the summer elsewhere is just standard, many European countries they do this, often sending the children to live out of the city with grandparents in the old style, but if you work from home, then that's not an issue for you.

If you prefer, you could spend most of the time in your home country, school them there and spend 2 months in the UK.

More than that and I think everyone is right, by 5/6 children start to have strong friendships and mine wouldn't be happy to just drop those friends for six months at a time, then reintegrate a time later as it would probably not happen like that.

You can still use childcare in the 2 months you are in the other country, in fact that's a really good way to keep the second language going otherwise it's easy to live in your own bubble of the first language even when you are abroad.

My relative did similar, they ran a bar in Spain for seven months of the year. They realised two years in that this couldn't continue and they started to make plans to permanently live in Spain.

Their youngest was four when they decided this and by six, they were fully settled in Spain.

They come to the UK for about two months. The eldest doesn't miss the UK anymore and says that it's worth missing the family, for the lifestyle that they have.

Only you can decide, because they mix with ex-pats and some of their children resent their Parents, as said.