AIBU, WWYD, shes driving me bonkers

[DrivingMeBonkers]

Can you help me rationalise this; WWYD? I need to deal with this behaviour now, whilst its 'fresh'.

Core friendship group is 4 couples, larger group is 7 couples. It's unusual in that the men are the base, they all went to primary school, secondary, played football together all through their 30's. We are now in our early-mid 50's.

One of the (larger group) women has an issue with me. It didn't used to be like this, we were very good friends, look after each others children, days out, the occasional liquid lunch, not each others confidantes, but close enough.

Over the years she's had a dreadful falling out with one sister (not actually her fault) and the other sister and mother isolated her. She's had a lot of therapy/councilling and has absolutely zero self-worth/confidence. I have supported her in all this silly business with her sister (they still aren't talking); I've encouraged her to look and apply for other jobs, I've offered to help her with her CV, when she was in hospital over Christmas three years ago, it was me (out of our friendship group) that bothered to visit her, see if any shopping needed doing and offered to have her DH & 2xDC for Christmas lunch. I have never had the same emotional support back though. I don't think I'm a nasty person or a bad friend. I don't tell people what to do, I listen, nod and offer advice.

She also has a massive drink problem. I like a drink but I don't drink to a stupor. We all know she has a problem, it is the elephant in the room. At any event she is either crying, snarling or throwing up. The excuse for any of this behaviour is the issues with her sister. But it's been going on these past 20 years not just the past five years.

With me so far? That's the basic background. New Years Eve was another shocker. At times she makes me the scapegoat for all her problems. Apparently, I think she's thick and stupid, she tells people this. The basis for this is a conversation, some years ago, about nothing at all and I apparently made a throwaway remark "dont be daft!" I don't remember saying it, when she gets tanked up she hangs around my neck with the old 'I love you, I really do' ad infinitum until I get disentangle myself then it's like watching the exorcist as her head spins and her eyes narrow, and she starts again with 'I know you think I'm thick'. It gets to the point I sit in a corner and stare at the floor all night (this NYE I really wasn't feeling too bright so I wasn't drinking)

I need to confront this now. I've ducked the issue. We have a large friendship group; everyone else notices, everyone else knows it's nothing I'm doing. No one will confront her about her behaviour because of the tears and waterworks (three hours solid on NYE, whilst shooting me the evil eye). Her DH won't talk to her because they don't communicate. She's a deeply unhappy and troubled lady.

I'm tempted to go round now, whilst she's sober and have it out with her - but she will deny anything is wrong and brush it under the carpet. (But I would want a witness, lest she told people I was aggressive). I could text, but the written word is often misconstrued. I could write her a letter and tell her how she makes me feel, but that might get passed round. I could just wait until she's tanked up next time, then tell her a few home truths - but she will turn the waterworks on and play the victim card, I'll be seen as the bad guy because I am probably more verbally cutting than she is. If I did go that route, there would be no going back.

Some of you will say to remove myself from the situation BUT this is our friendship group and social life. These are my DHs closest and oldest friends.

I actually feel 'bullied'.

WWYD?

Oh meant to say to answer your first question, you cant rationalise it, some things / behaviour cant be explained or justified and its probably not even worth trying

i think i would have to be an ostrich in this situation.
if you did meet her sober, what then, wont she throw this meeting back in your face?
you know what you are going to say but what will she say? i can't imagine she will take this Pep talk lying down.

i think you need to change your reaction to her insults. water off a duck's back. everyone knows this is what she says.

perhaps it is her DH that needs your help and support though.

Will the rest of your friends not support you? If you tell them how much it upsets you maybe they can help deflect her when she gets started.

It's difficult isn't it? If someone were telling me this set of events, I'd be advising to deal with the issue calmly yet head on.

If I did that and it went all pear shaped, as it could possibly do, I would be the one who blew the friendship group apart. The gents would still meet for a swift half on a Friday night, it would have bigger repercussions round partnered social events; eg birthday parties, summer BBQs

Yes Nanna50 - her DH & DC were quite capable of sorting themselves out and did so. But my manners and upbringing lead me to make offers of help - which I knew would be refused, but had they been accepted were genuine offers. Would you not make similar offers to someone in need? I also said the silly business with her sister is not her fault.

Yes yes to encouraging days/nights out without drink. I have been in this situation and the best thing the friendship group did was pull together and steer situations away from alcohol.

The person then discovered that, actually, people did enjoy her company when she was sober and actually liked her as a person.

What didn't help was confronting her about it, as it put her on the defensive. Speak to her about her aggression towards you when she has had a drink, and not about the alcoholism itself. She may link the two together herself.

She targets you because she is jealous that you're so 'together'. You've helped her out in the past and been there for her when she's needed you. She will have told you things and might feel embarrassed. Plus you're probably an easy target because she knows you're a kind soul and won't retaliate.

You can't fix her. The only person who can do that is her. Chat to your friends and ask them to keep her away from you when she's pissed.

I'd agree with daytime events that don't involve booze, and speaking to the group somehow to try and get them onside to deflect as soon as she starts. I had a situation with my sister for some time where whenever she had had a drink she'd start accusing me of judging her (I wasn't), there was nothing I could say to make her calm down and she'd just go off on a massive sad rant. In retrospect I think it was probably a time when my life was more sorted than hers but that's not the point. I avoided events where there would be alcohol, and we had enough of a chat that she knew when she drank we argued (although I doubt she felt entirely responsible).

I don't think having it out with her will help, but having the group on side could diffuse things a bit. I feel for you :(

never help her again-it will instantly become another stick to beat you with. She clearly resents the fact that she needs help and that you are in a position to give it.

Have a plan with your DH (why doesn't he stick up for you) so that if she does something it isn't you alone having to tackle her. I wouldn't address the reasons why she is behaving as she does in the moment-all you need to do is tell her it is unacceptable, ask her to stop, move away from her with your DH, ask her DH to take her home.

Where is your DH in all this? The whole group dynamic sounds dysfunctional that they don't support you when she goes off in one repeatedly.

The poor woman has her problems but she's taking them out on you. If she's seeing a therapist & yet still behaves like this I don't think any from of words from you will make any difference

Driving Me Bonkers Yes I would be one of the first to offer, I also extend the olive branch where others won't, which is why I said you were generous. I do not doubt that your offer was genuine.
However sometimes our best intentions are misinterpreted as criticism, particularly if that person has insecurities.

I only referred to this as you asked how to help rationalise it. I was offering a view on how she may have perceived the actions, particularly if she is a needy person, not on how I personally would have felt about your offer and support.

It sounds horrible. Does she pick on you or do this to other women and her dh as well when she is drunk? I would definitely just avoid situations where alcohol will be involved. Let your dh go on his own.

She needs help with her alcohol problem not her relationship with her sister. I expect a lot of problems could be sorted if the alcohol one is. (Also, saying it was not her 'fault what happened with the sister', I am guessing you have only heard her side of the story!).

Certainly wouldn't confront her, it will all go tits up.

Don't sit in a corner when you're put, she sounds like an aggressive drunk: rise above it and carry on having a good time whilst ignoring her.

She's an alcoholic. That is her only problem and everything stems from that. I'd bet that her sister has experienced plenty of aggro from her too.

I've had a lot of experience with this type of situation and sadly and it will NEVER get better unless the alcoholic decides to change.

I would be upfront with your friends and say that you will only participate in get-togethers that are alcohol free because of her behaviour and how it affects you.

And don't be afraid to call a spade a spade. It's not just her. She's a problem drinker and you do not have to tolerate it.

I don't think you'll achieve anything unfortunately. If she had any self awareness,she would have apologised already
Her defences will be so high to convince herself it's everyone else and not her, she'll have her bitter answers in the bag already.
She's an alcoholic.
You've no chance.

I thought I'd give you an update.

Sunday evening the passive-aggressive , drunken texts started. Which then became 'pleading'. I ignored them, so she started to text my DH who was rather bemused and announced he wasn't getting involved. I wasnt going to get into a written exchange with someone several glasses down.

I phoned a mutual acquaintance who has observed what been going on and she advised I just ignore it and not to fuel the flames; but she too had received texts begging forgiveness for her appalling behaviour.

However, I thought it was likely to become a bit of a rolling stone if I didn't deal with it head on, so I called in to her home after work yesterday. Anyway, I suggested she speak first to clear the air, then I could assess the tone etc. So I was told that my very walking into a room made her feel inadequate (I have no idea why, I'm no oil painting, rather lumpy and middle aged) so I said "but you tell people I have called you thick/stupid and I haven't",
she countered with "No I haven't, I said you MAKE me feel stupid, I never said you called me stupid".

So I said "this has been going on some time now, and bluntly, I'm on eggshells around you"
The reaction to that was snarl and "so!! It's all MY fault is it??" followed by water works and a list of antidepressant medication and how no one understood how debilitating it all is.

So I said we needed to realise we had both got hold of the wrong end of a stick along the way and we could put this all behind us and move on as it was one big misunderstanding.

I do know she's had years of anti-depressants, on, off and higher doses. But she also knows that I too have had an awful couple of years and am only just back on an even keel. I remind her I hadn't been well on NYE, reminded her I wasn't drinking, and she didn't ask why or what may be wrong with my health.

So we left it all cordial.

However, I will never socialise with her again if at all avoidable.

I also came away feeling she is one of the most manipulative people I have ever encountered and that she is an expert at the 'little girl lost' persona to get people on side. When I wasn't taken in by the water works, she turned the aggression on to get me to back down.

Thanks for letting me vent!

*that should read yesterday after work, not Monday, I'm a day out of kilter

I think you are right to label her as manipulative. Stay out of her way in future.