AIBU to think some doctors are really arrogant?

[forestsofthenight]

I know some are wonderful: I did have a lovely GP once but as a whole does anyone else find them horribly arrogant? Just been in hospital and without fail was spoken to like shit by doctors while the nurses were lovely. Has anyone else found doctors to be so up themselves?

Hilariously, I am now training in an allied health profession and we have entire units dedicated to communication. If I ever spoke to someone like that I wouldn't be able to renew my membership.

FWIW OP. I agree with you, I understand people's support BUT the NHS isn't flawless. I've seen the bad and the good side of it this year. I too, have had more good doctors than just the odd 'bad' one.. Well not even bad, just overworked and overstretched but they can also be complacent sometimes. As he found out for himself when he looked rather sheepish as I got rushed back in once
I've also had a bad nurse who ignored me all day was too complacent until they had to call critical care down for me. I dont generalise nurses or doctors because ive had a couple of bad experiences. I also had the same with a midwife who dismissed me when I was pg with ds, least she had the grace to apologise when the consultant ended up admitting me for a week. Doesn't mean all midwives are bad/arrogant.

Overall YABU, as others have said it's a generalisation, some people are arrogant therefore of course some doctors are arrogant.

However, something that stayed with me was the comments made by an old friend of mine who was training to be a doctor. They were complaining about patients wasting their time over trivialities and that these patients were boring and a waste of a doctor's training and expertise.

I countered with the argument that people without medical training may well be scared to feel unwell and therefore turn to the doctor for help, it's not stupidity or wilful wastefulness.

I found the comments very arrogant at the time as this person so obviously thought patients were beneath them - although in principle of course I agree a GP's time shouldn't be wasted I don't think the average person is always able to make the call about whether their complaint is serious or not.

Saying that, this person regularly said how stupid 'other people' were so I never really thought of their outlook at indicative of all doctors'!

"I teach doctors. We spend a lot of time making sure they are confident and own everything they do. We instill in them the feeling they are faintly god-like. Cold authority (perceived as arrogance) is better than indecision."

You do a good job! It's an arrogant culture.

genuine question:why do you do this? Time management? Lack of belief that the public could understand why investigations/treatments are done in a certain order?

I've worked in hospitals for many years and have found most staff members (Drs, nurses etc)

However recently I have had to make a complaint to a hospital about a nurse who didn't give me my medication for almost 36 hou s (antibiotics, 40 degree fever) and then was horrifically rude every time I asked for them.

She is by far the worst health professional I've encountered but I definitely wouldn't generalise.

Yanbu, i've had a few! We had a horrendous ooh clinic at one point with the most awful Drs and the other incidents I've had have all been in hospital. Our more local ooh and local GP practice seem to be ok thankfully.

I think the 'funniest' one I experienced was when a Dr tutted and sighed repeatedly when I couldn't tell him how much milk ds was taking. He was bf, I didn't know. I said I didn't know and why, he kept repeating the question until the nurse stepped in. He just didn't seem to get it . Even she commented after he left the room that wouldn't it be great if we had a gauge on our boobs

My most frustrating one was getting berated for not taking dd's temp and giving her calpol for it. She was constipated! She was only hot because she'd been screaming in the ooh waiting room for the two hours our appt slot over ran by!

I very much think the profession has a problem with arrogance. I've met some lovely doctors and of course not all are like that but over 20 years of seeing lots of doctors, I can only conclude it's endemic to being a doctor (endemic? Is that even the word I'm looking for?)

It's particularly noticeable if you have any kind of tricky, chronic condition. Pain, fatigue, that sort of thing. And I do empathise in that I think some feel a little powerless when you won't just go away and get better. They project their own inadequacy onto you. Many have horrendous workloads too and have been bullied by superiors over the course of their careers. We expect far too much from medical practitioners. But I've experienced some pretty horrendous things, to be honest, including a doctor laughing at me during a surgical procedure involving just sedation when i was in terrible pain (and encouraging his staff to laugh along with him) and being sexually assaulted by another doctor. One doctor, when I was a child and struggled to walk more than a few steps (disabled), asked me if my pants were just too tight in front of a large gaggle of medical students. I was 12 and utterly humiliated. I have years worth of these sorts of stories I could tell. I wish the medical profession was a little more prepared to take on board that there is a problem. Just because many doctors are nice, it doesn't mean there isn't a culture of arrogance. There very much is

I told my (private but also does NHS work) doctor that he came across as arrogant (I phrased it a bit better than that) and he took it really well and massively improved.

He was charging my insurer £350 for each of my 15 minute appointments so that might have had something to do with it.

OP "as a whole does anyone else find them horribly arrogant?"

YABU. Such a terrible generalisation to make. I have met lovely Drs, nurses, shopkeepers, office workers, social workers, receptionists etc.... And I have met arrogant Drs, nurses shopkeepers, office workers, receptionists.... How can you make a statement about a whole profession like this?

Doctors work extremely hard throughout school, university and their postgraduate years. They complete a 5-6 year undergraduate degree and then have to fit in studying for postgraduate qualifications around work and what little family life they are afforded. Morale in the NHS as a whole is at an all time low with no respect or support from the government and current health secretary. A large proportion of the media are biased and this is reflected in inaccurate reporting. Then members of the public post nonsense like this.

Doctors know what they are getting into of course, but the reality of the long shifts, studying, continuously missing out on family occasions and events such as weddings and funerals is very difficult and then add on this type of attitude, makes it a stressful demoralising and thankless job at times.

I don't think we praise our NHS enough and I certainly haven't came across many arrogant doctors. They are normal people with normal families and lives.

Individuals in any profession can be arrogant, and it is very sad to see posts such as this. It would not be acceptable to generalise a race or religion in this way and nor should it be ok to generalise a whole profession, especially when they dedicate so much of their life to helping others.

DS have had hundreds of appointments with all kinds of Doctors and Surgeons over there years. All except one were lovely.

Nurses I've only met a few out of hundreds I liked.

I work with doctors, I write reports for them. In my experience, the junior doctors are highly professional, courteous and grateful of my help. Somewhere along the path to becoming a consultant they lose the ability to word an email longer than one sentence. Punctuation and pleasantries are rather lacking. And the unwillingness to use computers/over reliance on getting others to type things adds a degree of inefficiency that you don't tend to see in other industries.

The NHS is all of us though. I am as much part of it as the staff whose wages are paid by the tax I pay.

When when one part of the system tries to protect itself by clinging to an outdated belief in innate superiority, it threatens us all.

My SIL is recovering from cancer. She met the most arrogant surgeon you can imagine, a complete arse. Went on and on about his exemplary surgical record. Denied any possibility her surgery could go wrong. Nonbedaide manner at all. He was EXACTLY what she (we all) needed.

I've been treated by some really great doctors in the past. Very caring and professional. I think any kind of healthcare profession is hard and nobody is perfect. Of course there will be some who really shouldn't be in their job.

On the whole I'd say most Dr's I've come across have been fine. With one exception...

A consultant [when my DC1 was in hospital with breathing issues] was so awful to the HCA that I nearly cried for her. He was just so fucking rude and condescending and there was actual venom in his voice. I tried to smooth it over (he had a huge go at HCA as our TV was on "too loud" and she hadn't turned it down before he came to us. I told him it was my fault, I'd turned it up and he just sneered at HCA saying "she should have dealt with it")

God he was a cunt.

Hmmm, I suppose there is a fine line between advising very firmly because you know the trajectories on the one hand and believing in your own ability too much.

My profession is a bit similar. Sometimes I tell clients firmly that they don't need to worry about something (i.e. They should be talking to their customers not me!). Often they don't want to hear this!

When ds4 was in hospital after a bad accident he required a lot of plastic surgery.
The plastic surgeon spoke to me like i was a piece of shit and tried to make me feel like it was all my fault as if i didnt feel bad enough as it was.
He talked to me like i was an idiot asking if i understood that my little boy was going to be scarred for the rest of his life.
I never said anything because i didnt care how he made me feel as long as he looked after my son.
I have also met some fantastic doctors as well.

crunchymum it's awful when you can sense the atmosphere isn't it? On one of my admissions this year I had a nurse looking after me this year who was an absolute darling. She went above and beyond for her patients. There was one nurse who evidently couldn't stand her guts and it wasn't just a banter thing either. You could hear it in their voice too.

I've often wondered how she is since

YABU to generalise. I sympathise though.

I had a doctor, an FY2, who needed to catheterise me in A&E. When they catheterise you they place some local anaesthetic gel into your urethral opening to ease any discomfort. She forced the tube into my urethra, syringe tip right in, which as an HCA I've learnt isn't needed. When she tried to catheterise me I was in excruitaiting pain. She had me put my legs over the bed rails so I couldn't shut them and I was left howling , biting my hand to calm down.

I had a gynaecologist who shouted at me and told me I was too sensitive, when I couldn't cope with a coil insertion (she knew I have chronic pelvic pain, history of cervical shock, vaginisimus and major surgery down below). She carried on until I shrieked and then told me I was 'too sensitive, given two tubes of local gel didn't help you, clearly this will not work and you will obviously need a general anaesthetic,' all as if I was a time waster. I walked out sobbing and bleeding heavily for the rest of the day. Ended up bruised down below.

I could go on - my experiences of gynaecologists and their regs aren't very good.

Some doctors are plain awful.

Present GP though is absolutely wonderful, I don't know what I'd do without her.. So not all doctors are arrogant. Only some.

I work with doctors. Some are arrogant, some are not. Any good doctor is confident in their ability. They have to be.

I think the problem is the small number of patients who expect doctors and nurses to be plaster saints with the information giving ability of google and the compassion of mother Teresa. All the time. Every single time. Meanwhile the patients can and do fail to listen, fail to change, fail to accept what they are told. But it's always the hcp's fault, not the patient.

A young junior female doctor was so kind and caring to my mother in A and E that I almost wept. She was just lovely.

Another woman doctor, a gerontologist, was equally kind and caring with my father.

Both in Kingston Hospital.

I also work with doctors. As others have said, some are, some aren't. Different personality types.

Some of the comments in this thread are awful. The kind of generalisations being made about doctors are far and away the greatest examples of arrogance here.

YABU.

There is an enormous emphasis on communication in medical training, but anyone, including doctors, can have an off day. That's important.

This thread also exposes some real ignorance about the workload that doctors have, and while communication, empathy and soft skills are important and valid, they are not the most important thing. While I have met some arrogant doctors, none are bad at keeping patients alive and well.

As others have pointed out, there is utter chaos from the pressure the NHS is under at the moment. If getting warm fuzzies from your doctor is the most important thing for you, paying a hell of a lot more for them to have the time to do it, either through political change and greater tax contributions to the NHS, or as a private consultation will certainly help in getting it.

YABU. In general people who choose to help others as a career Drs, Nurses, care assistants are generally very nice people.

Coming from a family of Drs of various types it is generally accepted (by the many Drs that I know) that surgery draws a very specific type. Interestingly many of the negative stories above are about surgeons.

My father has just retired after 40 years as a GP (I am obviously biased) but he is a genuinely loved member of the community every Christmas he gets dozens of cards thanking him for everything he has done. As a child I remember being stopped in the street constantly when out with him by people who wanted to say thank you. He would go the extra mile for anyone and is the kindest gentlest man I have ever known.

I am certain that my sister is an equally good gp as is her husband. Highly educated, intelligent and busy yes. Arragant don't make me laugh.

YABU - some are, in the same way that some teachers, bin men, lorry drivers, nurses, computer programmers, actors, musicians.... are. As a PP said, some people are arrogant therefore some doctors are, but it's hugely unreasonable to then generalise with "on the whole".

camelfinger I have been a consultant for 8 years. I can assure you that neither me, nor my contemporaries, are unwilling to use computers. I suspect I use them more than most people as I also program and build them, but I don't know a single consultant who won't use technology. I also type my own letters because I type faster than I dictate.

The problem with this type of thread is that it is a vehicle for people to post their "horrendous experience with nhs" stories, often blaming the medical staff. Morale amongst medics who read it will get lower (particularly those who have worked 14+h shifts over Christmas, not seeing their families), it's not difficult to see how the constant negativity is leading to an exodus of uk trained doctors around the world.

haveyourselfamerry doctors are trained in a manner than instils them with confidence in their decisions. When you're faced with someone critically ill after major trauma, you don't want someone uncertain or indecisive running the team. You want someone who trusts themselves to work out what's going on and come up with a logical action plan to fix the (often multiple) issues - and you want them to do it in a very time pressured environment. You don't want someone who's unsure, dithering, doing nothing because they can't make a decision just looking at the patient while they bleed out.

For what it's worth, many doctors don't have that level of inner self assurance. We all second guess ourselves occasionally and everyone I know goes over scenarios over and over again with colleagues, questioning their judgement at the time. We do it after the event though, not during it. Arrogance can be a front to cover uncertainty, lack of knowledge of a particular issue, not wanting to "lose face" in front of other colleagues or patients, or fear that the doctor in question just isn't good enough. I'm sure there are patients in my past who will have formed the opinion that I am arrogant, just as there are others who think I am lovely (I have the thankyou letters in my portfolio).