wanting to continue the porn discussion from "relationships"

[madamez]

Well, I don't think it's unreasonable to want to continue the discussion, or to bring it over here - basically was just indicating to the other discussers that I've staked out a table and set up the drinks, so come on and sit down and let's ... er... have at it again.

It isn't weird to think porn is ok. It is a little narrow minded not to be able to see how it is not ok in some people's relationships because of how it has been used.

Shinyhappy, by the same standards, then, cookery programmes and recipe books are harmful ("why can't you cook properly, bitch?", along with the likes of Trinny and Susannah ("you've really let yourself go, why can't you dress better?").... not to mention the amount of research that seems to indicate (I am always a bit wary of quoting research I've heard of as so much research is either crap in itself or misrepresentedf) that domestic violence by men against women increases during major sports events - does that make sport bad in and of itself?

Muminfife, I take your point but it's a bit spurious. What about if your computer got a virus because someone else had been downloading music/squabbling on gaming chatrooms/opening an email because they weren't smart enough to be able to recognise a blatant malware spam? A friend of mine on a (totally resepctable) hobbyist yahoo group is so gullible she's always doing things like telling those nice Nigerians her bank account number when they email her...

MadameZ I can't take your point because, frankly, I don't know what it is. You are waffling about cookery programmes and I just can't make the link! Without actually wishing to be rude, I'll stand by my earlier point; you don't appreciate monogamy..good for you and ballyhoo.. genuinely!.. but subsequently it seems, you really aren't in a position to get what can be the betrayal aspect of porn. And that's Daddycool's points of view aside, which are also valid and can't be swept aside as you have tried to in the other thread.

why does not seeing anything wrong with porn mean that you don't appreciate monogamy?

Ellie it doesn't at all. I was talking to MadameZ (who doesn't).. not in general.

but surely that's her choice? different styles of relationships work better for different people.

Yes. That's fine. What I am saying if that in a relationship that is not monogamous, the issue of betrayal re: use of porn is not going to be the same is it. If you are fine with your partner sleeping with other people then I seriously doubt you are going to mind what they do on the internet! That's also well and good. But not for those for who see total "faithfulness" as a required ingredient in a relationship.

Surely people wouldn't really equate lusting after Brad Pitt or similar to being unfaithful??? If so, all our marriages are in trouble surely!

"so why is it so weird to think porn is ok??"

If by 'porn' you mean erotica published by people who are enjoying it and doing it for free, there's nothin 'wrong' with it.

That isn't the argument, surely?

Sorry MiF - read that quote as being from Madame. Too many M's!

But this does seems to be your argument Madame, or am I mistaken? The response still stands.

Monkeytrousers: why should it only be ok to look at pictures of people who are doing it for free? Why shouldn't people get paid to work as porn performers if they want to?
Shinyhappypeople: Ok, so you were not making a point I thought you were making and we got our wires crossed. But what is the difference between someone looking at pictures of a celebrity and fantasizing about sex with the celebrity, and someone looking at 'porn' and fantasizing about sex? If someone is so frantically monogamous that they get palpitations should their partner look at a picture of any other human being, then they are the ones in need of help.

That is the only way you can guarantee they aren't being exploited. Well actually, you still couldn't guarantee it, but it would be less likely - and less ubiquitous too.

Well it?s obvious if you haven't been exploited then it isn't 'wrong'. But we get, even with the gonzo porn stuff, a sanitised snapshot of a global industry in, guess what, exploitation, porn being on the same continuum as human trafficking for prostitution. It's an unsavoury fact, but they are linked, just like shopping in Tescos contributes to misery continuum around the world.

If someone wants to be fucked by whoever, whenever and in whatever orifice, because she likes it and it was one of a multitude of choices which she had control over then fair do's. That's not what I'm on about.

Monkeytrousers: so are people who sing, or dance, or play music exploited if they get paid, but not exploited if they don't? Is it less exploitation to work long dreary hours scrubbing floors or flipping burgers for the minimum wage than to pose for photographs for rather more money?
Why, in short, do you thin that porn performers are less exploited if they do it for free than if they get paid?

Oh I'd have to go into biology and psychlogy and I can't be bothered, sorry. I've posted about this all before and I feel like I'm groundhogging myself.

Monkeyttoursers: oh do go into the biology and physiology of it. Because I've yet to hear any justification for regarding 'porn' as some kind of separate alien entity that, unlike any other media, contaminates by the mere mention of its name...