Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think this is NOT persecuting Christians in this country

31 replies

amispartacus · 11/12/2016 09:22

But is instead reminding a professional that 'telling someone about Jesus' when they are about to have an operation is not part of their job

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4021094/Nurse-sacked-offering-pray-patients-despite-call-equality-watchdog-end-persecution-Christians.html?

Her job was not to ask people about their religion. Part of it was to get them to fill in a questionaiire which had a a question about religion.

"Mrs Kuteh said conversations sometimes arose if a patient failed to put anything in the box marked Religion, and she might ask them why and even tell them how her faith had helped her overcome adversity"

I can imagine the response from the DM if it had been a Muslim telling a patient about how being Muslim had helped them overcome adversity.

AIBU to think this has nothing to do with persecuting Christians in this country?

OP posts:
Original poster
amispartacus · 11/12/2016 09:23

More from the article

"The row comes after Theresa May told MPs that Christians should feel able to speak about their faith at work.

The Prime Minister’s comments followed criticism by Government watchdog the Equality and Human Rights Commission, highlighted by The Mail on Sunday, of politically correct organisations that curb freedom of expression"

Feel free to talk about your faith. At appropriate times. To people who want to listen.

OP posts:
neonrainbow · 11/12/2016 09:27

I don't think you should be able to talk about your faith at work unless you work for a religious institute or are directly asked.

CaoNiMerrilyOnHigh · 11/12/2016 09:28

This is in no way "persecution". Being persecuted for your faith means being beaten, stoned, hounded, tortured. Typically over-inflated language from the press.

Original poster
amispartacus · 11/12/2016 09:30

"It's PC gone mad when you can't tell people who are non Christians about Jesus when they are in a vulnerable position"

Hmm

That's basically the DM position.

OP posts:
insancerre · 11/12/2016 09:34

Yanbu
I would have complained too
Religion has no place in an operating theatre
I would rather put my trust in the doctors and nurses
I often leave a blank on forms like this than write atheist because its nobody's business what my religious views are
I also don't want to hear about anyone else's beliefs
Its unprofessional and I think she deserved to be sacked

TheMortificadosDragon · 11/12/2016 09:39

According to that report (DM so will be minimising if anything) she'd had warnings after complaints in April, but had carried on resulting in 3 more complaints.

Surely anyone responsible for checking the form would realise that people don't 'fail' to fill in the religion box, they ignore it because it's completely irrelevant to them? As for what harm it could do to start proselytising, I should think there are quite a few who would get raised blood pressure, or be worried at a vulnerable point.

thethoughtfox · 11/12/2016 09:44

It is part of the Christian narrative to see themselves as a persecuted minority despite all evidence to the contrary. I saw an article the other day saying that scholars now believe that a lot of the tales of persecution throughout history are not true / greatly exaggerated.

thethoughtfox · 11/12/2016 09:45

YANBU Can you imagine people sharing the truth about my Lord Satan, or even just Allah?

Witchend · 11/12/2016 09:50

It's not persecuting.

A persecuted Christian is one like the Iraqi one I met. He was given death threats, and his brother was killed when his home was targeted with a bomb. He left Iraq that evening with nothing but what he wore.

Or the photos I've just inherited from my grandad. He was on the middle East during WWII, he took photos,with his old Browbie camera. Some of these are Christians been hung for their faith, not just one or two, but rows of them.

Pineapplemilkshake · 11/12/2016 10:49

I agree. It's not persecution at all.

I'm an atheist, and I would be annoyed if a nurse, or anyone else for that matter tried to talk to me about religion, in a healthcare environment.

JellyBelli · 11/12/2016 10:51

Its not PC gone mad and its not persecution. She cant take no for an answer and ignored repeated warnings.

Creatureofthenight · 11/12/2016 10:55

FFS stupid woman, of course she isn't persecuted. She needs to learn some professional boundaries.

Original poster
amispartacus · 11/12/2016 10:55

This nurse is still allowed to practise her faith in this country. If she wants to talk about it to friends, she is allowed to. No one will arrest her and throw her in jail. At the moment we are celebrating Christmas. Schools are performing nativities, cards are being sent with Jesus on them, one of the main broadcasters will have programmes of carols and services on the day, the shops will be shut and it's a National holiday.

Christians are not being persecuted in this country and they are allowed to discuss their faith. At the appropriate time.

OP posts:
Isitadoubleentendre · 11/12/2016 11:02

Huh? So she would get then to fill in a questionnaire, one of the questions being about religion, and if they put nothing then she would start talking about Jesus and her faith?

Wow, yeah that would really piss me off as a patient. And im not particularly atheist/anti religion.

KayTee87 · 11/12/2016 11:03

I'm a Christian and think she was unprofessional. It's absurd to say we're persecuted. I can go to church without any fear, I can celebrate religious holidays without any fear etc.

Aderyn2016 · 11/12/2016 11:05

I am an atheist but I wouldn't have felt offended by this woman. To her Christianity is a huge comfort and she wants to give that comfort to other people. Her actions come from a good place. I do agree that if she continued to push religion at people who asked her not to, then that is a problem, but I'd quite like it if someone wanted to pray for me - I don't believe in God but it means that person cares enough to do that for me.

YouTheCat · 11/12/2016 11:06

I don't want anyone talking to me about Jesus.

She's not being persecuted. She's an idiot.

Original poster
amispartacus · 11/12/2016 11:07

o her Christianity is a huge comfort and she wants to give that comfort to other people

What about other people trying to 'sell things to you' that give comfort to them?

OP posts:
Gingernaut · 11/12/2016 11:07

If they leave the box unticked, you're meant to query it and point out the atheist option if applicable.

Going on about how Jesus saved you to patients who are in your power, under your care, when they are scared, in pain and awaiting procedures is just wrong.

StripedTulip · 11/12/2016 11:10

Mrs Kuteh said conversations sometimes arose if a patient failed to put anything in the box marked Religion, and she might ask them why and even tell them how her faith had helped her overcome adversity

If someone had DARED to say that to me when I was vulnerable & just about to undergo quite a scary operation a few years ago, I would have wanted to hit them. It's outrageously unprofessional.

And hasn't this woman heard of the sin of spiritual pride?

EmeliaHerveyHenryFitzroy · 11/12/2016 11:11

It is part of the Christian narrative to see themselves as a persecuted minority despite all evidence to the contrary.

Isn't this usually more the narrative of the American evangelical Christian rather than the Anglican tradition? (I genuinely don't know.)

I've not heard the 'persecution' rhetoric in the U.K. but have in the USA.

Heathen4Hire · 11/12/2016 11:21

Faith, or lack of, is a personal thing. I hate street preachers and those who foist their beliefs on others. To do it when a person is most vulnerable and scared is unprofessional and an utter disgrace.

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 11/12/2016 11:30

This woman has been warned. She needs to receive some consequences for her conduct, even lose her job.

If anyone is being persecuted it's her poor patients. If someone had done this to me in a theatre setting I, like a PP, would have wanted to hit her. It's so bullying and intrusive.

Aderyn2016 · 11/12/2016 11:34

Amispartacus, I don't really see someone promoting their religious belief in the same way as someone trying to sell me a product. A person with faith is not trying to sell you something for their own personal gain, but trying to give you something they are convinced is valuable and will help you.
I get that when people are ill, they don't necessarily have the tolerance for other people's religious beliefs but I think I'd be comforted by the idea that she cared.

ratspeaker · 11/12/2016 11:34

She's not being persecuted for being Christian. She's been sacked for continuing to work in an unprofessional manner, even after she had been warned she still had 3 complaints.

How many people on mumsnet have complained about Jehovas Witnesses coming to their doors ( I've also had Mormons andPentecostals)
Are we persecuting them for their Christian beliefs if we tell them to go away and stop bothering us?

She was employed to nurse people not convert them