AIBU to be horrified by the Stolen Children of England

[LivingOnTheDancefloor]

I just watched a French documentary called "England's stolen children" and can't believe this is happening in England. Horrifying, scary, unbelievable, it is like a horror movie...

Basically, social services are taking babies from their parents based on suspicion that abuse might happen in the future, except that the decision is made based on ridiculous things.
A lady had her three children taken from her, including a breastfed baby because she went to the ER for a child's broken ankle and they judged that he must have been beaten by his parents (only based on the ankle). X years later the parents manage to prove the fracture was due to scorbut. And they found out the initial report from the ER says "no sign of fracture".
The judge admitted they shouldn't have taken the children and the parents were innocents. But the children were given to adoption so the parents will never see them again.
That is just one of the stories.
Some women are told while pregnant that their newborn will be taken as soon as he arrives (and thzney do it).
The documentary says it is due to the facts that counties have to reach a number of children given to adoption so they target poor/uneducated parents and find any reason to take their children.
And as fostering costs money to the state they prefer adoption.

AIBU to ask if you heard about it here in the UK? And if yes, what do you think? Could it be true or are they exagerating?

I am really shaken.

www.google.fr/amp/s/researchingreform.net/2016/11/14/englands-stolen-children-controversial-new-documentary-on-forced-adoption/amp/?client=safari

Sorry, no idea how to post links, and I am on my phone

On a forced adoption thread years ago here, there was a poster who believed adamantly that if the parents fought against the adoption order, that clearly meant that they loved their children and had been wronged. Clearly a very naive view, but not uncommon I think.

if MH is an issue they will support and advise and help the sufferer to get the treatment they need.

HAHAHAHAHAHA

The picture of social services that is presented on mumsnet is hilariously inaccurate.

But yeah, say it enough times and maybe it'll come true.

Thank you for your post Silenceoftheprams.
We have family members who foster. Of the ten children they have fostered to date two were returned to the parents (not siblings, different parents) one is to be returned to the parents shortly following a court order.
I am interested to hear about the massive fees paid to foster carers. Local Authority foster carers are paid £123 per week outside London for pre school children. Out of this costs for the child (food, clothes, nappies etc) have to be paid, so it is hardly lucrative. Private foster carers can earn more, but they are also likely to have harder to place children.

I'm a Social Worker. I'm currently sat at my desk shovelling my lunch down my throat and reading this on the 10 mins I've managed to grab in the 12 hour day I will work today. Looking around at my team there are 9 desks, 7 of them are currently empty. 2 are off on sick leave, both with conditions exacerbated by stress. One worker is currently in court with a terrible neglect case, one is with a 4 year old having an invasive child protection medical because of alleged sexual abuse. One is driving a woman and 4 children to a refuge because of domestic violence and our overworked Family Support Worker is working with yet another family educating the parents as to what needs to be done to PREVENT the children being taken in to care. The only other worker in is currently sat at her desk crying while she negotiates with her bank because she can't afford the mortgage this month due to the extra childcare costs she has incurred because of the longer hours she has had to work this month to get her cases up to date.

At least 2 of these workers will cry tonight because of what they have endured today. One of them will have to put up with an abusive client and one will wonder how they will be able to afford Christmas presents for their own children. This is a completely normal day.

It is a very tough job for social workers.
I suspect if we didn't give sick pay just SSP we might find fewer off sick and therefore colleagues more supported but that' s a separate issue.

I would certanily support no adoption, just long term fostering so that injustices can be undone and children returned to birth families in cases like that mentioned in the first post. Adoption is too final.

I would also support fewer children taken away from families even if that means more are damaged. It is a difficult call however for our society.

If I were in difficulties like this I would go abroad. I would not stay in the UK.

'No adoption' would not be beneficial to children. How would you feel if you never had a permanent place to live?

As for your statutory sick pay notion, it's offensive.

I would also support fewer children taken away from families even if that means more are damaged.

And would you explain to those children why you were leaving them in homes where they weren't safe?

Enormous why do you think that Parents' rights are more important than children's rights? Genuinely interested

I would also support fewer children taken away from families even if that means more are damaged.

I would also support fewer children taken away from families even if that means more are damaged.

What a fucking despicable attitude.

"ive heard of social worker's getting pay rise's for the number of children they get adopted per 6 month's"
Utter, utter bollocks. Simply not true. I'm a SW and this simply does not happen.

Oh well, at least the production team that produced this documentary got the reaction they presumably wanted

EnormousTiger did you read the bit about a social worker already crying because she can't afford the mortgage? You think forcing her into a position where she either goes into work with a vomiting bug, or flu, or whatever else we all get struck down with each year, or she gets paid statutory sick pay resulting in her defaulting on her mortgage again is a good idea? I hazard a guess that city lawyers aren't subject to statutory sick pay, despite which they go in to work, just as the average social worker will go into work. If I'm wrong, well at least the inflated income of city lawyers should leave them with substantial savings to fall back on.

slender what's your experience then? Nobody has said that children's services are amazing, that all workers are saints and that they never get it badly wrong or make errors. It's a chronically underfunded service. How do you propose they support families where a parent has mental health issues when the services are being slashed front, right and centre? We're not able to pull it out our backsides. The ire should be aimed to this government who don't think that vulnerable children and adults are worth decent support and treatment services.

EnormousTiger That is a disgusting attitude and colluding in abuse and neglect. A normal response to failings in child protection is to ensure these services are better funded, that workers are better trained, that communication is improved, that poor practice is stomped out and that accountability is improved. Parents do not have rights, they have responsibilities.

I made a FOI to Kent about bonus payments in 2014
childprotectionresource.online/are-bonuses-paid-to-social-workers/

I have for many years argued that the problem here is not that Evil Social Workers are Evil but that we cannot seem, as a society to have an adult debate about these important matters.

Of course, there are problems because of restrictions about what can be reported about family cases. But there does seem to be a reluctance from 'officials' to engage and reassure. And who comes running in to fill the gap - Hemming Josephs and Booker.

But having now read the thread I am relieved and reassured to see the robust responses from some of the first commentators. Good to see that mumsnetters don't have short memories.

And btw if anyone is thinking of leaving the country, as John Hemming advised on Panorama in 2014, have a read of this.

childprotectionresource.online/mums-on-the-run-where-do-they-go-how-safe-are-they/

I really wouldn't advise anyone going to his caravan park after what I have read about Gena's partner.

for Restless and team.

Of the six SW involved in DD's case, one was taking early retirement (not on an enhanced pension, before anyone chips in with that, just basically leaving before she keeled over); one was moving to adult social care because her workload was unmanageable; one was resigning due to workload (she was terrified she would make a mistake and be hung out to dry); one was on long term sick (stress related, I believe). I understand that this is typical across the country's SW teams.

Enormous - there are no words

spero - thank you for that link to the Hampstead site. Fascinating, hysterical and depressing all in one site....!

restless I saw that too. Social workers who are driven into the ground and burn out and still have to keep going.

Again, it's a savage indictment of the level of 'civilization' in this country that so many families struggle so badly and there is so very little support. I too laughed at the idea of sufficient MH and social support being available to struggling families.

The flaws in the system are real and the bad apples are there and they make a desperately stretched system and people worse.

You can't ignore that.

But the solution is not to kick social workers but to invest properly in sufficient well trained people and adequate resources. I hope that one day it will happen ... not sure it's a realistic hope though

"I would also support fewer children taken away from families even if that means more are damaged."

So Daniel Pelka was a success story then?

I am not a social worker and not an adoptive parent. On the contrary, I am a parent who has been suspected of abuse due to an undiagnosed medical condition, though it never went as far as court proceedings. I know exactly what it is like to be there, in hospital, trying to make sense of a confusing and terrifying situation, trying to reassure your child at the same time as worrying about the right thing to say.

And I absolutely do not want a SINGLE CHILD TO DIE to be relieved of that memory.

Also, I completely fail to see how dd, with her undiagnosed condition, could have been better off on the run, living in squalor and with no access to medical care.

Surely if you suspect that your child is ill rather than abused, the last thing you would want is to take her away from any chances of further medical investigation??? That sounds completely irresponsible. Could anyone explain?

I was removed from my mother at just a few days old as she was neglecting me. I then spent the next 11 years being bounced around from foster care to family and to my mother. She kept parental rights at all times. Whenever I was returned to her she would beat me and starve me.

My mother also had 3 other children and abused them as well. They had several injuries over the years but they were never removed. I moved back at 13 and was left to raise my siblings. Mother spent money on food for herself and left us to go hungry. I had to find food from neighbours and even ate out of a bin. I didn't attend school much as I had to take my siblings to school and clean the house. My mother beat me on a daily basis including once breaking a carpet beater on me.

In all that time social services knew about us and the abuse but they didn't get involved. My mother had the right to have us living with her and nothing could be done despite several hospital admissions.

As an adult I think social services failed us all. My youngest brother has had a breakdown and substance abuse problems. My other brother has similar issues. My sister is anorexic and can not adequately parent her son. Her exes are all druggies and abusive.

I have severe abandonment issues as well as eating issues. I have also had to cope with recovering from sexual abuse and a violent relationship. I have never had a home. In fact i moved so much between foster homes that I do not know where I lived and when as records have been lost over time.

I wish more than anything that my siblings and myself had been adopted. The damage that was done to us because our mothers rights came before us is huge. We will never recover. I don't blame the individual social workers involved as their hands were tied but I do blame a system where parents needs come first and children are left to be abused. It's a bloody mess and until we think about the kids first we will always have kids being abused and murdered by their parents.

Barbadosgirl very interesting post

MsHoolies yes it was this case

Just to clarify a few points about the documentary:
Nothing was said about adoptive parents buying children or even giving money. They didn't say anything negative about them really.
All families portrayed were British from what I could tell, it wasn't about "taking children from immigrants".
What the said was that when the decision was made to remove a child, adoption was cheaper than foster care so that was chosen (even though it meant the birth parents couldn't then get the child back in the future).
The reason cited for the quotas of children to be put up for adoption was that after some scandals of abused children that social services missed, pressure was made by the government to "show they were taking action".

I am reading this discussion with a lot of interest. I have never heard about it before.

Oh and in no way is this English bashing. I am sure there are horrible stories about France as well. Someone mentioned how Autism is treated, I have heard about it yes.

littlemissangrypants

Children are not adopted because it's cheaper than foster care. That is a shameful lie.