The reason young people can't afford to buy houses

[GrabtharsHammer]

Is because they all have iPhones and Sky telly.

So sayeth my mother.

Nothing at all to do with the ridiculous house prices then? They are baby boomers and bought their first house for a few thousand quid on my dads modest salary.

Apparently the youth of today just need to get rid of their gadgets and telly subscriptions and then they will easily afford a deposit and mortgage.

Are everyone's parents this judgemental and out of touch or am I just particularly lucky?

(Fairly lighthearted) AIBU?

'They could buy a one bedroom flat around the corner from me for £160k but want three bedrooms. '

On less than £30k income? Do they have a £100k deposit? LOL @ a couple on less than £30k/annum being able to buy a £160k one bed flat.

Also lots of people are self employed now, I run my own business and though it's steady now when I was setting up no mortgage company would consider giving me one and to be honest I'm not sure they would now either.
We only managed it because DH got the mortgage in his name before we were married.

I just had to write a character reference for a friend who is trying to rent a tiny flat. It's crazy!

I really really don't like to get into inter generational comparisons as it tends not to make any of us happier. I accept it is very very hard for young people to buy property in cities with jobs (although certainly not near places like Leeds of course and I know loads of people who have bought cheaply in Scotland so it depends on your city). I have young people - 5, and 3 bought in their 20s and in part that is because their mother always worked full time. Secondly I am going to give all my pension as a lump sum at age 55 to the children.

So those unable to buy on this thread - have both your parents worked full time for 30 years without career breaks and maternity leaves and will they give up their pension for you? I am just illustrating why some young people can more easily buy than others.

Secondly my daughters could have chosen different careers than law with shorter hours, no working through the night without pay etc. they didn't and they have both bought somewhere in their 20s.

I agree given stamp duty levels it is silly to buy and sell in areas with high prices every few years. I suggest those who want to be within the London tube areas probably need to buy a 1 or 2 bed flat with their partner in their 20s and then buy if they feel children need a bigger place somewhere further out when they their babies get a bit bigger. That is two moves. I also moved to a much bigger house after 12 years of full time working (no maternity leaves or breaks) because I knew I woudl work until I die and I took the risk. I sold that previous house by the way at a loss. People saying there used to be a one way property always went up ladder as just totally wrong. We sold our house in outer London at less than we paid for it in the 1990s. The market goes up and down. It was never a one way bet even in London even in the 90s.

However my view is it is very hard indeed to buy even for graduates. My mother put off having babies for nearly 10 years after marriage to work full time so they could buy a house.

"Capricorn76 Mon 28-Nov-16 20:49:00

I fully agree EnormousTiger. One of the reasons I work my arse off is so I can help DD to buy in the future. I also believe in aiming for jobs that pay. I researched jobs before I chose my degree. I would've liked to do music production but the chances of me making house buying money were small and I never had the kind of parental financial cushion to allow me to follow my heart and learn for learnings sake. I had to make the degree pay. I can have music as a hobby instead. You've got to play the long game."

I similarly adored music, 4 grade 8s professional voice (I am not really showing off on that - I genuinely sing particularly well and every day, perfect pitch etc) but I didn't choose music as a career b ecause I know it's really badly paid. I read law instead and I chose to work in law firms doing business law which pays a lot because I wanted my children to be able to afford houses. We do tend to reap what we sow in life. And we divide into those who think people are unable to control their fate and those who think they can. If you put yourself in the latter category you tend to be happier. that does not mean that luck plays no part but if you think I am a architect of my own future and I can control it to some extent by getting brilliant exam results, working hard (I graduated a teetoal virigin aged 20 in law so not surprisingly I wasn't pregnant before age 21 and I won university law prizes)

In the village where I grew up there used to be quite a few small houses and cottages but as their elderly owners died, most were demolished and huge houses put on the plot. There hasn't actually been anything suitable for first time buyers builtst there for at least thirty years which is why I moved away. My parents live in a street of ten houses (all 4 bed with gardens) and I grew up there - every house bar one was occupied by a family with children. Now several have changed hands over the years but they have all been bought by retired people - no local families can possibly afford them. This of course has a knock on effect on local services (e.g. schools) as the village is rapidly becoming older and older! (And of course most of the village voted Brexit because you know, loads of immigrants have the odd million around to spend on housing....)

I read law instead and I chose to work in law firms doing business law which pays a lot because I wanted my children to be able to afford houses.

As has been pointed out many times on MN, not everybody can or should be a lawyer. We do actually need teachers, nurses, social workers, pharmacists, ... who don't earn six figure incomes. These people should be able to afford houses too.

I know it's a very morbid way to look at things but what do people think about things eventually 'evening out' once certain generations begin to pass away and their assets go to the generations below?

(Btw I'm 23, homeowner as I have generous family and not trying to start A fight just wondering what the future might look like!!!)

I think a lot of this wealth is likely to be eaten up in care fees as people live longer tbh.

Christ I didn't even think of that

It might have been in the past that 'proper degrees' in 'proper subjects' got you better money but that's just not the case any more. Where are all these stable jobs for life? Most people these days have what's referred to as a 'portfolio career'.

I did my degree at a well known drama school and it was actually brilliant for today's job market. We were taught how to make websites, use graphics software, edit films, how to do our taxes, how to apply for funding/get corporate backing, how to hustle for jobs, how to promote ourselves, how to brand ourselves, how to work in a team, how to run a budget both personal and business. All incredibly attractive traits for an employer. The University actually has the highest employment rate in the field of study in the whole of Scotland and all my class mates are making decent money doing something they love.
We were taught that you have to go out and create a job for yourself if there isn't one out there and that's exactly what I did. I now run a successful yoga studio that I set up with zero funding or financial backing and I also make money online doing online yoga courses/classes and an online shop.

I also know lots and lots of professional musicians who make a decent living.

The issue is that the banks haven't kept up with the times and though there's lots of self employed people now it's still a struggle for them to get a mortgage, though i would argue that my income is probably more secure than someone in a job because I can't be fired or made redundant, if something happened to one stream of income I'd just come up with another or adapt.

user721 with the exception of a few very expensive areas, teachers, social workers, pharmacists, nurses etc can afford to buy houses, particularly if they are with a partner doing a similar job. A social worker for example: starting salary is around £28k (and if you are in children's services your level and pay will quickly rise because staff retention is a huge issue). So if 2 people are earning £28k each (a combined salary of £56k) there is no reason that they cannot afford to buy a property in most regions. I accept that there are some very expensive areas where they can't even afford a one bed flat but in most places they can afford to buy a reasonable sized house as long as they are realistic about house type and postcode.

Sorry reading that back that sounded way more arsey than I meant it.

I didn't mean that anyone could just 'make a job' as i have been very lucky to have the opportunity to be able to be trained to have the skills and I have the luxury of time to do that.

I just meant I don't get it when people say that people shouldn't do vocational degrees when they actually teach very relevant skills for today's job market.

I know lots of graduates who studied more conventional degrees who are finding it much harder.

FizzBomb I've thought about this a lot, my grandparents - between 3 households - by my best guess there is ~£3.2 mil worth of property.

On of them has a house rented out to provide income. Another is supposed to be sorting out the 2 spare houses she has to rent out (possibly to family). So they should have a retirement income. And the last grandparent is looked after my an uncle (childless and owns property), I doubt he'll go in to a care home.

I'm sure it's got to even out within my family eventually, but possibly not within society. Which is why a lot if people want higher IHT, which I wouldn't mind if it meant I could buy without losing chunks of my family.

Quite basic new build boxes being built here
£240/260k

We sold - and bought in the slump of 2011 - good job. We wouldn't be able to afford much now

What do you think is going on then six??

Do you think people are making up the struggle to buy a house?

So those unable to buy on this thread - have both your parents worked full time for 30 years without career breaks and maternity leaves and will they give up their pension for you? I am just illustrating why some young people can more easily buy than others.

My mum always worked full time. However because she was born on a council estate in a time when it was very unusual for working class people to go to uni she always worked in minimum wage retail work. She retrained when we all became teenagers but as a result won't have a huge pension and has only just got on the housing ladder herself with my stepdad (who also retrained as an adult). So no me and my sisters who get that leg up from j parents. I'm lucky that my partner already owned when I met him otherwise I probably my wouldn't be able to buy for long long time.

I appreciate your posts Enormoustiger but you clearly grew up in a position of privilege, as did your own children. I imagine a lot of yours and our children's success comes from that.

Thanks older

I know it's not the way to think about it, but I agree it may even out for certain people but not for the country overall. Dodgy

with the exception of a few very expensive areas

Not true, unless you consider most of the SE a "few very expensive areas".

I live over an hour from London. A 2 bed flat in the city costs 300k+. A 2 bed house right out in the middle of nowhere, miles from the city centre, costs 250k+.

This is NOT affordable on 2 x teacher salaries.

I have family in another part of the South, 90 mins from London. The cheapest properties are 200k. This is still a stretch on a family income of 56k.

FizzBomb it's not a popular thought is it? But for thousands of years that how it's worked and the people at the top (I'm sooooo not one of them) are unlikely to want to change the system that works so well for them.

What do you think is going on then six??

I think some people, primarily minimum wage earners and very low earners and those in very expensive areas genuinely can't afford to buy anything.
I think those with decent paid jobs Who don't live in the very expensive areas just want to buy things that they can't actually afford. They want a better postcode. They want a bigger property. They want to be in the best catchment for when they start a family. They don't want to buy a 2 bed terrace in the areas that they can actually afford because that doesn't provide the lifestyle and image that they desire.
There is also the issue of saving for a deposit. Saving for a deposit when you have rent and bills to pay is shit hard but I do think it is possible for a professional couple as long as they are prepared to be frugal for a few years. The anecdotal evidence on this thread has shown that people can save for deposits if they are prepared to be frugal for a few years and sacrifice elements of their social lives.

I guess you're right older

I mean not to give away too much but When I was born my mum was a fish monger and my dad was a lorry packer

They bought a 3 bed semi in St. Albans in 1996

They have always worked hard, I love them very much. But how the hell would people doing those jobs nowadays afford that? They just wouldn't

I've just been to manchester and couldn't believe the number of empty properties near the city centre. More should be done to move jobs from london and SE to the north and properties sold off and done up

We need more social housing for people on lower incomes. We're never going to move to everyone owning their own home, so decent long term secure social housing still needs to be increased.

I had to declare my savings then tax credits stopped
As the law stands at present any amount of SAVINGS does not affect tax credits.

However if you earn more than £300 a year in INTEREST, then your tax credits are reduced.

This will change when universal credit is introduced.