Is it time to bring back the dog licence?

[Flippetydip]

On a family bike ride/run on Saturday having witnessed so many out of control dogs and ignorant owners, not to mention the streets being paved with dog muck, I was thinking, surely it must be time to reintroduce a dog licence. Would it make people think a bit more about getting a dog?

While we were out one Jack Russell went for my ankles and then stood there growling and barking at me. When I asked the owner to get it under control I was told "it's not my fault" - well yes it is, if you can't keep it under control, keep it on a lead.

As a disclaimer, I love dogs and we are likely to get on in the next few years but it will be trained and I will clear up after it.

I'm with you, shitney, on the no poo-bag fine.

MothershipG That sounds like a really great idea.

I think only licenced breeders should sell dogs, so any puppies they sell must be neutered (when old enough). The only dogs unneutered should be those owned by licenced and regulated breeders, who should charge a fucking fortune and do all sorts of checks.

I don't think many domestic cats have seriously injured or killed people gretchen and very little of the shit on pavements and public parks will belong to cats.

In my living memory, so going back to the mid/late 1970s, the dog licence didn't seem to do anything at all and it cost more to collect than it raised. I just remember going with DM to the Post Office to hand over a ridiculously trivial sum once a year.

Maybe licensing would be a good thing if the annual fee was enough to raise a decent amount of money to pay for inspectors to enforce responsible dog ownership. Even £50-100 per year is a reasonably small extra cost over the cost of buying a dog, food, insurance, veterinary treatment etc. If you can't afford it, or don't want to pay it, don't get a dog - simple.

Behavoural classes should be compulsory, so that the dog is taught to behave and the owner learns how to manage a dog properly. Neutering should be compulsory unless you have a breeder's licence - breeding should be more controlled too - too many people see breeding as easy money.

I totally agree with the idea of a "pooh-bag" fine but this would need a licence fee to fund it I guess. Although frankly, I would happily do this as voluntary work at the moment!

I hate the idea that unscrupulous breeders breed bitches literally to exhaustion - the whole thing does need much better management.

bacon, I can see that being an admin nightmare. It's often not clear right away which puppy will a good bet for breeding (for example, if I were to breed a working dog, I'd want to see that dog through to the age of 2 or 3 to judge its temperament, drive and so on).

Yes - it should be an admin nightmare. The only people deciding who to breed from should be licenced breeders. Hence the cost will go through the roof and put many irresponsible dog owners off.

I think it would be a good idea and should be an annual fee. The proceeds then used to pay for dog wardens who would hopefully catch inconsiderate owners who don't clear up after their dog or who leave poo bags dangling from trees and impose a very stiff fine.

Okay, bacon: who'd be licencing these breeders? The well-known dog experts at the local council? The Kennel Club (which has managed to screw up a lot of breeds)?

" licenced breeders" is an entirely different issue. You are only required to have a licence to breed if you are doing it on a large scale i.e. a puppy farmer.

A new dog licencing agency filled with dog experts

This is blue sky thinking btw.

" licenced breeders" is an entirely different issue

Not really - the whole industry needs a complete overhaul.

Sounds like a sledgehammer to crack a nut, bacon, blue sky or not.

It would probably lead to an underground dog market, breeders killed and eaten by packs of pitbulls that had been kept indoors so that no one knew about them

Idk what the answer is but dog ownership appears to be regarded as a fundamental human right by many😤

Well, given the close association between the human race and dogs for the last many millennia, that's hardly surprising.

People are going to want to have dogs. The issue is managing it sensibly.

So apparently it's already illegal for anyone to sell even a single litter of puppies without a licence from the local authority? Didn't know that.

I'm all for it.

Although not sure I'd get one, my dogs a twatty madam

So apparently it's already illegal for anyone to sell even a single litter of puppies without a licence from the local authority? Didn't know that.
Er, no.

Four or more litters in any 12 months:
see here

"Dog breeders who breed five or more litters a year must be licensed under the Breeding and Sale of Dogs (Welfare) Act 1999. Even if you breed fewer than four litters a year, but breed for business purposes, you too must be licensed."

So it's not illegal to breed up to 4 litters a year per se, but it is illegal for anyone to sell puppies without a licence.

Also see www.kettering.gov.uk/info/377/licence_-_dog_breeding/238/dog_breeding

However, guidance has indicated that parliament did not intend that the legislation be used to require hobby breeders to be licensed, even if they sold puppies, and to this end a person is presumed to be carrying on a business if in a 12 month period any number of their bitches give birth in total (i.e. collectively) to 5 litters or more.
from here

We could play this all day, but certainly in this area, the district council seems to have exactly zero interest in people who breed a litter or two from their bitch and then sell the puppies.

Can't see a licence making any difference tbh. How would it be enforced. There's quite a bit of enforcement in relation to cars but there are still people driving on our roads without driving licences or insurance.

As pp said the whole dog breeding industry needs looking into, but that's not going to happen and meanwhile puppy farming seems to be thriving and increasing.

Be interesting to know if anyone has been fined for not having their dog chipped since that law's been brought in. Doubt it, because it's all but impossible to enforce.

Unless you have squads of enforcers going around with the necessary machines to check how will anyone know if a dog is chipped or not. It might be a good idea if vets were obliged to check chips, and licences if we had them, but even when my dog went for her yearly check I had to ask the vet to check if her chip was still okay as I know they can move and it hasn't been checked for ages. And tbh why should vets be responsible for that.

Just don't see that a licence would make any difference. There are responsible owners and irresponsible owners, a licence won't change that. In the same way some people won't bother chipping their dogs, some wouldn't bother with a licence.

Yep and a cat licence too, £500 per cat per year please.