Recruitment, can't believe how hard it is!

[Sunnydawn]

I read and hear so much about people wanting flexible working, and how so many people are stuck in dead end jobs, or on zero hours contracts.

But, I am involved in recruitment for two jobs right now, one a professional job in a lovely environment, as a part time job share. The other, a part time, flexible, admin job, again in a lovely office, with training and a good career if you want it.

And no decent applicants! No applicants for the first. Loads who have applied for the latter, but ecan't even attempt the basics forvan interview or trial (ie. turning up in time, dressing half smart, answer a phone).

Frankly, I despair. What are people doing? Where are they working/wanting to work?

These are different places, by the way, so it's not the particular environment.

Re coding, The kids are doing it at school, it's not hard to programme in Visual Basic 5 or C++ I'm told. I haven't a clue but just what I've been told by my 14 year old

I'd love more part time work. Fitting round school would be even better. Just never see anything advertised.

A lot of jobs are advertised as full time it's a shame more employers don't advertise job shares or flexible hours - we do. We would rather have someone than no one

Yes, I agree with pissed. Don't bring up your children or childcare issues until you've got the job. They are not allowed to ask you, I don't think as it could be construed as indirect sex discrimination.

I never mention kids. I also advise it

I'm stunned, tbh! Before I had the DC I had a full time job, on a very decent salary and bonus scheme etc. But I did have to travel and commute so when the children came along I left and later looked for something local. I now work in a part-time term-time home based role which I do quite enjoy, but which pays little more than minimum wage (was on 3 or 4 times that before with 30 days holiday, healthcare and company car!). It's public sector which probably makes a difference - but although I know what I do must be worth a fair bit more really - I've always assumed these jobs are massively in demand for parents, and therefore they can fill them on the low wages. After all - I chose to take it on that basis, just to keep my hand in, and for the flexibility. I can't believe (decent) people aren't biting the OP's hand off.....!!

Recruitment is shite in the public sector. Pointless application forms. If you are over 40 does a year in the early 90's when you can't remember what pointless shelf stacking job, really matter? Apparently so. Despite abproven track record in all other respects.
So in my current job, I got turned down officially three times, got the job through the backdoor and have been exceeding in it. Of the people they employed through their recruitment route, two accepted and never showed up and the one that got the job has gone long term sick.
Never mind though, they filled in a perfect application.

I could probably earn a lot more in private but 1. I'm learning and 2. I get bloody good holidays and pension

I don't look at what people did in the 90's it is recent experience that matters but mostly I am recruiting qualified staff and it's impossible. Nurses don't want permanent posts

I agree with not mentioning children or childcare. It wouldn't bother me, but I know that's not the common view.

Beware the casual questions which are designed to 'out' your maternal status as well. My particular favourite - when asked about my current remuneration package - was an ultra-casual enquiry about whether I would need couples or family private medical cover Other common ones include queries about short-notice overtime or working weekends, bank holidays or school holidays.

Thanks for advice about coding etc above. Have looked into formal learning but not sure what language to go for, unsure what will be in demand next year and what will be obsolete.

Will stick to messing around on Scratch with dd for now - tempted to start on Unity but probably not a great career move!

You're probably not paying enough.

I see admin jobs paying the salary levels of the 1990s. In the meantime, there are fewer admin staff within companies and workloads are huge. I wouldn't recommend admin/PA work to anyone.

On the other side of the coin I have been contacted by the same agency 3 times in the past year to interview for roles in my field. Every single time they contact me I have to keep reiterating that unless I can get similar flexibility to that of my current role I can't consider moving jobs. They either don't record my requirements each time they speak to me or think they can just tempt me with a fab salary. It's so annoying to be given the spiel and I really need the extra money but flexibility is worth more

The thing is PA work leads to many other avenues and incorporates finance, recruitment and management - so it's not totally a write off. It's a stepping stone

They will also lie to you to get you to go to the interview because they will have promised to get multiple candidates.

Flopsypopsymopsy
You are so right, my workload is horrendous as a PA but no value is placed on it at all

Pissessed.. You say aim higher, but I honestly haven't seen anything ither than basic pt work that I could do,,despite being well educated etc! I've very much fallen into the mummy trap I think. I'm not a qualified psychologist/ot/social worker/lawyer/doctor / no business experience etc. It's the curse of the ex teacher, highly intelligent but no experience in business etc.

I'm reeling reading about recruiters making sweeping generalisations about applicants. We're not all lazy, work-shy people who can't spell check their CV.

It's bloody difficult to get a job. Let alone one which pays the bills.

Myusername, PA work is not a stepping stone to other things IME.

If you're any good, PA jobs have a nasty habit of morphing into huge monsters. I've started working for the boss, then another director gets added, then you're pulling together reports for one of the teams because they're under pressure. You're organising sales conferences, Christmas parties, covering Reception, minuting Board Meetings, add a bit of travel booking for the SMT, help with the recruitment for a Non-Exec Director, run around organising lunches, coffees, clearing meeting rooms, ordering stationery, fixing the sodding photocopier because no other sod in the engineering department can work out how to unjam the bloody thing, doing expenses.... When anything slightly unusual comes up, it's like... "Ooh, flopsypopsymopsy can probably 'help' you with that." Hey presto! You're managing another project.

I know quite a few PAs who are 'stuck' because companies are incapable of seeing them as anything else.

Meanwhile, everyone else in the company thinks you just make the tea and type a few letters.

I would luv to work part time 3 full days a week, in a office admin/ finance. Have previous experience (15 years ago...kids). Working part time slap, bang in the middle of the day for local council ( school kitchens). If I apply for jobs I never here anything and within my present role I am in customer services. It sometimes feels, because I am older I couldn't do that particular role. But I know I could.

Agree with you about the job description creep flopsy. When I left my £16000 pro rata part time 'secretarial' job because I couldn't stand the expansion of the work any more they replaced me with someone who they paid £27000 because that was the only way they could find someone who would take on the job, and then she left unable to take it after 3 months. They called me offering me £9.50 an hour to do a specified list of tasks (at last) but by that time I just wanted shot of the place so I refused.

YY flopsy. I have managed to move to project work now though. But absolutely no way would I do the EA's job in my current org. Not for all the tea in China!

They tried to get me to minute an exec board meeting when the EA was off once because of my PA skillz which they were aware of but I have not used there. It is totally not within the remit of my role. Luckily it was on my non working day so I said I had plans I couldn't change.

I've come to the conclusion that it's just not worth it. SE here. I was earning £25k in 2001 and £30k in 2008. There are very few jobs that are paying £30k+ but they ask for the earth and often entail looking after multiple directors.

Oh, and 'Director' = most demanding person in the company. They seem to forget that one director = 100% of my time, 2 directors = 50% of my time, 3 directors = 33%........ So if you add in Barney, Chuck, Doris, Eric, the Christmas Party, unjamming the photocopier and the other million and one tasks then NO, I am not always going to be able to jump when you click your fingers....

Yes, project management is definitely the way to go. Same skillset, less bullshit but much higher salary probably because it's a job men do....

It also seems if u have a degree, you would be able to do the job better, then someone who actually has the experience. I'm sorry but I have not had a good experience with recruiters. No phone calls or emails or even applying direct to a company NOTHING. All it takes is a simple e-mail to say you have not made it this time, but keep trying. Or something along them lines.