To expect tax avoidance to be treated in the same way as benefit fraud

[speedymama]

Does the govt put as much emphasis on clamping down rich folk who avoid paying taxes as they do on targetting benefit fraudsters?

I ask this because of the current advertising campaign against benefit cheats. I personally think it is just as wrong and in some ways more immoral, for those you can pay more tax but don't to get away with it because they can afford to get round all the loopholes.

Just want to add that benefit fraud is wrong too and should be dealt with accordingly. It just appears to me that society treats benefit cheats with more disdain than those who deliberately seek ways of avoiding to pay tax even though they can afford to pay it, e.g. residents of Monte Carlo who enjoy the trappings of being British.

No, both my parents are Irish. Funnily enough, they both have grave plots there, as have I!

Well assuming that he is Irish born (so his domicile of origin is Irish), and he has had property available to him there most of his life, my understanding is that there are precedents for him to be able to claim Irish domicile (despite the deemed UK domicile). It does still need appropriate planning and paperwork, but can be done. It reduces the tax issue but doesn't eliminate it as Ireland has Capital Acquisition Tax at 20%.

For someone moving to Spain or France the position is more difficult as they typically won't have domicle of origin in those countries, and they pretty much have to sever all ties with the UK. But Ireland tends to be treated differently though I'm afriad I can't name case precedent.

My parents are in a similar position and have arranged their affairs under 2 wills, one covering Irish property, and the other UK property (complete with the rather familiar nil band discretionary loan trust).

If I CAT you, Ladymuck, would you be prepared to tell me which solicitors/accountants your parents have used to do their tax planning?

Cloudhopper - there are still plenty of people leaving the country because of the tax rates alas. It is only a haven if you are not from the UK and don't earn much in the UK.

I can enquire!

Thanks!

True, ladymuck. As I said, they have really clamped down on the tax advantages of being self employed and have squeezed a lot of the flexibility out of having a business, for UK residents.

I am sure that people with the choice to do so will move abroad, taking their wealth with them. Whether the people moving away are being driven out or tempted elsewhere is a moot point though.

We don't seem to have any trouble attracting dodgy Russian oligarchs

I don't buy it that the tax burden in the UK is unfavourable compared to many other comparable nations. Why are we attracting so much investment from overseas companies, individuals etc?

Did anyone see that Money Programme called "What makes Britain rich?". Britain is rich because of the growing economy that is buoyed by the fact that our favourable tax laws attracts foreign money (private and corporate). Why do you think the likes of Phillip Green operate out of Britain rather than France or Germany?

Those here who don't want to pay their income tax are just plain greedy and selfish.

I do one very wealthy person (i mean welathy wealthy- he's not British but main residence is in the uk) and he said that people are leaving the UK because of tax and taking their businesses with them (he was in Barbados I think and said it was crawling with Brits who said they were leaving because of tax laws). From the point of view of someone on a normal salary it might seem churlish, but if they're going they're going and I don't think that's particularly good.

I do resent dh paying 40% tax- but because he really doesn't seem to be a high earner - we still get tax credits for example. 40% seems too much given that 3 times his salary would buy a 2 bedroom terraced house with no parking and no garden (and we're nowhere near the south east). And we've never been able to access the services ds1 needs (until he went special school) so have ended up having to pay for stuff that should be state provided.

Speedy - UK tax system is full of anomalies. My DH has recently been presented with a tax bill for £15,000 ... on self-employed earnings of just over £33,000. The explanation for this is long and complicated but grrrr grrrr grrrr at the likes of Branson, Green et al getting away with it. And didn't I hear somewhere that Bono with his holier than thou reputation the worst culprit of all?

Bloody hell twois- that's crazy.

Those are overseas investors though speedy- not UK based ones. Sounds from reading on here that they're taxed differently.

JimJams, I do think it is crazy that people who are eligible for tax credits are in the same tax bracket as the rich . That is an example of our inequitable tax system which is skewed to favour the rich.

Twoisenougth, yikes! There has to be more to that tax bill than we are party to though.

Nothing to hide re. DH's tax. He earned £33,000 profits self employed April 04 to February 05. In February 05 he ceased self employment and took a PAYE job. In order to calculate his tax due now the revenue added together both his self employed earnings and A WHOLE YEAR of PAYE earnings, making it look like he'd earned close to £120,000 in one year, and taxed him on that. When in fact he'd earned £120,000 over 22 months. £85,000 of that was PAYE on which he paid tax through the normal system like everyone else.

Twoisenoughmum, I think that Bono (and other muscians/artists) doesn't pay very much tax because in Ireland artists don't pay tax on income from their art, so his royalties are not subject to tax but any other income/investment is taxable. It's been like that for as long as I can remember, and on the whole I think it's a good idea as the vast majority of artists struggle to make a living, so their tax contribution would be low anyway but the loss to the cultural heritage of the country if they left the country would be greater than the loss of tax. Although, obviously any sort of art vs. money calculation is very subjective. I did read in the papers a few years ago that the Irish govt is thinking of changing this so that the very high earners do pay more tax. If it does change it'll be interesting to see whether Bono still lives in Ireland or suddenly develops a need to leave in a tax haven.