to ask if anyone knows anything about buying diamonds?

[Skyblue79]

Which would you say is the rip off here?

Can it be possible that a particular diamond ring in Boodles can be priced at almost 4 times the cost of what appears to be exactly the same ring in another London shop which supposedly buys directly from the wholesaler? The less expensive retailer claims the diamonds have the same carat, cut and clarity and come with a GIA certificate (presumably though these can be faked)?

I would obviously expect a mark-up when buying from somewhere like Boodles or Tiifany, but can they really charge 4 times what a ring is worth elsewhere? Or is the other ring likely to be of a lesser quality than it claims?

My ring.

My husband recently bought me a cushion cut solitaire that's 3.2 carats, ideal cut, excellent symmetry, no fluorescence, F VS2. It's GIA certified, and while it wasn't exactly cheap, the same ring from Cartier would be three times the price. I think much has to do with brand name, the craftsmanship of the jewellers at these places, and the fact that your ring will be set in a branded setting.

Thankyou Matilda. I know Wimbledon well - will pm!

Yep they can easily charge 4x the price - marketing in action...

I have a ring from this company here. They were lovely. They have an office near Hatton Garden and you can go in and view rings, look at different qualities of diamond - cut, colour etc.

Lovely FanSpam - thanks!

Skyblue I doubt the diamonds in the ring style you showed are certificated. Usually diamonds are only certificated if they are standalone e.g. the main diamond in an engagement ring and they are reasonably big (0.5 carat+).

If that's the case I'd go with the ring that looks the best in person irrespective of cost. Look out for things like how solid/substantial it feels and the finish.

Sorry, meant to say don't place loads of emphasis on relative price, but rather if you think the Hatton Gardens ring is well-made then there's no reason to pay Boodles prices.

I echo the posters saying go to an independant wholesaler and setter. DH had my ring made in this way, he was heavily involved in designing it and paid 1.5K at the time, it's valued at almost 5K though.

Thanks everybody - feel more equipped to ask the right questions now.

Friend of mine used to work for Boodles. They were all trained to use Neuro Linguistic Programming in order to make the customer spend more.

Try here Samara James Diamond Rings I had this ring pave set on the "bars" and it looks amazing.

They don't have that one on their website but they do a free consultation and tell you ALL you need to know about diamonds - then you can decide yourself and look at all the options. They have loads of videos explaining it all too if you don't have time to go in.

There is a massive mark up in Boodles, Cartier, Tiffany etc. You will get less for money but you will get the brand name and box, if that's important to you.
Not sure how much research you've done, so apologies if you know all this, but if something appears to be too good to be true elsewhere it often is. You can, for example, get a much larger stone if it's clarity enhanced. Important thing to look for is excellent cut. I'm sure you know about colour, fluorescence, clarity etc.
I too would recommend Quality Diamonds in Hatton Garden. You have to make an appointment and it's a very calm environment. They are experts and will talk you through everything. As they source the right diamond for your budget they aren't trying to flog you specific rings. One of the guys, Paul, started in the trade after going through the experience of trying to find a ring for his fiancé. We bought mine there after looking in loads of shops, including the big names. Boodles quoted £11500 for a tiny diamond. A rip off in my opinion. Hope this helps you because I know it's a stressful process! Good luck!

The copyright of that design is owned by Boodles, so you are buying what is effectively a knock off.

Up to you whether you are happy with that.

I'll be honest and say that if I saw it on your finger, I wouldn't be able to tell the difference, but it is very recognisably a Boodles design. People may comment along the lines of 'Oooh, lovely Waterfall ring!' whereupon you'd have to fess up to having a fake.

I wouldn't, but then I don't buy cheap copies of designer bags/sunglasses either.

...and the '4Cs' are just the very basics, there are so many other characteristics of diamonds that affect its quality (pavilion, table, symmetry, culet etc) .

2 diamonds with identical '4Cs' can still be very different in character, and hence value...

...and the '4Cs' are just the very basics, there are so many other characteristics of diamonds that affect its quality (pavilion, table, symmetry, culet etc)

The examples you have given are the qualities of the cut surely 🤔

They're trying to push the 5th C (certification) now, but I'm not sure it's really taken off...

Very confusing business, that's for sure! Thanks again.

It's definitely just the name/marketing. When I got my wedding (new, custom made to antique style) & engagement (antique) rings, the jeweller suggested we go to one of the posh jewellers on a well known lane of posh jewellers around the corner, pick out DH's wedding ring, write down the spec and come back to him. In the posh jeweller, the plain platinum band was €2k (!!!) but when the guy who sold me my rings had it made for us, it was €600.

Any jeweller worth his salt should easily be able to replicate a Diamonds By The Yard style necklace, which is what I would really like...

Any jeweller worth his salt should easily be able to replicate a Diamonds By The Yard style necklace, which is what I would really like...

This is a breach of copyright though, the design is by Paloma Picasso and (I believe) Tiffany & Co own the rights.

I'm genuinely surprised this is seen as quite so acceptable tbh; its theft, plain and simple yet (I presume) otherwise law-abiding and decent people seem quite happy to go along with it

Do you also buy knock off handbags etc from market stalls?

...and what would you say if someone complimented you on it? Lie? Own up to copyright theft?

It paints you in a very bad light either way...

Before choosing my engagement ring, hubby to be sent me to Harry Winston on Bond Street to take a look at designs and try some on to decide on how big/what cut the diamond should be to suit me. Honestly, I nearly had a heart attack (good thing I was sat down!) when I was told some of the prices! I then spoke to a friend of mine who is a jeweller, PM me if you want details, and they sourced the diamonds and made my ring. Harry Winston came in at almost 4 times as much for the same size, colour, carat etc. diamonds!! I could not be happier, they will soon be making my and hubby to be's wedding rings.

So yes, they can mark up because of the branding!

Estate agent - well I'm not sure to be honest. I know that the Boodles Raindance and waterfall rings are "design classics" and apparently in a museum. But then I think, a diamond of the same quality and appeal is just that - so why pay and exorbitant amount?
But no, I don't buy rip-off handbags
Anyway, DH might have already got it. It was DD who let it slip yesterday about "rain rings", so I'd googled it and the price variations online had got me wondering.

It's theft though. Intellectual property is just as much a thing as physical property and is protected in law in a similar way.

I'm sure you would't dream of shoplifting or similar, yet buying what are effectively stolen goods is perfectly ok.

If you were in the market for, say a TV, would you see a difference in buying one from a shop, or a clearly stolen one off the back of a lorry? They have the same 'quality and appeal...so why pay the exorbitant price?'

If everybody buys ripped off jewellery, the incentive for firms like Boodles/Tiffany etc to come up with design classics will disappear and the world of design will be the worse for it.

It's your jewellery, and your choice at the end of the day, but if someone in my life admitted that they had done this just because they wanted the design, but were too tight to actually pay for it, I would reassess my opinion of that person.

Estate - I'm not sure I take the issue as seriously as all that. "Design classics" influence and filter down through just about everything -fashion, furniture, technology, you name it. I definitely take your point though and you got me thinking!
I have a few things from Tiffany, inc from the Paloma Picasso collection which I love, but it wouldn't bother me at all if someone had very similar items from elsewhere.