to not let five-year-old child go on school trip into central London

[Blueflowers2011]

as title says, Year 1 (age 5 mostly) are going on a trip into London, which consists of 30 children and supervising adults travelling on 1 rail train, interchange to 1 underground tube train then a 20 min walk when they get to the other side to visit a shop.

A couple of parents are now saying they are not allowing their child to go which is also confirming my thoughts initially, which btw is mostly due to anything happening in London in general.

I have worked in London all my life and it's bad enough travelling on the tube everyday as an adult, let alone a 5 yr old child. Many parents also feel it's an unneccassary trip at this age just to visit a shop and how it works.

I encourage most things and experiences for my children but just feel this one is a bit too much for a 5 yr old. Am I worrying too much or should I just let them go?

I take rural brownies to London once a year on the train, on the tube to the museums (and back).
They are 7-10 years old. Line up in pairs, don't walk in front of me or behind X. Other adults walking alongside the group. I do label them with my mobile number but we've never lost one. We have risk assessments and adult:child ratios and the children are told what to do if they get separated from the group (none ever have).
OP I understand your concerns: check with the school what risk assessments /safety measures they have in place before you make your decision. They may have thought of a way round all your worries.

Crappest school trip I ever went on was to Runnymede, where Magna Carta was signed. At the time, it was an empty field like any other field!

Tower of London was good though. Actually those are the only two we ever had in primary, apart from one to put wreaths on gravestones for Remembrance Day because a TV crew were turning up.

In secondary it was more a question of how fast we could cooperate to do the obligatory quiz before sneaking off to a different pub to the teachers...

Tesco is all about where food comes from, meat is made of animals, eggs from chickens, carrots from the ground not on trees, let's grow some stuff, and we support UK farmers and are wonderful (and free food is always good!)

My favouritist ever school trip was to Rome when I was 17 MissHooliesCardigan. There also was quite a memorable pony trek in the Brecon Beacons when I was 15

Yes when my DCs did the Toys topic at school they went to the Museum of Childhood.

I hadn't realised people found London so scary. I live in outer London and my DCs have done loads of trips into London with school. It's really not a big deal. The tube is exciting for children! Going on public transport is all part of the experience.
If its your DC you are worried about - I know what you mean because DS is away with the fairies so I have volunteered on his trips quite a lot just because I know what he is like, but for my sensible DD I didn't worry so much.

Re school trips - I have been on lots of them and yes teachers have to do risk assessments. Our teachers often do the trip on their own beforehand to work out the best routes, get the timings right etc. Why don't you tell school parents are concerned, and ask to see see the risk assessment?

Also Hamleys is not a 20 minute walk from Oxford Circus - 10 minutes at most. They are probably allowing 20 minutes to allow time to cross roads etc so it won't be 20 minutes of walking.

Citrus Are the children allowed to eat in the supermarket? Isn't that rather uncouth? Won't it attract rats?
(Sorry, reference to a recent thread claiming that people eating in supermarkets signals the end of civilisation).

I put my first born in a nursery near Soho, as I worked nearby, gorgeous nursery, prices eye watering. One day I saw her opposite Oxford Street, as I was walking to get my lunch. She was happy, in a double buggy with her best friend. I thought for two nano seconds, how odd, but smiled inwardly because she was obviously being taken care of. They had had a picnic in Soho Square.

I have driven my precious two daughters through North London to go to friends. Not a blink of an eye.

I felt very vulnerable though whilst heavily pregnant and travelling on the tube. I wanted no harm to come to the babies who were inside me.

We all went on school trips back in the day on London transport, sometimes two classes, sometimes one. My God sons, dcs and dns all still go on school trips on London transport now. Nothing has ever happened. It's nice for the kids, just not as nice for other passengers.

limited Some of us get to go to Rome. Others get to go to Bracknell.

Surely that's a paraphrase of

Cardigan - I think the Tesco trips have a bit done in a back room somewhere, or a cordoned-off bit of the cafe, after going up and down aisles spotting stuff, but haven't actually gone on one myself.
Ds got to go on a trip to a farm in Reception which covered pretty much the same stuff and a Cow Did A BIG POO! So obviously far better than a supermarket!

My ds used to go to nursery in the city of london and we commuted in train and tube every day together for two years.

MissHooliesCardigan we also went to a sewage works when I was at primary school. Our school didn't do anything too fun. It was normally a yearly visit to exactly the same (rather tame) zoo, so this was quite a diversion! I'm sure there was no actual reason to go - no school topic or anything. Probably the teacher was friends with someone there - it seemed to work like that in those days.

I remember the smell, of course, but aside from that I remember walking through all the different treatment areas and being pretty fascinated. It was the 1970s, so no risk assessments, either. I'm sure any one of us could have fallen/ been pushed in!

It wouldn't have been my choice of trip at the time but nearly 40 years on I remember it clear as anything.

DD2 went to tescos with brownies and came back with museli she'd made and activity books and stickers, easy recipe cards etc - apparently enjoyed it...
Tescos also paid towards the cost of a coach for them (we are semi rural -no public transport there that wouldn't have taken a couple of hours). Normally we would get parents to take them but they had been on a few trips and the fact that half the cost was paid meant we could give them a break....
They also went to Pets at Home and apparently found it a bit dull ...even though they thought it would be more exciting...
I think big companies like that get probably would get some tax advantage or something for doing education visits as well as good PR...
I never personally went on a school trip using public transport (I went on one at 6th form college - took 7hrs and 4 train changes...a nightmare) but probably cos we were pretty rural and also I guess coaches were cheaper...and we went on ones that were a couple of hours coach ride away at primary...no needing to be back by 3pm...
I went on some great trips at secondary - I did an outdoor pursuit thing so plenty of camping, canoeing, rock climbing etc.
But I also did an alternative science o level thing and we went on geology field trips - into caves (disused mines) and looking at fossils etc. But the one I remember best was to a nuclear re-processing plant. We had to get suited up with the reactive badges that check for radiation exposure levels and we were checked with a Gieger counter before we left....the thing that had the biggest impact was the massive red and white signs that said if the alarm sounded to run (yes RUN) to the nearest exit -you had 30 secs (iirc) to get out out before it was sealed and you would be sealed in....also we were told about reaction speeds to an alarm going off and discussion about the benefits of having a constant noise that stopped rather than a sudden sound which makes you jump and react more slowly...not sure how I'd feel now about my 14-15yo DD going on that one -but it was exciting and memorable (or in fact scrabbling around in disused mines...this was late 70s/early 80s I think they wouldn't be 'allowed' to do similar now -risk assessed or not ...)

I live in Greater London, and I understand your concerns, and I think you are right to want to double check the arrangements with the school especially with regards to ratios and travelling on public transport, but as long as they are reasonable I think he should go. If 7 children aren't going that means less kids to be looked after anyway! It sounds like the train journey is meant to be a big part of the trip.

My son's school only visits very local environmental centres in year R and year 1, and by coach so no chance of kids wandering far. Year 2 was to a zoo, and the ratio for each group was a very sensible 2 adults with 6 kids. I hope your school has similar.

We live in Zone 4 in London and the kids have been to numerous trips into London. I personally think it's more risky to go on the minibus with no proper car seats than the tube!

The weirdest trips in our school has been Tesco and Pizza Express. In pizza express they didn't get to eat the pizza they made and didn't get to do the dough. They basically put some cheese on top of already prepared bases! Oh well, they got to take the cold pizza home at least

My 4 year old took the school bus alone every day and back. I don't think it's a bad thing for them to take trips like this. Also it gets them seeing the wider world, negotiating the tube etc. I often see groups of children on the tube and at stations and the teachers are very good at keeping them all together. We live in outer London so the children are often in and out.

I'm amazed at the number of people on this thread who seem to think that teachers don't do any advance planning for trips. No planned learning objectives and outcomes, no risk assessment, no consideration of appropriate adult/pupil ratios, no recce of the route and activity, no planning of follow up work. Do people really think all those things won't have been planned down to the smallest detail?

A friend who is a teacher always does the trip herself in advance of taking a group of pupils. And always in her own time.

The most useful thing a parent can do, I think, is make sure their child knows their name and address and the name of their school, and can repeat it clearly to an adult if necessary.

My DC go into London on trips lots with school. If they're travelling by tube a member of staff accompany them and they get on the first carriage when the train arrives, the guard then waits until they are all safely on. When getting off they all wait by wall until other passengers have cleared. Most other commuters choose other carriages when boarding because of the racket they cause, so more seats for the kids. YABU

Sorry did I misunderstand you? They are doing this trip to visit a shop??

As a secondary teacher, I would be hesitant about taking a class of students to central London, not just now, at any time. It's a huge responsibility. As a parent there's no way I'd allow my five year old to go, for various reasons. If they're going to visit a shop, why can't they do what one of my children's classes did in reception, and visit the local shops??

This thread has given me a giggle! We are from the depths of Scotland and my DC love visiting London and love the tube! We never find it 'unpleasant' or 'daunting' it's just a train in a tunnel which is slightly more exciting than a train over ground to them! And an organised class trip to hamleys sounds cool!

Notquite, I'd not fancy taking a class of secondary students on such a trip either but a class of 5 year olds no probs.

I went along as a helper last week to take 60 seven year-olds to the Natural History Museum. School is in central London but was a 15 minute walk and two tube lines. School parties can't travel during rush hour and TfL have people to help at all the stations.

The kids were all beautifully behaved (teachers have perfected stare of death) and no-one got lost or left behind or hurt.

They've been doing these trips since Nursery and the children all live in London so that may make it a bit easier I suppose.

FWIW, DD and I have commuted to school since she was 4 and take the tube at rush hour and I've never worried.

Why not volunteer as a helper?

I'm a horribly anxious parent so understand where you are coming from, but I am shocked that so many would stop their child going on a school trip involving the tube. I live in London and get the tube everywhere so I worry far more about coach journeys on motorways than I would about school trips on the tube. School trips are usually great fun for the children - even if whatever they are doing doesn't sound that marvellous to us as parents - and I think it's sad to be a child left in the classroom when everyone else is out doing something because your parents are worried about you.

I'm sure the school will have risk assessed this thoroughly and there will be plenty of teachers and a robust plan in place.

What an odd thread London isn't scary, your own fears shouldn't be passed on to your kids, I've seen loads of school trips on the tube. All the kids wear fluorescent jackets like they do on a building site, so they're easier to spot, some schools have their logo printed on them including contact details should a child get lost, teachers do head counts before boarding a tube and when they're all on, TFL staff are on hand to warn the driver to not speed off, and they always wait for a tube that isn't as packed to get on (time permitting)