Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Not to pay my landlord?

84 replies

BeauMirchoff · 07/10/2016 23:09

If I'm BU, please fire away! But...
DH and I are renting and because we've outgrown the property (two young children), we've decided to move. We gave our landlord one month's notice on 1 October. We pay our rent every 10th. My understanding is that we now have to pay rent for the period of 10 October - 1 November. However, landlord is asking for the whole rent..? So until 10 November! And he says he'll give us back the difference when we move out...Confused Surely we shouldn't be paying for the 9 days we're already going to be living somewhere else? And he should just calculate NOW what we have to pay exactly? We did give one month's notice, as required in the contract. AIBU not to pay the whole amount? It's such a bizarre request!

OP posts:
froubylou · 08/10/2016 08:50

This works both ways! If the lL wanted to give the tenant notice he would have to give 2 months notice in line with eother the end of the tenancy on a fixed term contract or the rent due date for a periodic tenancy. So if the rent due date was the 4th of the month, 2 months notice has to be issued before the 4th to expire 2 months later. If he served it on the 5th of the month he would have to give 2 months and 30 days notice potentially.

It is irrelevant what is in the tenancy agreement, notice periods are defined by the law which over rides tenancy agreements.

The ll is within his rights to ask for the full months rent. I suspect he will probably refund the extra days when he checks out the tenant and the property is in good order. If he doesn't get the keys back on the agreed date he would then have to recover the monies owed. Which would be a pita. It's not as easy as just deducting it from the deposit as it will be protected.

HereIAm20 · 08/10/2016 09:10

You do realise that your new LL will be asking for a reference from your current Landlord. Do you really want that reference to include a note saying they are being difficult over paying their final month's rent?

It is usual for the notice period to end on a rent due date.

Your LL has said he will refund you 1-10 November after you leave. However, he is protecting himself against the scenario where you might not move out when you said.

As a LL I am always a bit flexible and where a tenant has given prior warning eg. tenant has said that I will be leaving sometime in September or October it will depend when my new job starts I then took 3 months' actual notice of when they were going and charged 3/4 rent because I was already aware. Other times I have taken rent for full notice period but if tenant has moved out and I get a new tenant in early (popular flat in popular area!) then I give a rebate.

limon · 08/10/2016 09:30

All rental contracts I've had (3 in last 6 years) require notice on rent day - so yours is possibly the same.

teacher54321 · 08/10/2016 09:39

We rented for 12 years and lived in 8 properties in that time. We always had to give notice on a rent day. Twice we gave 6 weeks notice to move out mid rental period. Once we paid the last months rent up front and they refunded the last two weeks to us as your LL is suggesting. Once they calculated a daily rate for the extra two weeks and we paid that. I think YABU.

ConvincingLiar · 08/10/2016 09:52

If you don't have to give notice from your rent day than I'd calculate the daily rate and pay the right amount.

Bestthingever · 08/10/2016 09:53

Op I'm not being rude. I just think if your contract says four weeks notice, then you pay four weeks. If your landlord tried to get away with giving less notice than you were entitled to, how would you feel? As said previously, it works both ways.

QuintessentialShadow · 08/10/2016 09:54

he is telling us to pay for those days now but he'll return that difference at the end.

Maybe your rent is covering his mortgage on the flat, and he is a little short without your rent money, but he reckons he can "borrow" from you and pay it back later when he might have other funds, like his salary, coming in?

Not saying he is right to do so, but it may be his reasoning.

specialsubject · 08/10/2016 10:16

England/wales, rolling tenancy : gov.uk refers to shelter (!) Who say 4 weeks notice ending with tenancy period, unless tenancy agreement says something else.

So what does the agreement say?

Spam88 · 08/10/2016 10:33

If your tenancy agreement doesn't specify that notice is four weeks from rent date, as you've said it doesn't, then I would just work out what you owe and pay that, that's what I've done in the past. I really wouldn't trust a landlord to return the money you're owed without a lot of chasing on your part.

MrsKoala · 08/10/2016 10:38

Whenever i have rented it has always been rent day to rent day. (which would have been the day of the month you moved in). If we have given our months notice earlier than that it has been automatic that the months notice is from the rent day to the following rent day.

We are now LLs and expect the same. I think it's U to give a months notice at and arbitrary date in the month and then expect to calculate the remaining days.

user1471545174 · 08/10/2016 10:46

Can you just move out on 9 November instead of 1 November?

Soontobenewmummy · 08/10/2016 10:53

I had exactly the same thing - gave correct notice but moved out mid rent cycle (with LL's agreement) but he still wanted full months rent - I paid the amount for the time we would be there but he insisted he needed the full month and would refund us difference. I thought it was a bit odd but went along with it as he'd always been a decent LL and he was true to his word - refunded difference very quickly. This was entirely separate to our deposit.

Thinking about PPs - perhaps allowing a tenant to move out mid month is at the LL discretion, so they take the full months rent in case the next tenants fall through?

Shiningexample · 08/10/2016 11:00

Maybe your rent is covering his mortgage on the flat, and he is a little short without your rent money, but he reckons he can "borrow" from you and pay it back later when he might have other funds
You're probably right, another clueless landlord who didn't do his sums and will be up shit creek without a paddle when the new legislation comes into effect

Shiningexample · 08/10/2016 11:04

I have lived in many rented properties, 10 or 15 at a rough guess and never had to tie the notice period in with when the rent was due

evilkitten · 08/10/2016 11:59

It used to be the case a few years ago that notice could only be given on a rent day. This changed following a challenge in court (Spencer vs. Taylor) in 2014. As long as you've given the required notice, then you should only be paying rent to the end of the tenancy.

thecatneuterer · 08/10/2016 12:21

evilkitten I was under the impression that Spencer v Taylor was only relevant to the Section 21 notice served by LLs, which changed as a consequence. The NLA section 21 was changed following this, but section 4.2.2 of the NLA contract refering to tenants' notice period under a periodic tenancy was not changed.

If you think this is not the case can you please link to the relevant document showing where the normal tenant notice period changed as a result of this ruling. (It's not that I ever enforce it myself, as I said, I'm happy to pro-rata the rent if necessary - it's just out of academic interest)

thecatneuterer · 08/10/2016 14:57

What does your contract say OP?

Original poster
BeauMirchoff · 08/10/2016 17:31

This is what my tenancy agreement says:

Not to pay my landlord?
OP posts:
thecatneuterer · 08/10/2016 17:33

Fine then. Four weeks is four weeks. The LL is wrong and you are right.

PinkyOfPie · 08/10/2016 17:35

As others have said you ideally should leave on a rent due date or pay up until then it's in standard AST contracts

thecatneuterer · 08/10/2016 17:36

But Pinky it seems the OP doesn't in fact have a standard AST contract. In fact it looks at lot like one the LL has written himself.

thecatneuterer · 08/10/2016 17:37

Oh and clause 7 of that agreement is in fact unlawful as LLs must by law give two months notice to the tenant, not one.

PinkyOfPie · 08/10/2016 17:39

Ah feck just seen that post, the one for my tenant is completely different, ignore me!

PinkyOfPie · 08/10/2016 17:43

This is what my tenant's says (although I have never enforced it with a tenant) anything like that wording OP?

Not to pay my landlord?
StrumpersPlunkett · 08/10/2016 17:45

Yabu. It's a months notice from the day you pay your rent.