to get annoyed when a home schooling parent...

[00100001]

... can't spell?

My SIL home schools her daughter.

But all the time, she is posting "I just thort of a new idea..." or "We just need to get threw this..." or ^"I love home schoolling" etc.

Just makes me twitch.

I think this thread has been very informative and useful. I expect my daughter would have done much better if I could have done home ed. I would have been focusing my time on her education but I needed a paid job.

'done home ed', before the pedants jump - home educated her!

I get annoyed with the old chestnut of 'what about socialisation'

Why do you find it baffling that others manage to do something that you cannot?

Because teaching is what I do, but I only teach certain subjects. I am surprised that so many people who have no teacher training or experience at all are confident that they can home ed their children in the full range of subjects. I think that if I were to do it, the necessary research in my non-specialist subjects on top of the actual educating time would take literally all my waking hours and still not really be enough.

So anything you can't do, nobody else can do? Could you win the Olympics? Do brain surgery? If you can't, I guess that means nobody else can?

What a ridiculous notion.

She's making a reasonable point, though. She's a trained teacher - most home edders are not. She's had years of experience, those home edders who are not trained teachers obviously won't have the experience.

She's simply saying that the amount of time it would take to research the subjects, plus plan the lessons, would mean there would be no time to teach.

I do think that's a reasonable point. Most people have something they're good at. Most people don't necessarily have the contacts who are free on a weekly basis and have the knowledge and the skills to impart that knowledge in the right way.

I'm always shocked that people can just decide to HE, when they might not be capable of delivering/arranging an education for others.

And I've never understood the lack of checking that goes on. On a previous thread there were a lot of home edders who were saying they shouldn't be subject to any checks whatsoever.

But the key is that a teacher has to teach because they may have 30 individuals in front of them. So they have to differentiate, be accountable to parents/the school/Ofsted etc. None of that can be said for a home educating parent. They only have their children, who they know better than anyone else. They don't need 6 hours' worth of resources and behaviour management techniques for each day because the same issues don't arise, and they can do things to suit their family's needs.

So you can't compare the job of a teacher to that of a He parent IMO.

I think the issue of checks is merely that what would you check for? In comparison to what? National Curriculum wouldn't make sense. Similarly, many families feel that no other area of parenting is checked up on with no cause for concern...Social services aren't allowed to just turn up and check you are feeding and clothing your children etc, they only respond to reported concerns.

Nooo. There are gazillions of things that other people can do which I can't. I am bloody hopeless at all sorts of things at which other people are impressively awesome. Whereas this is something I AM trained to do in certain subjects but other people with no training at all seem to be happy to do in ALL subjects with no training whatsoever. It's more like saying "I'm a trained brain surgeon, but I wouldn't attempt heart surgery, and I'm a bit surprised that some people with no medical training think they are able to do diy surgery on any part of anyone's body". Disclaimer: I appreciate that home edding doesn't have the same potentially life or death consequences as surgery.

It is really just the same "concerns" being said over and over again, without any basis in fact.

The law states that parents (not schools, not councils) are responsible for their children's education. We can opt to put them in school, or we can educate them elsewhere (such as home).

Perhaps when the government and schools provide better support for children with SNs and disabilities the number of home educated children will drop again. The way it's going, that's not looking likely. If schools took bullying more seriously right across the board, perhaps less parents would need to make the decision to home educate. Again, that doesn't seem likely to happen, as it certainly hasn't happened so far.

The mind boggling thing is that the government and the schools see more and more children moving to home education, and their reaction is to blame it on abuse and radicalisation, instead of recognising that actually a lot of it is due to schools failing many many children more and more.

Can I hug you, Ginger (in an unmumsnetty way?)

My son went to as school where, quite frankly, they through they were the best thing since sliced bread and no parent's opinion could trump their 'expertise'. My son was falling further and further behind and was being bullied to boot and for 18 months the only individuals responsible for his academic decline and his social isolation were...guess who? Yup, me the parent and my son who obviously was inviting the bullying.

3 years on he's on track to take several GCSE's at aged 13.

You haven't said anything different there, Eo. It's kind of projecting, just because you couldn't do it... Obviously home educators, teachers or not, have been and are managing to do just that. They might not personally teach (or facilitate, before I'm pulled up and corrected ) all subjects, but manage it they do.

And I don't think PGCE would be particularly useful, or should I say essential, for a home educating parent either.

Good points, Witsender.

Glad to hear that, banty!

I mostly agree about the PGCE actually, although some of the actual pedagogical methodology would probably be useful.

And yes, you are right, I am making an assumption about others, based on what I know of myself, my profession and the many children I've taught (including the fair few I've taught who have previously been home educated). I just think it's probably a fairly reasonable assumption in many cases. Just because a parent has reasons why they don't want their child to attend school (however justified those reasons may be), that doesn't mean that parent will be a good home educator for their child.

With the greatest of respect, teaching isn't rocket science. Teaching 30 different individuals is considerably harder, but home ed parents don't do that.

...and have options available to them tat may well not be available within a cash-strapped institution...

I have seen letters from school teachers a bit like that! - and they are getting paid!

I would say spelling isn't the most important thing a child can learn.
People home ed for all sorts of reasons, some of them good some of them less good.

Children at school can learn far worse things than bad spelling.

I'm a teacher with 20 years experience and I wouldn't consider myself able to home ed. I find it baffling that so many people do it tbh.

Is that maybe because you're imagining home ed as being like school but at home? Because in most families it isn't. Home educating families are required to provide a 'suitable' education, suitable being defined as 'that which equips the learner for life in the community of which he is a member'. How they go about it is upto them.

There is no obligation to follow the national curriculum and most don't. The national curriculum is very broad but very basic, it teaches a bit of everything and a whole lot of nothing. I think most school teachers, or certainly the ones that I know, recognise that much of it is outdated, irrelevant and unfit for purpose and that students retain very little of it long term. Home educating families can focus on what is relevant to their family and specific interests, giving them the opportunity to study things at a great depth and to gain practical experience in their field of interest which can give them the edge over their schooled friends when it comes to applying for uni or work.

Home educators also don't have to teach subjects individually and many don't, finding that one topic or interest encompasses many different subjects. Yes, when it comes to taking gcses (which many home educated children do and do very well) it may then be necessary to refer back to the national curriculum or embark on more formal study, but most families find they can master the material needed in a few months.

I home educate and I couldn't do what you do. I would never be able to teach your subjects in as much depth as you can. In fact I do very little teaching. What I do do is facilitate - I ask a lot of questions, I make suggestions, I encourage discussion, I provide access to resources, I expose my child to as many ideas and topics and opportunities as I can, and I seek out mentors. If they show an interest in something which is beyond my scope to teach then I find someone who can. Home educated children attend activity groups, workshops and classes, some go to tutor groups, some have private tutors, some have mentors, some learn through books or online websites, some do volunteer work. The options are endless.

There's very little research comparing home educated children to school kids, most of it is anecdotal, though i'm happy to report that all the home educated children I have known who are now grown did very well academically, have thriving social lives and are all gainfully employed. One of the few studies there are comparing them to school children suggests that what determines whether or not a home ed child will thrive is not the parent's level of education but their level of commitment. I haven't yet found any interest my child has or anything my child could experience in school that I can't provide for equally well or better through home ed.

Interestingly, teachers seem to fall into one of two canps when it comes to home ed - some are totally baffled by it, can't see how it could possibly work and disapprove completely, and others totally get it, think it's brilliant and wish that schools were able to adopt more home edding principles. An estimated 40% of home educating parents are ex teachers (i think its very telling that so many people with direct first hand experience of the school system dont want it for their own children), and funnily enough despite their teaching experience most don't teach in a school like way but follow the more infornal approach described above.

I think that if I were to do it, the necessary research in my non-specialist subjects on top of the actual educating time would take literally all my waking hours and still not really be enough.

If you're talking about A' Level, then yes, I would agree, I would only be able to do justice to certain subjects, personally. GCSE and IGCSE level definitely not a problem, however.

Banty so glad to hear your son is doing well. My dcs have definitely progressed much better in the last two years, so I'm quite happy to continue home educating. It's the best choice for us.

I am not a home educator so anyone who is, please feel free to correct me.

My dd did very badly at primary because she is very dyslexic (as am I) and has autistic tendencies. She finds it hard to make friends but she made some great ones at school and was not bullied.

Other kids are not so 'lucky' and can find school a very, very toxic environment. so the first thing home ed does is take a child out of a very toxic, uncomfortable, unpleasant situation (who can really learn anything when they are worried about being picked on, shamed or physically injured?)

Next the home ed environment means your 'teacher' loves you more than just about any other person on the plant and has gone to huge sacrificial levels to cater for your education. Whether they can spell or not, how could this not be a win win if they can actually prepare you educationally?

If they can make up for any bits they cannot supply - such as company, mixing with others, visits, trips out, subjects that they do not know enough about etc. So having put things in place (as my friends who are home educators have done, I am sure) the parent who home educates is in an ideal situation to meet their child's needs.

If people want to waste tax payers money on anything, instead of checking up on devoted parents who home educate, how about checking up on all the poor souls being bullied in school and putting a stop to it?

PS Eolian "Just because a parent has reasons why they don't want their child to attend school (however justified those reasons may be), that doesn't mean that parent will be a good home educator for their child."

But we could turn that statement round so easily and say

-Just because a teacher wants to teach and has had good training (however good that may be), that doesn't mean that teacher will be a good teacher to meet the needs of every child."

My friend's son is on the autistic spectrum and the mum was constantly being called into school to cope with things that happened to do with him. When she started home educating him, all that stopped.

Think about the careers we will all do, some solitary, like being a writer, some outdoors, farmer, some in a big communal office, some manual etc etc. Then think about schools - big or small, rural or urban - most will be a relatively small class where kids are packed in, up to 30 with one teacher and maybe a TA. They will all be doing very similar things. Why would this suit all children or prepare all children for the rest of their lives.

Home educators, please correct me if I have missed the point. (I wish, now, I had had the time and money to consider this for dd but it was not until she was actually out of primary I realized how bad it was for her.)

Hold on.

You're telling me any parent can just willy nilly homeschool their children without any sort of educational testing or similar for the parent to pass before being allowed to do so?

Yikes. I dread to think what's being taught to some children.

Schools are not always great. Especially nowadays, I mean half of societies secondary school children frighten me with their attitude and disrespect- can't always blame the parents either. Peer pressure and copying others is to blame a lot of the time.

I'm in two minds about homeschooling my daughters. Then again I'm just overthinking the downside of being a child at school.