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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think all buy to let people are just in it to get someone else to work to pay off their mortgage?

683 replies

madhurjazz · 03/09/2016 07:13

I wish people would say it as it is. Buy to let in my mind is just about getting someone else that can't afford a deposit / without a stable job to do all the hard work to pay off the mortgage of someone else. It does feel like a massive step backwards in equality.

Very few actually want to rent, the vast majority are stuck doing so as speculation keeps pushing ownership out of reach.

OP posts:
NNChangeAgain · 15/09/2016 10:40

BTL is immoral, you cannot justify it no matter how hard you might try, at least own it even if you don't care.

What is your definition of immoral? Because I couldn't continue to live my life conducting myself in an immoral way - yet you do?

Pisssssedofff · 15/09/2016 10:40

NN the point is they bloody COULD if it wasn't for the competition at the first time buyers price range from btl

Barksdale · 15/09/2016 10:41

I agree with OP.

I think it's disgusting that some people who got lucky in life can buy up a load of houses and LEGALLY SAY: "no DSS, no students, no pets".

In Brighton there's not enough housing so the cheeky cunts demand 6 months rent in advance. If you can't afford it, they pick someone who can.

Just a load of adults with inheritance playing Monopoly at the expense of everyone else.

Oh, and they'll kick you out of their rented flat if their darling first-born decides they want it instead, as happened to my brother at short notice the other week.

Pisssssedofff · 15/09/2016 10:42

I'm extremely uncomfortable with the whole situation NN and as fast as I can will sell my rented out house to the tenants at a price they can afford because I acknowledge I wouldn't have held on to the house had they not rented it from me. And that's how I sleep at night.

Cocklodger · 15/09/2016 10:43

You're assuming we all live in London or somewhere with an equally cramped housing market, aren't you???
South Wales dear. Just last week I saw a flat going for 10k...

Pisssssedofff · 15/09/2016 10:45

Dear ? Is that what your arguments come to ?
If it's £10,000 and wages are £3,000 it's no different from £50,000 salary and being outbid at £200,500 is it ?

Cocklodger · 15/09/2016 10:48

If you can't raise 10k to buy a property, I highly doubt it's BTL that's the problem dear

Puzzledandpissedoff · 15/09/2016 10:49

just because they'd LIKE to own their own home, doesn't mean they CAN

Precisely

We've been down this road before, with sub prime loans and "a blind eye" turned to those who clearly couldn't afford the debt they were taking on - and look where that got us all. I do accept that fewer houses bought for BTL might have some effect on house prices, but very much doubt it would be the magic wand many seem to think

In the meantime there will always be those in a position to afford more than someone else, be that a house, a fancy car, incredible holidays or something else. Sorry, but that's life ...

NNChangeAgain · 15/09/2016 10:50

as fast as I can will sell my rented out house to the tenants at a price they can afford because I acknowledge I wouldn't have held on to the house had they not rented it from me.

What if your tenants don't want to buy your house? Oh, wait - you think you're doing them a favour to appease your conscience, don't you? Do they know that? Did you pick your tenants based on their desire to buy your house?

the point is they bloody COULD if it wasn't for the competition at the first time buyers price range from btl

This just isn't true. The current regulations mean that no matter how "cheap" houses are, some people CAN'T buy. I can't get a mortgage. So you are condemning people like me to a life of homelessness, because all LL are immoral and should not rent out their homes.

Condemn the system all you want - but right now, BTL LL provide an essential service.

Pisssssedofff · 15/09/2016 10:55

My tenants do want to buy my house that was the deal we made from day one so I could sleep at night knowing they have done nothing wrong, are just as deserving of home ownership as me and don't deserve to be trapped in serfdom
The markets rigged, acknowledge that and you'll at least gain some dignity and respect rather than trying to justify the unjustifiable

sofato5miles · 15/09/2016 10:56

Why is it morally right to have ownership of a house to live in?

Cocklodger · 15/09/2016 10:57

The market needs to change. But it's not within my power to change it at all. If I didn't rent to people they'd be homeless not home owners Hmm

Pisssssedofff · 15/09/2016 10:59

Security for your family, settled in the community etc. If you're happy paying £200 every six months to estate agents to have your credit file which is free online looked at, if you like packing up every 6-12 months hiring a van etc moving in and out of school catchments I guess that's an option for you oh and you get to provide a pension for some body else too - go you !!

Pisssssedofff · 15/09/2016 11:00

Cock, don't buy any more then. That's within your power.

NNChangeAgain · 15/09/2016 11:10

My tenants do want to buy my house that was the deal we made from day one

So you deliberately excluded people like me, who can't get a mortgage, from renting your home from you? Why did you not sell it to them for a loss rather than rent it out to them?
Doesn't sound like that moral high ground is particularly high after all Hmm

WeatherwaxOrOgg · 15/09/2016 11:17

Where do you think the money comes from for banks to lend to people who want mortgages??

Yes, savers. The bank takes money from savers and pays, say 1% interest and then lends that money out to mortgagees and charges, say 3% on that.

So, EXACTLY the same thing could be said of savers - aibu to think that savers just want someone else to work to pay interest on their savings, because in effect that's what it is.

You could say it about any business really. Aibu to think that Tesco want someone else to work to pay for their profits?

Pisssssedofff · 15/09/2016 11:19

They can't get a mortgage hence they are renting it until they can.

I think I said repeatedly it's not a situation I'm comfortable with. There was not an option to sell, it would have been repossessed and then the only winners were the banks. The only slightly less moral than btl in most people's opinion.

Original poster
madhurjazz · 15/09/2016 11:21

Right I'm out. Hiding this thread. Back onto the stupid food tesco argument again.

There isn't a shortage of food or laws to prevent the supply of food and there is lots of completion. Stupid argument.

OP posts:
Pisssssedofff · 15/09/2016 11:21

The other thing that I find pretty amazing is that if you can't get a mortgage I don't see how the hell you get a rental property these days given the amount of deposit required and immaculate credit history

NNChangeAgain · 15/09/2016 11:30

There was not an option to sell, it would have been repossessed and then the only winners were the banks.

Really? So you are fleecing some poor tenants who can't get a mortgage, dangling the offer of selling the house to them, in order to pay your own mortgage - because the alternative is that the lender reclaims the value of the money you borrowed from them?

RebelandaStunner · 15/09/2016 11:34

Thing is most people who want to buy a house, eventually do. Where do they live until then? At home (not always possible or they rent.)
We did. Nothing immoral about it. What's the problem?
One of our houses didn't appeal to ftb because it was a repo - a cash purchase, money had to be available in a couple of weeks.

helpitsmyfirst · 15/09/2016 11:43

You sound extremely bitter, it's not about luck or when you was born.
Me and my partner worked very hard and we have two properties with a small mortgages, we are making a future for our two children and anymore we have in the future. Is there a reason why you can't get a mortgage? Perhaps you have bad credit because you didn't live within your means?
You sound like its people that have properties fault that others can't afford it.
Grow up and if you really want a house of your own, go out and work hard for it, don't expect stuff to be handed to you on a plate!!

Pisssssedofff · 15/09/2016 11:47

NN - just as every land lord is doing fleecing their tenants, being fleeced myself but at least I a) call it as it is and b) my tenants have light at the end of the tunnel, they know their kids won't be moving house and school because much as it would help me massively to release my equity like NOW I made a deal, gave them 2 years security and if they have the money then the house is theirs.

Nobody wants the banks to win, well nobody with any sort of intelligence or soul which may or may not be whom I'm dealing with in this scenario

NNChangeAgain · 15/09/2016 11:52

Nobody wants the banks to win, well nobody with any sort of intelligence or soul

But you are the one saying that you believe that letting out your home is immoral.

If people like yourself stopped letting out their homes in order to maintain moral integrity, then that would result in more homes being repossessed, surely?

Pisssssedofff · 15/09/2016 11:58

I'm not saying I'm different because of course I'm not somebody else saved my Arse and I will do my best to repay them. The land lords that but up the first time buyers houses forcing them to rent and put their plans on hold are the ones most people have an issue with as you well know.

As for bitter, yeah I hope the op is bitter and I hope they and others get angry and bitter and start kicking up a huge fuss and something gets done. Ideally flood the market with affordable homes. I don't want ordinary people to loose money either, if they've worked hard and put their money into property because pensions have been such bad investments that needs addressing.