Cant live on 50k? (article)

[BlancheBlue]

I know these sort of things are designed to annoy and are probably twisted but families with £50k + income complaining about "no foreign holidays" and "oh my god I buy clothes in supermarkets" need to realise they are pretty lucky

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-3759081/Why-families-earning-50-000-broke-end-month-figures-say-couldn-t-pay-unexpected-bill-500-four-explain-money-goes.html

being on an above average income in the UK doesn't comfortably allow families to save for the odd luxury like a non UK holiday

Depends on what you see as 'luxury' or a 'comfortable holiday'. I personally spent more £££ on 4-day 'holiday' in London (well, pricey event included but very scabby hotel), than 10-day in Morocco (flying Easy Jet).
Its all down to preferences. Some people openly express that flying budget airlines is for 'plebs'.

Not sure why multiple posts about them having gym memberships but buying second hand clothes for the DC. Doesn't seem to be an obvious link between the two. There are lots of reasons why gym membership and exercise might be a worthwhile investment, especially for the woman training to be a yoga teacher, and second hand clothes are greener. Plenty of people who could afford new still opt to get more use out of preloved stuff.

And gillybeanz the problem with your views on childcare is that they're very short term. It's valid to look at things only in terms of current costs if that's what you want, but other people need to consider how they'll get back to earning an income once SAHing ceases to be the cheaper option. For many, staying in work will be more cost effective over the long run, thus making SAHing the luxury even if childcare costs a full salary or more. It depends so much on circumstances. I would also imagine long term planning is the reason why the ML family are still incurring childcare costs: might not be a place available once she goes back to work.

To be honest we are in a similar situation, joint income of about £55k but we live in the most expensive city to live in in England (not London as we don't get the London waiting etc!!). Rent is £1400 for a basic 3 bed, I have a 17 year old ds and a six year old daughter and have to use wrap around care for the youngest at school which costs £60 a week just to work full time. Holidays are a nightmare and childcare for that costs around £160 a week.
We have no family near us and so cannot use them, and we have a night out once a year when we visit grandparents....

Council tax £150 a month, gas and electric £80 a month, water £45, car permit for at home is £60 a year, car tax and insurance for a £500 car is £60 a month, petrol £100 a month, bus fares for all around £40-60 a month, groceries to include special food as youngest has allergies is around £400-500 a month.... Mobiles (x3) broadband, Virgin tv and Netflix comes to about £140 a month total....

I feel extravagant paying £27 a month for dds swim lessons plus £30 a term for beavers and £50 a term for dance lessons but to be honest she is a bit hyperactive and these help provide routine and discipline

We can't afford to save for a house deposit, a new car or holidays but we manage day to day, wouldn't cope with an unexpected bill though and it's so frustrating that so much of our income has to go on housing and childcare!!

Looking at someone income alone is not enough to make judgements like some people have.....

Was feeling really judgey because we manage fine on 50k year. But then I realised only one of us works. If we had to pay childcare we'd be fucked!

The first couple need to have a close look at their bills, we run a B&B and including all the extra people going through our house our outgoing are just under £1k a month, for council tax, oil, electricity, tv licence, phone etc, we don't have sky,

My violin's broke, sorry
There are hard working people out there having to go to food banks.

it's all part of the same problem, if people on almost double national average are just getting by day to day without being extravagant (and going to a gym should not = an extravagent lifestyle!! unless it's a £300 month gym!!) then no wonder lower income workers have to rely on food banks

instead of them&us-ing, can't we see that we're all in the same boat here whether we're on under average income, average income, or above average income. Housing and childcare is breaking us all in varying degrees.

Sky can actually be a pretty savvy way of spending a smallish entertainment budget if that's what you like. There'd have to be a few of you and/or you'd have to be pretty into telly, but if those conditions are met it isn't a great deal of money in return for a lot of enjoyment.

I remember a few years back, DH and I used to enjoy watching football, but when we moved into a new place without Sky we used to go to the pub to watch matches not shown on terrestrial instead as we didn't know anyone locally. At one point, I worked out the cost of a couple of pints each however many times a month it was, and Sky Sports would actually have been cheaper! These days we do have it and we're getting rid.

I wouldn't say 50k a year was lucky! They work had and have a moderate income.

All I thought when I saw that article was, if the 'average' income is £26k per person, and the household income is £50k, surely they're £2k below where they should be?

And not the aspirational/middle class/high earning bollox the DM was burbling on about??

As for foodbanks, i work at a charity. You wouldn't believe how many people who come are just plain cheeky.
For example, they'd take bags full of tinned food, and when we ask 'how'd you get all of that home?" They'd say "don't worry, we already called a taxi"
Knowing what a taxi costs -- you could get a very decent shopping, not foodbank donations.

Knowing what a taxi costs -- you could get a very decent shopping, not foodbank donations.

It would cost £3 for me to get a private hire from my local foodbank to the front door.

Can you tell me where I'd get a "very decent shopping" for that??

Cos I will go there poste haste.

We know their home addresses. The taxi would cost £10-15. Really. Go to a local supermarket and get much better than tinned beans. Really what you can get from a foodbank is a pittance. But i understand that people have MH issues + addictions, afterall, we opperate on basis of trust. We can't 'know' if a person really has no food, or they just like freebies just because they can. Even if its obvious.

People can't fucking win can they?

If they have a car, they can't be poor
if they don't have a car and need a taxi to get their food home, they shouldn't use a food bank..

We know their home addresses. The taxi would cost £10-15. Really. Go to a local supermarket and get much better than tinned beans

Yeah? that makes no sense, because they'll still need to get the food home.. on top of what the food costs… so it would bring it up to £30 as opposed to £15 which they might not have!
and no not everyone can bus/walk, despite your personal assessment of them at the food bank - ever heard of hidden disabilities?

Randy, we spend that much on God for the two of us - not including the meals out. No lobsters at home I'm afraid

We can't 'know' if a person really has no food, or they just like freebies just because they can

So how do you suggest they get bags and bags of shopping home if they have no car and calling a taxi is the ultimate faux pas?

Nick a trolley from the local store? They'd still have to put £1 in the slot first. Imagine what they could get in the Aldi "about to expire" shelf for a whole £1!

Hyacinth

I understand that my view is short term, but it's a choice isn't it.
You can't make a choice that costs you money i.e a full salary and then moan about it.
Of course it's each to their own, and down to circumstances, for us it was more financially beneficial long term to have a sahp, we would have lost thousands with both working. It sounds like the first couple are similar.

^i meant food

I guess all the article shows is 'don't have 3 children and live in the SOuth East on joint income of £50k and expect a high quality lifestyle'

I have 3 children in London and household income would have to be around £85k to have a decent lifestyle

It's a choice gilly, except when it isn't. Some people earn more than the costs of childcare whilst also having no choice but to work and pay for it because the household needs the extra they bring in as opposed to SAHing. Others the opposite.

Not sure you can make a call either way about whether the couples lose money by continuing work based on the info in the article either. Not enough to go on.

I felt really sorry for then regarding the comments on the daily mail. They were making out that they were complete spendthrifts. A lot of comments were from folk with similar salaries but no children. I thought that was hilarious. Before children we saved £1k a month no problem. Now we as childcare into the mix, and reduce my salary as I'm going to work 4 days, then add in the cost of milk and nappies; no Longer quite so flush.

I guess the trick is to do the article for a few extra £££ for mat leave or whatever, then don't look at the comments!

Over a grand on utilities... Not including gym or car?! And the cars costing £600 plus they use public transport on top, boo hoo! You're too stupid to budget and whinging about it in the daily mail! I could bore everyone with a breakdown of how much my central London living costs, which seems somehow to be way cheaper than all of theirs, but uughhhhh.... Oh and the ones that spend over £600 a month on food but can't afford meat??!! How? I spend £400 for five of us, all mega eaters, all organic, tonnes of meat, but yes it's Asda. These people are in the same category as those frustrating families on 'live well for less'. So annoying

I agree that this is a cost of childcare issue more than anything.

We used to live in London with small kids on a similar salary and it was the childcare costs which crippled us. As the children moved to primary school age it became so much easier.

In Denmark full time childcare costs are capped at about £400 per month with lower income families paying even less and the childcare is professional and excellent. That's what is needed in the uk.

They're exaggerating their costs. Nobody spends £20 a month on guinea pig food unless they're running a guinea pig sanctuary. Makes me disbelieve the other totals.