To think you should have to demonstrate a basic understanding of the facts before being allowed to vote

[Bearbehind]

Ok, I appreciate this is purely hypothetical is it could never be enforced but, it does astound me when a proportion of the electorate, albeit hopefully small, are so clueless they come out with comments like I've seen this morning which included:-

-Looking forward to doing some online shopping for items from the USA as they'd be cheaper now the pound has dropped

-Being surprised that the markets have fallen following the vote to leave and not realising their vote would have that effect

-Thinking this decision might pave the way for Norway to hold a referendum to leave the EU too

It's bad enough we all have to filter through the outright lies, like the money saved on the EU which would go straight to the NHS, and the scarcity of facts but people making decisions when their basic understanding is so poor is downright scary.

Yes red but unfortunately no one can be forced to do their own research, thoroughly read election mail/leaflets nor watch debates or attend hustings. I do my own research & have been a very active campaigner in the past but my vote, my informed vote, is no more important than someone who just rocks up on the day and puts an x in a box. We all know this idea is a non starter but I feel the thought process behind it is just wrong. This is my opinion which obviously differs from some but it's still as valid to me as much as yours is to you.

mummymeister Not sure if you're misunderstanding or being deliberately difficult. First of all this is hypothetical so it's not going to happen. So don't panic.

Second, we're saying that they should show understanding of the issue at hand, not of everything in general. They won't be quizzed on their maths, or their world history, or their foreign languages. It would be "are you aware of the consequences?" - is that terrible? There really are a lot of people who voted Leave because they didn't understand (and I have no doubt there were Remainers who didn't understand also - it's just that they're not getting any attention because their vote didn't win) and are waking up with huge regrets, shock and now worry because they're finally realising the consequences of what they voted for. Don't you think they should have known before they voted for the future of every other person in the country?

No not mine - I don't intend to stand for any kind of office - in fact I don't even live in the uk any more - I did vote though

If you're happy to have your lives decided by people who did it for 'lolz' or didn't think their vote would count, or that the leave campaign didn't mean actually leaving - well good luck to you, you're going to need it

So, off you trot little brexiters, don't let the door hit your arse on the way out

Ok - have your life ruled by people who don't give a shit

my vote, my informed vote, is no more important than someone who just rocks up on the day and puts an x in a box

I guess, to me, this is just where we have to agree to disagree. Because I don't think this should be the case. Of course it is, but I disagree with it.

I researched a lot, talked a lot, read up a lot, as I always do for other votes, but I still didn't feel confident enough in my decision to vote either way. I didn't feel I understood everything and to me, that meant I shouldn't be voting either way. Obviously others feel differently but do we really want the uninformed people who don't understand a thing about politics running our country? The thought seems utterly bizarre to me.

It perfectly highlights the 'slippery slope' concept...

I agree, which is why I wouldn't support something like this happening if it were real. It would undoubtedly end up cutting out more and more people. So to be clear in general, I don't support this idea in practice. I do, however, support it in theory, or the idea of everyone being educated in the first place (a girl can dream).

All of this has always been hypothetical but I fundamentally disagree that it is ok to pitch up at a polling station with no fucking clue about what you are voting on and what the implications are.

Those who fought for our rights to vote sure as shit don't do so in order for us to be so blasé about how we used them.

I'd love to hear an attempt to defend the vote of a person who now openly admits they didn't realise what their vote would mean?

I think a better issue would be how to combat a general lack of understanding of politics and economics. I am a primary school teacher and it's not something we touch upon as often as we perhaps should in the curriculum. Also, I feel the press has a role to play in this. I appreciate that a non-partisan press is part of our culture but it seems that the print media in particular presents political news in such a skewed fashion that it can be really hard to develop a basic understanding of the facts. The Daily Mail has a big readership and has run a doggedly anti-EU agenda for years and years.
If we are going to allow the electorate to vote on fundamental issues that affect the future of the nation, then there ought to be better access to proper, unbiased information.

I am sure there are many well-informed Brexit voters out there, but I can only go on what I was told today. Every person who voted out told me it was because of immigration, including things such as 'we've got to stop these people coming over here and beheading people.' Immigration is obviously an issue that people are passionate about but there is little open debate about it.

Our democratic system is right to include everyone, but we should all be able to make an informed vote.

A referendum is just this a view of the people. Government don't actually have to act on it.

Doesn't matter if you think their view is one of incomprehension, their view is exactly that - their view.

So whilst I don't think "they never give us votes at Eurovision" is a good reason to say no, at a referendum it doesn't matter that was that persons view and they had it and that is the very real reality of a referendum. The same as another thread details how happy people are they get the old style passport back ffs.

And now in my view, were in the shit big time.

every person who voted, voted on their understanding - how can you not defend a persons right to vote how they wish?

Otherwise it would not be a free voting system and equally as wrong

I think a better issue would be how to combat a general lack of understanding of politics and economics.

I agree. Children aren't educated young enough, they're not introduced to and interested in it enough, and the skills necessary to form unbiased opinions are developed far too late. This is a huge failing of our current educational system that should be addressed but probably won't.

every person who voted, voted on their understanding - how can you not defend a persons right to vote how they wish?

Because their understanding isn't enough. We don't let anyone take part in an open heart surgery, or constructing a bridge, or any other task that requires significant knowledge in one particular area. But when it comes to something that will affect every single person in the UK and abroad? Nah, minimal knowledge is fine.

But that is not our political system is built is it?

Should we say people must pass a test before giving the right to vote? You may as well go back to the time women weren't allowed to vote because their little brains couldn't understand it!

every person who voted, voted on their understanding

No they didn't.

Social media and the papers are awash with stories about fuckwits who are now staying they had no clue what they were doing and what the implications would be.

If they had truly voted for what they believed in, with the understanding of the potential downsides, I would never have started this thread.

I think that the media and politicians are the ones who bear the responsibility here.

They've got away with, what is, quite frankly bullshit. On both sides.

And now we pay the price.

They did vote on their understanding, whether that was media led, education led or from a discussion with their families they voted based on their understanding of the situation.

I don't like the outcome at all, but you can't just decide who is able to vote based on their intelligence no more than you can decide based upon their gender.

What should happen IMO is that voting on a referendum should be a legal requirement, in Australia voting is a legal requirement.

30% of people didn't bother to vote

If their understanding was 'I had no idea what was going on so just did what Fred said' that can hardly be defined as 'understanding'.

If it is what is classed as 'understanding' then we are all fucked.

Noone can defend the decision of people who now admit themselves they didn't know what they were doing and regret their choice.

Yes you can defended it because it is the pinnacle of our voting system.

You don't have to like it

But you can defended it, because a referendum is the view of the people and if Fred and his mates don't want to be a part of the EU for what ever reason that is Fred's and his mates right to vote in what ever way they feel on that particular moment in that voting booth

And I would ask why you feel that your so intelligent and wise to the workings of the world that you have the right to tell anyone else how they should vote in a referendum?

What do you think you did that was so amazing that you had the right to vote but the person who voted because of their reasons did not have that right?

And how many people conversely did equally little research and voted to stay in? Was their vote also wrong?

According to the OP - no you are not allowed to have voted because you may not have passed this "test"

It absolutely infuriates me that a person can think it's ok to deny someone else's right to vote anyway they choose based on their very narrow minded view of what they think should enable someone to vote.

I think their was a massive failure by remain to explain things

What was Cameron going to do? Say, oh the reason the NHS is screwed is because it's a low priority for us, the reason your children can't get a school place is because of Gove's social experiment, the reason you can't afford housing is because building affordable housing is a low priority for us?

Explaining things was a bit tricky, frankly.