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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Friends DH

45 replies

Flatoutnautilus · 15/06/2016 13:03

Dear All,

A lovely friend of mine has married a man I think has overstepped the boundaries of nice adult behaviour towards kids and I just want to gauge whether I'm being unreasonable. Ok so first incident on holiday with their family. Two of my kids in sandpit, two of theirs. Friend away shopping in village so just me and friends DH. Bit of argy bargy from all children - the usual, it was hot, they had been playing happily together all morning (age range 2 - 7). Nothing out of ordinary. My tactic was "why don't you play in that corner, you share the truck, how about this, let's take turns etc etc". They were all at it but mine no more than his when he says something to my seven year old. Seven year old goes rather quiet and friends dear husband gets closer. Repeats question (louder). And then says "what's wrong mini flat out - are you deaf or something ?!' In rather loud intimidating-if-you-are-a-small-boy-and you're-being-confronted-by-a-strange-large tall-dad-sort-of-way. I was quite shocked especially as a) they were all being fractious b) I was and think it's very important to be even handed when in a situation with your own and others DC.
I didn't say anything at the time but for my DS (who is in contrast to my little more feisty one is a very gentle little boy really) it really coloured the holiday. Especially as dear friends husband then competed with him grabbing toys in pool just as my DS would go to dive for them. I was . My husband is not enamoured of dear friends husband so after holiday we gently reassured my DS that we wouldn't be going on holiday with them anytime soon when he bought it up (I think he was slightly worried).
I didn't make a big deal of it but I did tell him I had noted it and explained that every family has different rules and sometimes our rules and way we speak to each to each other might be a bit different. Second incident was in a pool of shared friends house. Youngest son (mine) chucking small floats out of pool. Rather annoying as they rolled in the garden but not the end of the world. Lots of kids having a great time etc. Observed by dear friends husband. I told my son not to do it as me and friend wrangled kids, chatted and calmly picked up floats. My son then said from pool "but they're annoying me!" (He is 4.5). Dear friends husband overhead this. Stood up and went over to him and said very aggressively "I don't give a damn if they're annoying you!" I was again especially as my son was then distracted and happily playing with his daughter in about 5 second.
The children all get along really well but I find my lovely lovely friends husband just weirdly agresssive. Friends children are lovely but perhaps more passive low key than mine but on these occasions both mine were not doing anything outrageous or mean or particularly naughty. Any views greatly appreciated as my friend has raised invite to joint holiday again. I've never mentioned it before and (to give context) she often tells me how her other close friends don't like her husband. I've always remained silent as I don't want to hurt her feelings & these were momentary incidents (although I think in the first example it did lead to my older son feeling very wary).

OP posts:

fishnoses · 15/06/2016 14:27

I think you should have addressed this calmly on holiday at the time of the incident. I would have addressed him calmly in front of the children advising that you do not find that reaction acceptable or useful. It would have shown your kids that he was unreasonable, that you did not condone it, and also that aggression is not needed.

In terms of the new holiday, im not surprised your friend wants an ally with her. If you and your family would like to go, then ground rules about how he talks to your kids needs to be established prior to booking. You need to know that he has agreed with them too.

shiveringhiccup · 15/06/2016 14:38

Yanbu to not go ok the holiday - and you already promised your son that you wouldn't go again.

Agree with PP that if this is what he is like in public to a child he doesn't know well in front of their parent, it doesn't bode well for what he is like at home behind closed doors to your friend and her children. Sounds like a good idea to very gently open the conversation about this.

whois · 15/06/2016 14:42

I agree with PPs that she is trying to open up dialogue about her husband. I think a gentle conversation and find out how he acts around her and her children would be good.

You also need to be honest and say there have been a couple of incidents where you felt he was overly aggressive towards your children, and you don't think going on holiday together is a good idea.

akated · 15/06/2016 14:44

RunnerOnTheRun my DH is a policeman but he wouldn't speak to ours or any other children like that, surely it's a character flaw not what you do for a living that would make you so aggressive towards young children, plenty of Mum's and dads are great parents who also happen to be officers and sometimes the job and what they have to deal with can make them appreciate their families more.

Going back to the OP if you and your children don't feel comfortable going on holiday with him don't go you will unfortunately have to have that conversation with your friend.

girlinacoma · 15/06/2016 14:51

I do think that you are going to have to have a gentle word with your friend.

They are young now but in a few years time there will be invitations for sleepovers etc which I think you should avoid.

TheWindInThePillows · 15/06/2016 14:52

Absolutely don't go away with them again, your husband doesn't want to anyway.

Definitely talk with your friend about what she is hinting at, friends not liking her husband, him being a bit aggressive.

The situations you say, it's hard to say whether he's super aggressive or just a frank speaking person who would say if annoyed by little kids. I have a friend whose husband is sometimes pretty direct (e.g. tells my kids to stop doing something in a slightly annoyed way if they are doing something wrong)- but he's like that with his own children and a very good and involved dad, just one that tends to get annoyed quite easily.

I still wouldn't go away with them, whatever the situation.

girlinacoma · 15/06/2016 14:59

Just to add, rather than just have a word with your friend, is there anyway you can include them both in the chat.

If you're friends on Facebook with them both however then maybe a group chat with them both (add your DH too) and explain why to both of them.

In situations like this it tends to be left to the women/wives to placate and smooth things over but it's not fair on your friend to put her in this position to be honest. It's her husband who is behaving like a bastard and he needs to know it.

Not only should he be apologising to you and your DH but to his wife too for putting her in such an awful position.

So a group chat along the lines of...

Hi both, thanks so much for the invite for a joint holiday again. As much as it is lovely to spend time together with the kids, we felt that xxxxx was unnecessarily aggressive towards our two children on the last holiday so for that reason we won't be organising another joint holiday ....

etc etc

Try to avoid this becoming 'wife work' and get your DH and hers involved too.

They can go and slug it out on the streets the old fashioned way of they are so inclined

expatinscotland · 15/06/2016 15:01

I'd tell her the truth. 'Sorry, but no to holidaying together. We find your husband overly aggressive with the children.'

whois · 15/06/2016 15:17

Try to avoid this becoming 'wife work' and get your DH and hers involved too.

WHAT?

There are insinuations he might be agressive at home, and you want a frank cponversation in front of him? noooooo

KoalaDownUnder · 15/06/2016 15:32

God, don't do some group text thing.

Just decline further invitations. He is a bully with a short fuse - why subject your children to that?

And have a quiet word with your friend, to make sure she's okay. I wouldn't mind betting he's an even bigger bully behind closed doors.

TreadSoftlyOnMyDreams · 15/06/2016 15:34

Hi both, thanks so much for the invite for a joint holiday again. As much as it is lovely to spend time together with the kids, we came away feeling that our parenting styles are incompatible [While we appreciate that when the kids are all together and hyped up they can get quite annoying on occasion, we did not agree with the aggressive and intimidating response from X ]. It's made the children quite nervous about another joint holiday in future and so we have to regretfully decline the invite.

Square brackets optional. Verbal better than in writing as it is likely to kick off.

RebeccaWithTheGoodHair · 15/06/2016 15:42

Maybe in your world "address" means get aggressive. But it doesnt in mine. Its perfectly possible to address someone about inappropriate behaviour without sinking to their level.

And said he was behaving like a cunt? No that's not aggressive at all. I can't have seen that escalating, especially when dealing with someone like this man

Arkhamasylum · 15/06/2016 16:15

I think I would decline by telling her that your son is frightened of her husband. If you say he's aggressive, there may be an argument about 'parenting styles'. Just forget it. Your son wouldn't enjoy it, therefore, why would you put him through that?

The husband sounds like a horrible bully.

Sassypants82 · 15/06/2016 16:45

Agree with Ops, I absolutely would decline & be gently honest with your friend as to why. I would not put my children in a position where he could be aggressive towards them ever again.

MrsSpecter · 15/06/2016 16:55

And said he was behaving like a cunt? No that's not aggressive at all. I can't have seen that escalating, especially when dealing with someone like this man

Yes he was behaving like a cunt. Are you assuming i was suggesting she say "oi! Cunt, shaddap?"

Rainbunny · 15/06/2016 18:29

I'd just reply to the offer "Thank you for your kind invite, I'm afraid we can't join you this time." Or something to that effect and leave any further explanation for an in person chat. As to talking to your friend about her husband I'd probably just be honest and say that "My child is scared of him and I wasn't comfortable with his overly aggressive disciplining of the children. I understand that parents have different approaches but my child is scared to be around him and I'm not going to ignore that." Hopefully you can still see your friend and her children.

Original poster

Flatoutnautilus · 15/06/2016 22:32

Thanks all for your responses. My friend is pretty happy in her marriage so no, I don't need to intervene on that front.

Re' why I didn't say something for first and second incident. First incident : I was just rather gobsmacked as I wouldnt dream of talking to my friends kids like that. But when I recovered myself I observed my son stubbornly ignoring said husband and started chatting to DS instead to make him feel ok. Then we discussed it afterwards. I was rather arms length from that point on. Second time it was said in the context of a lively poolside with friends. I think I was probably the only adult who heard it. My son was in the pool. He is pretty staunch and was having such a good time that he didn't seem perturbed. I made mental note about his character and resolved to keep my kids away (play dates with just my friend etc). We have avoided dinner dates with them as a couple.
I think there is something about my two he doesn't like. They are pretty kind kids and not bratty (I hope as I'm reasonably insistent on good behaviour). But they are free spirits and he is ex army. x

OP posts:

Susiebearlove · 15/06/2016 22:39

Just say no and say your children felt intimidated by the way her husband spoke to them. Say you want them to enjoy themselves on holiday and if they need to be parented, then you are the ones to do it not DH (which I assume means dick head in this conversation)

Yambabe · 15/06/2016 22:55

and he is ex army

And there we have it. Ex-army and no kids of his own right?

He is a bully and nobody has ever called him on it.

Your call, but in your shoes I would tell my friend that we didn't want to go on holiday with them and I'd tell her why.

Maybe her and her kids will give him the family experience he has never had and he will mellow. More likely you will be the one picking up the pieces of her broken heart in a few years time when her DC are old enough that he can justify getting physical with them.......

TheStoic · 16/06/2016 01:26

If you are accurately describing the situations then your DC are being g bullied by this man and you are standing by saying nothing! How will your DC feel about that?

However that said the description of his reaction to the pool toys incident sounds like a man at the end of his tether with an annoying child. It could be as simple as a difference of opinion regarding behaviour standards.

Yeah so either way - it's your fault, OP.

I'd just avoid all contact with the husband, and only explain why to my friend if she asks. You giving constructive feedback is unlikely to make this man change his behaviour.

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