Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2 3

Original poster

To report a colleague...

73 replies

SpanglyBirds · 21/05/2016 20:37

....for benefit fraud, not just because its wrong, but also because I personally dislike her?

I have concrete evidence that fraud is being committed (has been for around 2 years+) but it just seems sort of childish to do it, when I know my reasons are not solely altruistic.

This colleague is such a nasty, lazy, entitled arsehole that I want to go ahead and report and write it off as karma biting her in the butt. On the other hand I'm not sure I'd be so quick to shop any of my other lovely colleagues.

I don't know... AIBU?

OP posts:

AugustaFinkNottle · 22/05/2016 12:58

It is wrong, no matter who is doing it, but anyone else I'd probably be having a quiet word along the lines of- 'I know you are doing this, we both know its wrong etc......

Why would you have a quiet word with someone else you knew to be going to a lot of trouble to carry out a very deliberate fraud?

And why do you think investigation would be impossible? Surely it's child's play for an investigator to check the dates when she claims her children were using the clubs and the dates when she got company transport to take them home? And they could also check with the people running the clubs?

AlpacaLypse · 22/05/2016 13:06

Surely there must be a way of contacting manager without going through her? Home address?

Could you ring up DWP and ask their advice?

LunaLoveg00d · 22/05/2016 13:09

If it makes any difference the evidence shows that she has been using company systems to produce fictitious invoices and register entries to claim childcare payments from tax credits.

That's not jut benefit fraud, it's gross misconduct and could get her sacked too.

Stupid woman. I would definitely report her.

littledrummergirl · 22/05/2016 13:09

If you know and say nothing you become complicit. You need to higher up the chain in work and report to hmrc. You can tell each of them that you have alerted the other and then hopefully one of them will investigate.

How will it look on your record if you are dismissed for being complicit in fraud when it comes out? It will come out because it always does.

LunaLoveg00d · 22/05/2016 13:15

So I think my mind is made up. I'm not going to report anything to anyone. It's not worth the risk IMO. I'll just have to manage the guilt at doing the wrong thing and worry that I could end up implicated.

Having read further and seen that what she is doing is proper fraud by altering company invoices and records, this is a legal matter not just a benefit fraud matter. Does your organisation have a whistleblowing policy? They should have and it's designed to protect people in your position. You HAVE to flag this up to senior management. Do it anonymously if you have to but when she gets found out by auditors and it's discovered you knew but said nothing, you're sacked for gross misconduct too. And potentially facing a police grilling if the fraud has lost the company money or defrauded the tax payer.

This has nothing to do with spite - reporting this has everything to do with covering your own arse and protecting your job and income.

BrieAndChilli · 22/05/2016 13:23

If she has altered company records to show she is 'paying' the company but then not actually paying any cash then the company accounts are going to be wrong. When the accounts get audited this will be flagged up, and the company will get j to trouble. Who does the accounts? Maybe you could give them your eveidence Andy could take it further?

bearleftmonkeyright · 22/05/2016 13:30

Put the benefit issue to one side. Fraudulently producing invoices has serious implications for the senior management. Altering the register to say that a child has been in attendance would result in serious implications for a primary school. I doubt Ofsted would be impressed. You cannot let her get away with this. I would be furious as a parent using your service if this came to light and would seriously question the integrity of your organisation. You must blow the whistle.

MangosteenSoda · 22/05/2016 13:34

Isn't there some kind of fraud line you can call to report your suspicions?

I assume the reason you don't like her is because she's a nasty piece of work who plays every situation and the system for her own ends while bullying anyone who gets in her way. I wouldn't feel bad about reporting someone like that.

I would, however, report it as suspicions. I think my colleague is doing XYZ and these are the reasons why

Valentine2 · 22/05/2016 13:39

I would report because it's a crime. Doesn't have anything to do whether you hate her or not

FirstWeTakeManhattan · 22/05/2016 13:45

Well, at least you were honest, OP

It's primarily a work issue and yes, you should report asap.

herecomethepotatoes · 22/05/2016 13:48

Luna

Try reading back your post and see f there's anything that seems a bit off to you.

"Having read further and seen that what she is doing is proper fraud by altering company invoices and records, this is a legal matter not just a benefit fraud matter."

LunaLoveg00d · 22/05/2016 13:54

I know that benefit fraud is illegal and proper fraud ;-)

I was trying to say in a clumsy way that it's not just the Benefit Fraud that is going on, it's altering invoices and defrauding the company too which complicates the matter and makes it a lot worse.

I don't think the OP has much choice in this and her personal feelings for the colleague don't come into it. She HAS to report it.

MardleBum · 22/05/2016 13:57

Given the circumstances of the fraud you describe I would not hesitate to shop her.

MardleBum · 22/05/2016 13:58

YY, it isn't just benefit fraud, it's company fraud as well. She will probably get the sack. But she should have thought about that before she did it.

Hissy · 22/05/2016 14:01

If I were you, I'd request a meeting with senior management.
Bypass the gatekeeper. Refuse to discuss it with anyone except the head of the business or at least senior Hr or accounts

This is defrauding your company and if it comes to light that you knew and did nothing, you're almost as guilty as she is.

The company can look into this, discipline her and they will be under pressure to report her too as it can come back on them that false accounts and records were kept.

MardleBum · 22/05/2016 14:03

That is excellent advice from Hissy tell management and let them be the ones to take it further. if they go to the police about the company fraud then perhaps the police will be the ones to press charges for the benefit fraud. You are well clear or any of it then.

Original poster

SpanglyBirds · 22/05/2016 14:05

Who does the accounts?...Guess who? But as far as I know they do not show any payments in from this person and are all above board. They just don't match up with the electronic registers and invoices produced there from and marked as paid.

And the transport records do not show her children despite this being a regular and widely known (even by management) occurrence. That in itself is wrong and has led to some fairly serious problems in the past- other children 'bumped' from the list to make space and at least 2 occasions when it meant non-collection of children on the list. (I was responsible for arranging alternative transport in a hurry, on both occasions) Anyway responsibility for those lists lies with...guess who... once again, so they could potentially be altered if necessary I suppose.

Unless I do report, I can't see that anyone can prove I know about the tax credits stuff. I feel I'm better off getting out as soon as I can. I could in theory speak to a manager in person, but it would be difficult and past experience shows the manager thinks the sun shines out of colleague's arse, and will go to great lengths in her defence.

Above the manager, its only the exec committee and guess who (although I didn't think employees were allowed) sits on that committee as an observer/staff representative. Yeah, its obvious now, fingers in all the right pies. Reporting will open one hell of a can of worms and I personally don't feel safe enough to be the one doing that.

OP posts:

manicinsomniac · 22/05/2016 14:08

Last night I wrote out a long, wine-fuelled rant reply, detailing all the many horrible things she has done, the major problems (including at least 2 very serious ones relating to children

Wait, what?? Any concerns about fiddling books and benefits surely fades into significance compared to this. If this woman is putting the safety and wellbeing of children at risk, she absolutely must be reported somehow.

LunaLoveg00d · 22/05/2016 14:08

I personally don't feel safe enough to be the one doing that.

You have legal protection.

www.gov.uk/whistleblowing/what-is-a-whistleblower

Hissy · 22/05/2016 14:12

Ok. Print everything off and send copies to every single member of the Exec committee anonymously.

Disavow all knowledge. Perhaps the former disgruntled employee did it...

Or just get another job and THEN send the info to the board.

Original poster

SpanglyBirds · 22/05/2016 20:19

Regarding the problems relating to children's safety, I've already mention some of the detail of one of them on here- corning non-collection of a child from school. The other was the reason a former colleague made a complaint (amongst other things) about her, so management are fully aware of both. In both cases the problems were 'hushed up' to a certain extent and considered to be either accidental or caused by procedural failings rather than the fault of just one person (which it was, but no proof)

Also I'm not sure I could claim that colleague is actually defrauding the company (I wouldn't be surprised but, no evidence..)as what I know only shows benefit fraud. Yes company systems have benn used to do that, but its not the companies money she has obtained fraudulently, just the government's.

Anyway I've spoken to a friend about this all today. She knows of my colleague through other channels and has warned me to tread very carefully. However she is willing to report the benefit fraud herself on my behalf, though obviously leaving out any details that could be traced back to me.

OP posts:

RandomMess · 22/05/2016 20:30

I would try and find another job then reconsider reporting knowing that whether or not they do anything makes no difference to you. Just ensure you have your reference first!

The company is complicit in fraud because it is allowing it's software etc to produce fake childcare invoices for which that person then get tax credits. Wouldn't surprise me if she is running off other invoices for friends...

ToucheShay · 22/05/2016 20:44

she is willing to report the benefit fraud herself on my behalf this is a good idea.

The other thing you could do it gather evidence, and if you leave and have an exit interview, produce your evidence then.

On behalf of tax payers and children you should do something

Flip

1 2 3